Mental Health Bookclub discussion

In February our fiction topic is posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD). I have chosen Six of Crows by Leigh Bardugo.

This book is young adult fantasy set in Grishaverse (but it is not necessary to read Grisha trilogy as the characters and location is different). Six of crows is duology, part two is called Crooked Kingdom. So if you enjoyed the first book, you can read another :) Author has said that there will be third book, set many years later, but the first 2 books do have an ending so there is no cliffhanger really.

The plot revolves around a deadly heist and the crew who needs money. Every crewmember has his/her own traumatic past and well fleshed out characteristics. Be ready for unlikeable characters, but be also ready to cheer for them. This crew is the only thing that might stand between the world and destruction—if they don’t kill each other first.

Please use this thread to post questions and comments at any time.

Aloha,

I will pick it up at the library. Hopefully, soon.

Be well,
RM
🇺🇸🐾

I read this book in December and really liked it (5 stars rating and I don't give those out lightly).
At first, I was a bit skeptical since I don't find heists that fascinating but the characters grew on me slowly and midway of the book I was so anxious about their success/failure that I had to put the book down for a week. I cared too much! Never happened before :D
I adored the bantering between Wylan and Jesper, was intrigued by Nina and Matthias and lets not forget Kaz, the enigma.

You could say that everyone there has some form of PTSD, but one of them has it more prominently than others. Let me know, if you think the representation was accurate and if you liked the book.

Happy reading!

Di wrote: "I read this book in December and really liked it (5 stars rating and I don't give those out lightly).
At first, I was a bit skeptical since I don't find heists that fascinating but the characters ..."

I shall. I truly look forward to it! Hugsie baby in oven and you🤗🇺🇸💐🌺🐾 Hope baby, you and your husband are well.

^^ we are well. 3 months more to bake :)

Di wrote: "^^ we are well. 3 months more to bake :)"

OMG! Time is flying! Boy or girl?💐🌺🤗🇺🇸

Aloha All,

Not trying to overstep. How are folks liking this book?

Be well,
RM
🇺🇸🐾

Hello all! This is my first book read for the book club--woohoo! I found it really interesting that I started this book thinking a very obvious mental illness theme would be present. It wasn't until after I read the book that I had to look back and try to discover what certain characters may be experiencing, and I think that's pretty cool, because we aren't defined by our illnesses.

Has anyone experienced PTSD or gambling addiction or sensation (adrenaline) seeking who can say whether or not the author's representations were accurate? Is this an appropriate thing to ask?

-Katy Jo

Note- I am NOT a mental health professional in any shape. I do not have any degrees in this field.

PTSD

1)What from the books show signs that Kaz has PTSD besides his childhood trauma? Is there anything about his childhood trauma you wish to discuss? Do you think that Kaz has another illness?

2)Does Matthias have PTSD from being betrayed and held in a prison that makes Hades sound like a fun place? Or is another form of mental illness? Which do you feel?

3)Inej is a rape survivor. With all due respect, do you feel that she PTSD or any other mental illness?

I will be back to finish the rest.

Mahalo,
RM
🇺🇸🐾

Continue PTSD

4) Jesper has a gambling addiction. Do you this is PTSD? Why or Why not? What other mental illness can this be?

5)Does Nina Zenik show any sign of PTSD? Does she show signs of other mental illness? Which ones and why?

6) Does Wylan show any sign of PTSD because of the rumors of being caught in a ” sweaty romp” with on his tutors?

Aloha,

This article might help explain Jasper’s gambling problem. I am breaking into several posts to make it easier for folks to participate in. 🤠

https://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...


Mahalo,
RM
🐾🇺🇸

P. S I do not mean to overstep.

I finished the book late last night. I am behind with updating books reads, etc.

Anyway, these are just questions. No wrong or right for we always learning in life.

This is open all year. We understand life gets busy.

Before I say anything, how far is all? Again, not overstepping.

We look forward to your thoughts!

Mahalo,
RM
🇺🇸🐾

I started looking into Kaz's indications of PTSD, specifically during the moments when he froze up and struggled to get into the jail caravan, along with the issue he has touching people, especially without gloves on.

I was reading about PTSD when I wondered if OCD and PTSD often occur together--and from what I read it sounds like 30% do (and that when people come to doctors with OCD symptoms, they often aren't screened for PTSD or past trauma--hmm). I also tried to find a name for fear of touch and I came up with the term "haphnephobia," which can co-occur with both PTSD and OCD.

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/arti...

What do you all think?

I just wonder how Kaz was able to get on a boat without distress. You'd think water and the feeling of being trapped would trigger him somehow. Of course I understand that people don't choose their triggers.

-Katy Jo

So RM(Alwaysdaddygirl) asked a few questions and I’ll try to answer.

1) What from the books show signs that Kaz has PTSD besides his childhood trauma? Is there anything about his childhood trauma you wish to discuss? Do you think that Kaz has another illness?

