You'll love this one...!! A book club & more discussion

***We have added some extra information about book discussions to this post (see 'a note on discussion' below). Please read it carefully. Thanks!***

One of the group reads for July is The Bees by Laline Paull.

Please discuss the book in this thread.

Roz will be leading the discussion.

In order to receive a badge you must:
1. have read the book before or during July 2019.
2. discussed it in this thread. Discussion must be more than "I read the book and I liked it". Discussion requires something more substantial and analytical of what you read, for example, thoughts, opinions, impact it had on you, what was your favourite part, was it what you expected it to be like etc. You may also like to review the book and post a link to the review in this thread. Please refer to our group spoiler policy for further information.
3. Report that you have read AND discussed the book in the reporting thread (include a brief summary of what you thought of the book).

A note on discussion: Discussion must be more than "I read the book and I liked it". Discussion requires something more substantial and analytical of what you read, for example, thoughts, opinions, impact it had on you, what was your favourite part, was it what you expected it to be like etc.

In addition to this, the group reads are meant to be a "read along" so it is preferable that you discuss the book as you read rather than wait until you've finished the book.

And finally, discussion is not about just listing your thoughts. Please interact with the other group members, comment on their thoughts, and if they comment on yours, respond to them. This is what makes a good book discussion!

You may also like to review the book and post a link to the review in this thread.

Please refer to our group spoiler policy for further information.

General Rules:
1. Please mark your spoilers with the spoiler tags along with mentioning what stage of the book you are at so other's don't get a nasty shock. Chapter numbers/titles are generally best as they are the same across all formats and editions. See our spoiler policy
2. The book may be combined with the Year Long Challenge, Topplers, and Monthly Challenges.

Happy reading!

This book was discussed as a group read back in November 2015. Here is a link to the old discussion thread if you want to check it out - https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

Hi everybody. I'm starting this one tonight. I hope some of you will join in the discussion even if you've read it before and just want to add your thoughts.

Hey Roz, I will be joining you as soon as I finish Glass Beads. I've already picked it up from the library and everything :)

I remember reading the book when it first came out. I was fascinated from the first page.

I'm through the first 2 chapters
(view spoiler)[I am finding it interesting how the genetic knowing seems to snap into place. And, the smells of the different kin, makes me wonder if we are not as finely tuned, or if we just forget this level of knowing as we grow up? But, some things are always the same you give somebody an ounce of power and you have a fifty-fifty chance of getting the "police" as depicted :( And, how terrifying to be noticed as "different" after seeing what "different" can get you . . . (hide spoiler)]
I'm already totally enthralled and don't want to put it down, but I have to work in the morning :(

I liked your spoiler, Jenn, and I agree about "the different". It was a very hard book to put down, work and all, and I dragged myself in more than one morning while I was reading it. (view spoiler)[ what I found most intriguing was the POV. It just floored me that the author could bend her imagination into writing what it might be like to be a bee. Keep reading. ;-) (hide spoiler)]

I started reading a couple of days ago and I'm finding the book quite intriguing. I also just read the spoiler policy and I feel like everything I have to say will be one giant spoiler.

I've read 4 chapters so far and it really is fascinating how the author describes the hive in such detail. I can't imagine the time and energy she must have put into studying the subject. It’s depicted as a (view spoiler)[totalitarian society with religious overtones – chanting, praying, programmed responses. The chants/mantras are disturbingly mindless: "Accept Obey Serve", “Deformity is evil. Deformity is not permitted”. (hide spoiler)]

Chapter 1: Flora 717 is born a worker bee destined for working in sanitation, considered low caste. She’s different: bigger, speaks, thinks, “ugly”.
The brutal finality of the society is immediately seen in the scene (view spoiler)[with the police and how quickly they deal with a newly hatched bee with a malformed wing. “Deformity is evil. Deformity is not permitted” and the young bee is killed. They want to kill Flora 717 as well because she is obviously deformed. But Sister Sage ( born in the same kin as the Queen) steps in and saves her. Why?

