The Patrick Hamilton Appreciation Society discussion

Making my way from Dundee’s Dens Park laye afternoon yesterday (a scrappy but welcone 2-0 win) towards the railway station, and the obligatory pre-departure pint, I spotted a poster for this, and was horrified to see that last night was indeed the last night of the production.

https://dura-dundee.org.uk/2019/04/01...

I really must keep up to speed with what’s going on around me.

A pity about Albion’s defeat, Nigey, but it would have been fun while it lasted, I’m sure.

Yes, no shame in losing to Man City but Albion worked hard enough to get something out of the game. Sadly, hard working and industrious usually doesn't triumph against one of the most expensively assembled squads of all time. Back to the relegation dogfight now.

Plus, of course, quarter final last season, semi final this season, so - obviously - Final next...

Sorry to hear that you missed Gaslight. I really enjoyed seeing a production of the play a year or two back. It's still obvious to understand why it was such a massive theatrical hit for our man Patrick.

Today’s Guardian....

https://www.theguardian.com/stage/201...

Thanks David - very interesting


I saw a revival in Brighton a couple of years back with Keith Allen of all people in the role of the policeman

It was surprisingly good.

The play still works surprisingly well.

Here's a (not very good) review....
https://modishmale.com/2017/02/07/gas...

Crikey, there’s a writer who got The Bumper Family Sack Of Exclamation Marks for Festivus a decade ago.

Sadly, The Guardian link’s comments on Facebook has plunged straight to a shouting match along gender lines. Who’d have thought?

0240, Dombey and Son just about completed for the second time, Dexter Gordon on Spotify and no sign of sleep. The life of Riley’s distant cousin, Fitzriley the insomniac.

David wrote: "The life of Riley’s distant cousin, Fitzriley the insomniac"


:-)

With that plethora of delights I'm not surprised sleep feels unnecessary David

A propos my ongoing obsession with the POW experience from 1939-45, my current reading is Midge Gillies’s ‘The Barbed-Wire University’. Gillies relates how POWs, especially in Europe, dealt with the scourge of boredom, almost as debilitating for detainees as the lack of food.

In Oflag VIIB (Eichstätt, near Nuremberg), enterprising officers, with theatrical and classical music backgrounds, “put on more ambitious plays” - Noel Coward’s insipid ‘Post Mortem’ wasn’t terribly well received - “including ‘Gaslight’, a favourite in many camps”. Blimey.

Wonderful. Thanks David. It is still a great play and I can quite see how a POW version would be a fun diversion from the tedium.

How did they get hold of the scripts?

There were very good links with the UK via the Red Cross and universities (a good number of POWs studied for university awards whilst incarcerated), so they were able to obtain books, musical instruments etc. In some camps, Kommandanten were quite enlightened and made concessions (but not generally for theatrical costumery which ran the danger of being used to aid escape).

It was still a very tough and uncertain llfe, of course, especially in the Far East, but any distraction from the hardship and hunger was welcomed. We owe them gratitude.

Thanks David - and yes we do

A long long psycholigical discourse on gaslighting which appeared in my news feed today, and which credits our man’s drama in giving the behaviour a name. Having read quite a bit of it, it is insightful and seems free of extraneous technical terminology.

Good pic too.

https://aeon.co/amp/essays/what-gasli...

Thanks David - I've saved the article and will properly scrutinise it later today

Over on the Thomas Hardy Goodreads Group to which welcome life-saving jump leads have recently been applied, we are group-reading Tess Of The d’Urbervilles, chapter by chapter, one every day. It’s a very good way to get discussion going.

One of our number has referred to Tess as being gaslit in Chapter X, so I wasted no time in claiming Our Man’s credit for gaslighting’s now-popular use as a term for psychological manipulation. In so doing, I also put a marker down for Mr H, gave a bit of air to this group, and invited them all over.

I like to think of this as missionary work rather than spin-doctoring.

Great work David


It falls to all of us to spread the word of Partick

Do I detect a BHA supporter here?

Or is Albion the throstles variety?

Hooray, someone else remembers WBA’s original nickname before “the Baggies” superseded it.

See also Sunderland, “the Rokerites” and “the Black Cats”,

I think any club wishing to re-assign itself a nickname should have a fans’ plebiscite on it, and a subsequent application to Companies House to have the change effected.

Seagulls all the way


Still coming to terms with loss of entire management team

Gonna be one of those what if seasons 🤬

You old traditionalist. Up the Glaziers!

Yes I was getting a bit worried by our rivals progress but money came to the rescue.

Ha ha. I hope the Eagles do what comes naturally from the sky and cause the Glaziers a large window-cleaning bill for their big greenhouse.

Palace? 😱

Yes. A real one. But I always loved Erazerhead so I let you off.

David wrote:


"I think any club wishing to re-assign itself a nickname should have a fans’ plebiscite on it, and a subsequent application to Companies House to have the change effected"

BHAFC never really had a nickname until Seagulls took hold

Dolphins and Shrimpers were tried but never really caught on until the rivalry with Palace. Palace fans were chanting "Eagles, eagles, eagles..." and the Brighton fans inevitably spontaneously replied with "Seagulls, seagulls, seagulls..." and the rest is history

Many's the time two or three seagulls will glide around the Falmer stadium to the delight of the home crowd.