Signs of PTSD: Kaz and his gloves and tendency not to trust anyone.
Katy Jo, I don’t think he has OCD, because we don’t really see repetitive behavior much. However, he definitely has obsessions of revenge. Not sure about compulsions – we didn’t see him compulsively washing hands several times. But i don't suffer from OCD nor am I an expert, so correct me if I'm wrong.

2) Does Matthias have PTSD from being betrayed and held in a prison that makes Hades sound like a fun place? Or is another form of mental illness? Which do you feel?

Matthias has to go through many traumatic events and betrayals, but it seems to me that he always managed to get reaccustomed and make the best out of a bad situation. He is driven by his goals and doesn't let anything stop him.

3) Inej is a rape survivor. With all due respect, do you feel that she PTSD or any other mental illness?

Inej has PTSD which is shown in the book when she walks by her previous workplace and feels panic. She also hates seeing her previous employer and feels trapped. Like Kaz she doesn't like to be touched.

4) Jesper has a gambling addiction. Do you this is PTSD? Why or Why not? What other mental illness can this be?

Don't think Jesper has PTSD since there was no singular traumatic event for his gambling addiction. He is just an addict.

5) Does Nina Zenik show any sign of PTSD? Does she show signs of other mental illness? Which ones and why?.

In my opinion, Nina doesn’t have PTSD, but she does develop an addiction later on.

6) Does Wylan show any sign of PTSD because of the rumors of being caught in a ” sweaty romp” with on his tutors? .

Wylan definitely has signs of suffering from abuse but honestly, I don’t think they are that well explained in the first book. And it is not because of some naughty time with tutors, it has to do with his relationship with his father.

Mahalo very much Katy Joe and Di! You both share some excellent points.

Katy Joe, I do not think Kaz has that. I am no expert on OCD. Mahalo for the article!

My apologies Di. I did not think that of Wylan. Thinking on what you said, it looks like Wylan is maybe slightly rebellious.

This book I give 2/5 stars. I did not read the first book. I explain later. Soon. Some reasons until then:

- The ending is terrible. Cliffhanger. There are a lot of unanswered questions. Again, I did not read book one.


Mahalo,
RM
🇺🇸🐾

Six of crows is book one, Crooked kingdom book 2- that's why there is cliffhanger between books. However, there is an ending in book 2.

Di wrote: "Six of crows is book one, Crooked kingdom book 2- that's why there is cliffhanger between books. However, there is an ending in book 2."

My apologies. Mahalo! I should have said that I have not the read the other books of Grishaverse
http://www.howtoread.me/grishaverse-b...

I still give this book 2 out of 5 stars. I normally like this stuff.

Kaz is one of the characters that has PTSD. Yes, he had a screw-up childhood. Let not forget, he 17 years old. What I see in Kaz more is those of psychopath.

He has violence issues- (One example) He cut a guys eye and treated him to talk by saying he will t. Lied to the guy that he will not harm him. Threw the guy off the ship in a manner that one will use when selecting what to have to eat.

The problem is that he does show emotions at times. So, that throws that out the water.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.psyc...


What do others think?

Mahalo,
RM
🇺🇸🐾

Actually, I agree. Kaz is not really likable - he is cruel and mean. And even when we find out why it doesn't justify the actions he takes. But we do understand him at least a bit.
He also doesn't really want to move on with his life, only revenge.

As for him being psychopath.. I disagree, I think he is a sociopath. reasons why:
1) we don't see him displaying psychopathic tendencies in childhood. Only after that traumatic event. So he wasn't born with those personality traits, environment made him.
2) he does form an emotional attachment to Inej
3) he does behave sometimes not in a calculated and planned manner- remember that scene in prison when he left Nina alone to go look for Pekka? Completely spontaneous and actually a bad decision for their mission. Also, that cruel scene with the eye, remember that person harmed Inej- the only one Kaz probably cares about so Kaz lost it. It didn't serve him any good, don't think teammates appreciated it either.
4) he does get nervous without his cane and gloves- they are like his security blanket.

But since he still is quite meticulous about his plans, he could be a mix of both sociopath and psychopath. It's fiction after all.

Very good points! Your right. It is fiction. However, with me. I expect more when dealing with mental illness. I am not saying you do not feel this way.

There this one interview where the author is talking about PTSD with Kaz. I do not care of it fiction or nonfiction, I want to see where the research is for PTSD if the author is going to be basing a character on PTSD or any metal illness.

I am not saying the author did not research it either. In the acknowledgements, the author acknowledges some books. I did not see a book especially for PTSD. I could be wrong. Maybe the other books the author mentions talk about PTSD. I have not read nor check out the books. Or maybe the person giving the research and personal experiences with PTSD want to keep their identity a secret due to mental illness stigma.


This book is a YA as we all know. I think for the teenagers with PTSD or any mental illness, it can be helpful for them to have as much as information as possible. Like you and others, I want to see suicide rate going down for teenagers with mental illness.😡🤬

https://www.nami.org/getattachment/le...


Am I being harsh with a 2 stars out of 5 stars? Maybe. I am that way with book reviews. It just who I am.

Mahalo,
RM
🇺🇸🐾

This thread is open all year. Feel free to join in.

Mahalo,
RM
🇺🇸🐾