Question: Is Flora 717 a mutant or a hybrid? The hive is in trouble: lack of food, disruptive scents, the threatening dangers of the world outside the hive. Was Flora 717 just a coincidence, freak of nature or was she engineered to be different, able to fill various hive roles? The timing of her appearance makes me wonder. (hide spoiler)]

Chapter 2: I like the way the author uses floral names for the characters. They’re well thought out and seem to be job specific. Sage: the herb has been used in spiritual rituals in the past and when burned the aroma can have a cleansing, mind-clearing effect. In the past it was used to aid in increasing women’s fertility and may help with chemical imbalances in the brain leading to Alzheimer’s disease. (view spoiler)[ Perfect for Sister Sage who has the ability to use scent to control minds. (hide spoiler)] Teasel is useful in augmenting digestion and improving appetite. Having the name Flora is pretty general. Maybe it’s because she can’t easily be attached to one job.

Chapter 3: I’m not liking Sister Teasel but she has the typical acceptable mindset.

Chapter 4: I’m fascinated by the organization of the hive. The Queen lays the eggs and they hatch into various castes/kins – nurses, sanitation, drones, … Do they all get fed flow? Do they all go through the same process with variations to produce the desired outcomes?

Wahoo, I finally got a minute on a computer :) Just in time to finish the book lol

And, I am having sooooo many thoughts. I both loved it, and was totally horrified by it.

Roz: Ch 1 (view spoiler)[ the unquestioned brutality . . . what an introduction (hide spoiler)]

Roz, Cherie 2 (view spoiler)[ I couldn't agree more, the amount of research, to make even the smallest details more meaningful, totally awesome (hide spoiler)]

End book thoughts (view spoiler)[ Interesting take having it portrait as a religious cult, but with such short life-spans there isn't really that much time to realize you are dissatisfied with your place in the colony and actually do anything about it. And, I guess it only seems brutal from this side of the hive. In reality, they probably wouldn't survive the winter with a bunch of gluttonous boys wanting to be groomed when the girls are just trying to sleep and survive. I doubt it was realistic for Flora to get to work experience all over the place, but it was an excellent plot device. Initially, I had been wondering if Flora's size maybe indicated she was going to transition into a queen and swarm? Then when the sickness was discovered, I had been wondering if maybe Flora had been born in prep to take over? Then I stopped trying to figure it out, and just unlatched my wings to enjoy the ride. (hide spoiler)]
Kept me enthralled from start to finish. I am so glad that this book was chosen.

Was out watering my garden the other evening, and found myself talking to sister bees, and watching them go about their work. I've always liked bees, but now . . . totally enthralled lol One industrious little bee had her legs packed with so much pollin that they were almost as big as her body. And, I was inspecting my lilies, and each petal does have a big runway of pollin down its centre. I know the local community garden I periodically help with has brought in the local beekeeping group to install rooftop hives, and are looking for volunteers . . .

That's so funny, Jenn. I was pruning perennials this morning and sat watching a couple of bees going from one purple coneflower to another. It was fascinating. One was completely covered in pollen, all over her back and legs. Incredible. In the past I'd swat at them to get them out of my way. Now I watch them go about their business.

Absolutely Roz, it is a very interesting change of perspective

I finally had a chance to come back and read your spoilers. I remember going down the same path and asking the same questions at the beginning. In the end, I finally did as Jenn did and "just went with it"...

When I get bored with reading, I wander over to You Tube and watch bee keeping videos. There are some real characters out there. Bees don't say much, but looking at frames of them all busy doing "their job" is still awe inspiring.

I love it when I see the huge black and yellow, furry bumble bees working over my flowers. They have been getting fewer and fewer every year.

If anyone's still interested in reading this, it's now an ebook deal. I found it on Kobo, but it's probably the same for Kindle.

