Works of Thomas Hardy discussion

There’s some convoluted stuff going on here, but it makes for a good story and in the Thomas Hardy world, a sad but satisfying ending.

The stories will be getting shorter as my Kindle has the first 2 stories taking up 42% of the volume. This 8% length story had several twists in the tale that come on fairly quick in such a short short story. I found the developments very intriguing and satisfying. I did think the sought-after son was overly cruel in letting down the Marchioness. No good actors in this story, just flawed Hardy ones.

Agreeing with Brian, but I felt the son was making a just choice, preferring the more loving of the two "mothers". Not unlike the judgement of Solomon.

I think with this story we see the themes of the collection developing, elopements, forced marriages, unwanted pregnancies, illegitimacy ... treated with surprising frankness for a 19th century British author. Hardy's wit can create a humour that contrasts with the sadness of his story. The future "Marchioness of Stonehenge" (a very improbable title!) dragging her dead husband away reminds me a bit of a dark hollywood comedy -- "Don't tell mom, the babysitter's dead" for example.

We get a bit of insight into the narrators. The Dean recommending Robert South will be lost on most modern readers, but South was one of those 17th century divines, like Jeremy Taylor or William Chillingworth, who wrote numerous sermons in the grand prose of their time. The Dean likes the good old days when sermons really were sermons.

I'm surprised that Hardy's characters can get married so quickly. What happened to the Marriage Banns? Can anyone answer?

Alison, see my 2nd post in the first story,

https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

As for Lady Caroline, the details are so vague -- are we to assume they were properly married at all? But if they were, there could have been two visits, one to post the banns, the next to grab a couple of witnesses and conduct the marriage itself.

Thank you very much Brian. I had forgotten your first post. But I can see now how it all might have happened. I read along wondering if they had actually consummated the marriage, as Hardy doesn't say exactly (modern writers being quite adept at!) and then suddenly, 'this poor child that's coming to me'. I though for a moment there - more visitors (hehehe). So, my question answered. These elopements and marriages seem a quick 'moral' fix to having sexual encounters.

Lady Caroline isn't the most endearing of characters (narcissism perhaps, in it for the self gain) and I heard a much stronger moral condescension here by Hardy. Once again, the young handsome lover escapes, like Edmund Willowes, by death.

Alison wrote: "Thank you very much Brian.

While I do like to be thanked, it was Martin who re-posted the info on marriage timelines. Kudos to Martin for getting the info early on.

Aaaah, my sincerest apologies Martin! I was typing away, typing away, saying to myself 'must remember to say Martin, must remember to say Martin' and of course I said Brian. And didn't realise it until reading Brian's post now!...nothing more can be said..I'll slink away....in shame and embarrassment.

That's okay, Alison, I'm flattered to be mistaken for Brian.

Actually I've done a bit of "research" on this phrase from Chaucer:

"She had, in Chaucer's phrase, 'all the craft of fine loving' at her fingers' ends, and the young man, being of a readily-kindling heart, was quick to notice the tenderness in her eyes and voice."

(Of course, it is "research" that will certainly have been done before.)

I'd guessed it came from something in the Canterbury Tales, but "the craft of fine loving" is actually from the Prologue to the Legend of Good Women. Cupid, the god of love, takes Chaucer to task for having written negatively about love. His translation of the "Romance of the Rose" is anti-love, and his "Troilus and Cressida" has Cressida betray Troilus. Instead, he should use Alcestis for a model, who gave up her life so that her husband could live, and Cupid says of Alcestis,

For she taughte al the craft of fyn lovinge,
And namely of wyfhood the livinge,
And alle the boundes that she oghte kepe;
Thy litel wit was thilke tyme a-slepe.
But now I charge thee, upon thy lyf,
That in thy Legend thou make of this wyf,
Whan thou hast other smale y-maad before;
And fare now wel, I charge thee no more.

See https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Le...

Which I crudely paraphrase as,

She (Alcestis) taught all the skill of fine loving, how to live as a wife, and keep all the necessary boundaries. Meanwhile, Chaucer, your little wit just slept. But I charge you, on your life, to make something of this wife in your "Legend", when you have made something of other women of smaller note before. Farewell, I ask no more of you.

I did suggest earlier that Hardy may have modelled GND on Chaucer's "Legend". I have a book, Reading Chaucer's Poems by Bernard O'Donoghue, which says that this Prologue was a most loved piece of Chaucer's in the 19th century.