Sci-Fi & Fantasy Girlz discussion

Has anyone seen it? Thoughts?

Absolutely loved it. Particularly loved the time allowed for characterisation and sadness.

Lots of plot holes but overall it was very good

I'm bored with all the superhero stuff. 22 movies in eight years? Seriously?

laurel [suspected bibliophile] wrote: "Lots of plot holes but overall it was very good"

Here's a storytelling lesson I learned from watching the Marvel movies: if it makes emotional sense, it doesn't need to make actual sense.

I just watched it. Thumbs up. Like I say, a lot of it make about as much sense as a purple cat dancing a polka on a Saharan sailboat with a Swiss kangaroo, but it doesn't have to be reasonable because they've tapped into that weird emotional logic of the hindbrain. How they did that is a whole 'nother issue, but that they did it seems pretty evident from the box office receipts.

For some reason I didn't see the notifications for this thread.

I agree that the movie had a lot of plot holes, but even with the plot holes I think it was a very enjoyable movie. It's like 3 hours long and I didn't feel bored, and I usually get bored with superhero movies.

I can't say I'm the biggest fan of the franchise, but I watched all the movies (sometimes having to catch up with 3 or 4) but I liked what they did with that 22 movie arc. It was amazing, and that must have taken a lot of planning. I'm not sure we'll get to see something like that again in our lifetimes (no, Star Wars doesn't count 😛). I wonder if that is why DC movies don't feel as epic to me. I've always been a fan of Superman but none of the Superman or Batman movies have felt to have the epic scale of Marvel movies. I just want to see more Captain Marvel movies!

Apparently Endgame will go past the $2 billion mark this weekend, wow! I don't remember seeing so many people excited about a movie premiere since Star Wars Episode 1 and later with The Force Awakens.

Just got from it, looooved it! When the (view spoiler)[two armies confronted each other, bringing back all the people who died from the "finger snap" in the first movie (hide spoiler)] I just about wet my pants!

Matthew wrote: "Just got from it, looooved it! When the [spoilers removed] I just about wet my pants!"

Hahaha, I loved that part too. It was awesome! So epic! I want to see it again, but I'll wait for the bluray, not sure I could sit through the whole thing again in a theater.

Yoly wrote: "Matthew wrote: "Just got from it, looooved it! When the [spoilers removed] I just about wet my pants!"

Hahaha, I loved that part too. It was awesome! So epic! I want to see it again, but I'll wait..."

Oh, and speaking of awesome parts, how awesome was it when (view spoiler)[Tony Stark got the stones and did his big finish? (hide spoiler)]

Yoly wrote: "I agree that the movie had a lot of plot holes, but even with the plot holes I think it was a very enjoyable movie."

Pretty much all the Avenger movies are full of plot holes, but it doesn't matter because they've got that aforementioned emotional logic.

I had one of those conversations with a buddy that I wish we'd recorded and transcribed. The title would have been "Why Avengers: Civil War is objectively worse than Justice League but really totally better". And that's because Civil War makes a lot less sense than JL... but it's a better movie. Both movies are full of weird, unlikely plot holes that either the audience is expected to jump over or that the film makers didn't realize themselves, yet we do that for A:CW, but not for JL. Or, at least, it's a lot harder to do that with JL.

That could be for a range of reasons: the relatively "likeability" of the characters and/or the actors, the scopes of the films, the extent of the build up that Marvel Studios has engaged in compared to DC rather jumping in without as much development, etc.

My personal vote for the root problem with the DC movies is directorial. That is, Zack Snyder is the problem. After all, he's been making soulless, unsatisfying comic book movies for quite a while. He made the weirdly empty and bloodless (as in unrelatable--it didn't lack for gore) version of The Watchmen. He did 300, which is basically war porn. To be fair, the comic book is basically war porn too, but I don't think that necessarily moots the point. And Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice?

These are not really bad movies. They're just not good movies. They're like watching someone else play a video game. You don't engage with them. At least, I didn't. I didn't hate the experience, but I felt no need to repeat it. It's not until Wonder Woman came around that suddenly one of those DC movies started to have some sort of emotional resonance (though, notably, still no lack of plot holes—in fact, I'd argue the plot holes in WW are even more glaring) and the big difference there? Snyder not in the director's chair.

A lot of people are fans of Snyder, though, (especially since JL came out) and they'll argue an essentially unknowable thing at this point: that JL would have been a great film had it not been for studio interference and the way they swapped out directors and inserted various things meant to soften the film for audiences. Maybe Snyder could even have got Henry Cavill to shave his upper lip somehow.... Maybe. Given the arc of his career, though, I don't think that's the case. The counter argument is that all those things that happened after Snyder left were done to correct what was already a mess. We can't say for sure, of course, but I'd honestly put more trust in Joss Whedon churning out an emotively relatable product than Snyder, so if the argument is that Whedon's influence is what screwed that project up then I just don't think that jibes with their respective careers. We'll just have to wait until some director's cut comes out in which Snyder gets hold of all the material he'd done and puts it together with the benefit several years of time to rethink and plan an edit to satisfy his fanboys. And that's unlikely. (Either the director's cut or fanboy satisfaction.)

Endgame is like that too. An awful lot of it makes no sense... but it's a better movie. And we overlook a whole bunch of little storytelling tropes that we really shouldn't be overlooking. Like, the whole Hawkeye versus Black Widow (view spoiler)[self-sacrifice (hide spoiler)] decision... which I'll leave alone for the nonce.