Sorry there wasn’t much activity on this thread. Personally, I enjoyed this book. I like to garden so I see bees all the time. But I’ve viewed them as a nuisance more than anything, even though I understand their purpose in nature. More of a swatting relationship to get them out of my way and trying not to get stung. The Bees provided a more intimate view of their incredible society, the rules and structure, their dependency on their sense of smell, methods of communication, relationships with other insects, the lifespan of each member. They only live about 150 days at most. (view spoiler)[Each individual has job to do for the good of the hive. Any transgression or flaw results in death, accepted and swift. But we are also introduced to Flora 717 who is different and spared death. Through her we learn about bee society. Maybe it isn't realistic that she would be spared but for the sake of story she is. We learn of the various kin and parts of the hive through her. The lazy drones, the controlling priestesses / sage, the thistle, foragers, the invisible sanitation bees, and of course the queen. (hide spoiler)] No more swatting for me. Now I’m content to watch them go about their busy business foraging for nectar and collecting pollen. I’ll be sure to always have an abundant supply of flowers throughout the seasons so the foragers can come visit to replenish their supplies for the good of the hive.

I’ve always been a fan of bees, but I’m finding now that I’m watching/noticing details that I never did before. The enjoyment of watching them pack the pollen onto their legs, noticing the “runways” of pollen leading into a lily, and it goes on lol. And, now from talking about while reading, sean has decided that we have a couple of locations that could be up for discussion for someone to place a hive 🐝

Jenn - it is exciting that you and Sean may want to have a hive or hives, but you should really look into what you may be getting into, if you decide to take up bee keeping. I am not trying to discourage you. I think it would be cool, but it can be a lot of work and an expense to get set up. Keeping them in the long run, depending on where you live is another thing. There are a lot of bee keeping videos on You Tube about the subject. I do not keep bees, nor really want to, but I do follow some of them, just out of curiosity. Instead of honey bees, you might consider ground bees or bumble bees, that live in hollow tubes and only live for one season. They do not produce honey, but they pollinate your garden.

Oh no Cherie, we know that we are not beekeepers, but we are gardeners. And there is an active and growing beekeeping community growing here, and some of them have been placing hives on willing properties, which is what we are hoping will happen.

Jenn wrote: "Oh no Cherie, we know that we are not beekeepers, but we are gardeners. And there is an active and growing beekeeping community growing here, and some of them have been placing hives on willing pro..."

That sounds like the best of both worlds, Jenn. We have a beekeeping club here which a few of my friends belong to. They really enjoy the hives they have.

Yes, Jenn, having a hive and them keeping an eye on it would be fantastic. If I were farther out of town, that would be so wonderful. I don’t know if there is a beekeeping club in my area or not. I see hives at the edges of fields when I am driving around sometimes, but they don’t stay long.

Ooooh, it sounds to me like someone is either renting out the bees, or the fields lol Very cool

I never heard of beekeeping clubs. I did see that there's a Long Island club on Facebook. I checked to see if there were any established beekeepers near me but it seems that the only beekeepers (2) listed are further out on Long Island (NY) where it's more rural. Most of what I found was bee and wasp removal.

Some of the people who advertise for bee removal may be hobby beekeepers, Roz.
That is how a lot of them increase their hives, by capturing swarms and removing hives from houses and other places. 628DirtRooster, on You Tube, is one of them I follow. His father and brother are beekeepers too. They are in the south east, in Mississippi, I think. I have watched his videos for a long time, but still do not know his name. There is another guy in Alabama, who keeps bees and captures swarms and does removals too. He is Jeff Horchoff Bees on You Tube. He keeps his bee hives and harvests honey at Catholic Church Abbey. The honey is sold at the gift shop. His hives are all labeled Abbey Honey Bees.

I didn't think of that, the idea of a beekeeper running a bee removal side business as a way of increasing his/her beekeeping, honey making business. That's ingenious. I guess the "removers" would have to be sure to capture the queen as well. I don't know where the bees that frequent my garden live, where their hive is, but I do enjoy watching them go about their business and have a greater appreciation for them after reading this book.
On a different note, I had googled bees and honey making. Some of the questions that are out there are, well, out there. I was particularly glad to read that honey is basically bee vomit rather than something else. The things you find online...

Roz wrote: "I didn't think of that, the idea of a beekeeper running a bee removal side business as a way of increasing his/her beekeeping, honey making business. That's ingenious. I guess the "removers" would ..."

My friend and her husband rescued 5 swarms last summer and increased their hives that way. I went with them on one but stayed in the truck since I'm allergic. The swarm was in a tree. It was starting to rain and had they not rescued them, they likely would have died. It's quite interesting.