Stephen wrote:


"Yes. A real one. But I always loved Erazerhead so I let you off."

Some of my best friends etc etc

Controversially it's a rivalry that doesn't fire me up - but still enjoy it though

Pleased the game next weekend has been postponed as I was otherwise engaged. Hoping it stays postponed now the rail strike is off. Suspect it will as it suits managerless Albion and all bets are off whilst the country loses its collective head

Strangely I thought Big Mal decided on Eagles in response to Seagulls but all the best rivalries are clouded in mystery.

Stephen wrote:


"Strangely I thought Big Mal decided on Eagles in response to Seagulls but all the best rivalries are clouded in mystery."

Interesting. Not heard that version.

We’ve always been The Dons, and when I see a newspaper headline using that name, only to find out that it’s a feature on the Wombles, teeth are adjusted into the ‘gritted’ position.

We have the same few derogatory nicknames for whoever we are playing on any given day, with a particularly-splenetic and highly-seasoned couple reserved solely for jousts with The Ugly Sisters from Glasgow.

I wouldn’t have it any other way.

Quite right too David

I’m afraid my one and only trip to the Gallstone cemented it in my heart as the only game that matters. Rather like Charlton Arthurletic and any rival of the hammers is a friend of mine so the New Cross lot don’t bother me much.

This article reports the Seagulls from Eagles version...


https://www.fourfourtwo.com/features/...

So the two Dundee clubs don’t share this ridiculous sectarianism?

Sorry Aberdeen is a one club town - my mishtake

Alan Mullery’s infamous loose change etc.

There’s more of it on the Dundee side (Protesrant) than on the Dundee United side, who were actually Dundee Hibernian at one time. Their latter-day ‘rivalry’ is pretty artificial, its only seeming to have become a thing in the past three decades or so. We treat both as irrirating younger brothers rather than rivals, although a United fan assault on our now ex-player Funso Ojo last season has added a bit of spice.

https://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...

Always makes me laugh that when Mullery managed Palace attendances went to an all time low. Quite right too 👏🏻

David, wait til Peterhead ascend to the Scottish top flight. It'll kick off big time with the Dons

Yes that’s when I became a regular just after he’d gone and Coppell’s side would play in front of 3,500.
Ron Noades mother is a whore was created in response to Mullery’s appointment and I’m happy to say it still gets an airing.

That article in 442 mentions the game I saw in Hove. Worst violence I’ve ever witnessed at the footy.
I finally got off an empty train at East Croydon to be met by lots of incredulous Met Police. About 1,500 Palace had alighted at Hassocks to get the next train back.

Peterhead just bob up and down between the two bottom divisions, Nigey. We beat them earlier this season in a League Cup tie, with some ease.

Cove Rangers actually play within the city boundaries, and after winning a play-off to be promoted from the Highland League, won two SPFL promotions in three seasons. They’re now in “the Championship” but are finding it difficult. What I’m saying is that they are more likely to turn out against us rather than the Blue Toon.

I’m a fan of my hometown Highland League club Keith (the Maroons), and in common with the fans of all other Highland League clubs, we were delighted to see the back of Cove, who were universally unpopular.

Yep, all police leave cancelled in Brighton when Palace come to town 😬

Helicopters etc. at our end. There’s no love lost.

Thanks for the clarification David. I was just making an ill informed jest. I didn’t realise that about Cove.

I’ve visited quite a few Scottish grounds but not Aberdeen.

I did once go out with a girl from Peterhead though, and so visited the place

Stayed overnight in Aberdeen once too. The granite glittered under the streetlights. I’d like to go back sometime

I’ll take you to Pittodrie if a visit coincides with a home match, Nigey.

This little altercation was as tasty a bit of naughtiness as I’ve seen in my 56 years of attending. It was actually a sustained mini-riot, but the credibld story is that the feds had been undercover in our sometimes-notorious Section Y, and when they jumped on to the track, the local Casuals thought that some top boys were leading a charge towards the opposition coin-chuckers/nazi saluters, and went along as back-up. 😆😆

https://youtu.be/QNsB_Lvg7hM

I once read a book by some Aberdeen hoolie. Don't ask me why. You have to take these things with a pinch of salt but, taken at face value and so far as I recall, he suggested the Aberdeen firm were greatly feared back in the heyday of footie violence

EDIT: Here it is... Bloody Casuals: Diary of a Football Hooligan

That’s Jay Allan’s book. Jay’s calmed down now, and runs a hotel near Peterhead. I met him there when his brother and I were collaborating on a book. Bloody Casuals is a great read. I was too old (and non-violent) ever to be part of it, but witnessed their ability, as someone said, “to let we bystanders drink pints whilst they took care of the nasty stuff”.

Wow. You know everyone David.


I'm glad he's calmed down. I seem to recall he ended up getting a prison sentence.

The Allans are a very well-known family up here in the tundra. Jay’s grandfather was John R Allan who wrote voluminously, including the classic sociological North East Lowlands, and his Dad Charlie a Highland Games champion, author, musician, and economics lecturer.

My mind is blown. There was I thinking he was just some hooligan from Aberdeen’s badlands. I never imagined he was from an illustrious family

You should be able to get author profiles and bibliographies from this:

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1...