Likin' the Spiritual, but NOT the Religious? discussion

Breuggemann asserts that the First Commandment -- "Make Holy the Sabbath Day" in Judeo-Christian tradition -- makes this God very distinct from the gods of Pharaoh. The command to honor Sabbath isn't just some arbitrary edict from a demanding God; it is a way to resist the gods that would have us working/producing 24/7/365. What gods demand work from us today? What ways can we resist those gods through Sabbath practices?

I have read this book before, but I'm ready to read it and discuss it again. Brueggemann is excellent and his insights into Sabbath are both educational and inspiring.

I live a frantic, catch-my-breath, kind of life. My devotional time is not spent trying to discern those things I need to let go of in order to live a simpler, healthier, more peace-filled life.

It is a slow process, but I believe I am gradually finding my way.

I love how "Walt" uses the fourth commandment as a bridge between the first three and the last six. It makes complete sense to me. And I agree that Sabbath is breaking free of the "Pharaohs" of this world. CHURCHES have become slaves to the system of constant achievement, it is an undercurrent of pressure that is insidious.

Yes, I love that transitional understanding that links the first commandments to the last. "Walt" is really good, don't you think?

Five years ago I found a very fulfilling church. It is committed to the Word of God, but focuses on our culture, not religiousity. We worship, but don't get bogged down in tradition.
The church has a huge teen and college following, a time in one's life when futures are people are often shaped.
I believe that corportae worship is commanded for a reason. But it's more about changing hearts the liturgy.

Roger wrote: "Five years ago I found a very fulfilling church. It is committed to the Word of God, but focuses on our culture, not religiousity. We worship, but don't get bogged down in tradition.
The church ha..."

Roger, this is an intriguing comment. I'm wondering if you could say more about how your church is more focused on "culture, not religiousity." How does that play out for you and your church?

I also love the connection y'all are making between the first and tenth commandments. It's interesting to think of those as "bookends" to the rest of the commandments.

Nicole wrote: "I also love the connection y'all are making between the first and tenth commandments. It's interesting to think of those as "bookends" to the rest of the commandments."

Nicole wrote: "Roger wrote: "Five years ago I found a very fulfilling church. It is committed to the Word of God, but focuses on our culture, not religiousity. We worship, but don't get bogged down in tradition. ..."

Nicole wrote: "Roger wrote: "Five years ago I found a very fulfilling church. It is committed to the Word of God, but focuses on our culture, not religiousity. We worship, but don't get bogged down in tradition. ..."

I'll try to speak to this issue a little further. Many mainline Christian churches are dwindling in membership, because they had done little to feed the soul. There's too much of the same ol' same ol'. Maybe the music's more upbeat, or an overhead screen is present, but the message hasn't changed.
I believe that ministers must make sure their text keeps with what the Bible says. Too many popular self-help preachers out there, like Joel Osteen. Brings in the crowd, but his health and wealth doctrine is false. You can't rely on Joel when life goes south and you have no control over what's happening.

Too much moral relativism and spiritualism. No one knows right from wrong anymore. How unreliable that is.

Recognizing that God is in control, that we were created to fellowship with him and obey his commandments are basic tenants. We need to hear the meat of God's word as it relates to the events of life.

Hope this isn't too preachy. It's a deep subject, though.

Thanks for your comments Roger. I am interested and intrigued about your church. Can you let us know the name and location of it? Hopefully it has a website or FB page I could check out because this kind of a thing is what I am interested in my brick and mortar call and WE are interested in building an online version of community at ExUCC.

I agree with you about Joel, who I am sure is a nice guy but shallow in theology IMHO. We can't just dress up the old message with style points and glossy bulletins; people yearn for something more.

Darrin wrote: "Thanks for your comments Roger. I am interested and intrigued about your church. Can you let us know the name and location of it? Hopefully it has a website or FB page I could check out because thi..."

Jo wrote: "I have read this book before, but I'm ready to read it and discuss it again. Brueggemann is excellent and his insights into Sabbath are both educational and inspiring.

I live a frantic, catch-my-..."

I believe staying constant with devotional time is huge. I need to do more of it myself.

Darrin wrote: "Thanks for your comments Roger. I am interested and intrigued about your church. Can you let us know the name and location of it? Hopefully it has a website or FB page I could check out because thi..."

Glad to hear I didn't offend you with the comment. I'm sure he's a nice guy, too. I'm more concerned about his followers, who seem to think they can overcome anything with a positive attitude. Sooner or later, we all come to that point that brings us to our knees.

Roger wrote: "Nicole wrote: "Roger wrote: "Five years ago I found a very fulfilling church. It is committed to the Word of God, but focuses on our culture, not religiousity. We worship, but don't get bogged down..."

Well said, Roger. What's interesting is that both the mainlines and the Joel Osteen-types water down the gospel into something that makes you feel good about yourself, not to really 'feed the soul' by challenging us to live countercultural lives.

I agree. Most of us gravitate toward a watered down Gospel. I believe it is a product of living in a culture in which so many people, ( and I confess this is often true for me) have so much of what they need that they become complacent. This allows for those in power and those with wealth to control the agenda. I think this is what Brueggeman is pushing back agains in his book. He invites us back into Sabbath as a means of rediscovering the essentially radical nature of taking time off and taking time apart in order to discover what is really important.

Maybe the implication of Breuggemann's argument is that we need to live in a simpler way. A way that doesn't necessitate the constant work so that we can buy more stuff ...

Yes, I think that is exactly what he is suggesting and yet it is so very hard to accomplish in our society.

I've noticed when my mom and her friends go to the mall, they just buy buy buy stuff : like a sociopathic sport!
it would be best if they could enjoy each other's company and not have to show some sort of status symbol or reflect the mirror image of advertising when they get together .. I used to buy stuff too on impulse buy have been spending the last couple yrs avoiding those places: before that for about 7 or so yrs, taking everything (2 per week) that I don't use to food will bins at StMs: it's only in the last 2 yrs that I've come to understand and realize that my red polo shirt of which I have 2 is a much better thing to take than ratty old kitchen utensils! We are a work in professor, eh : but these gems of knowing should be the advertising we see on a daily basis instead of what we do hear ... ya?!

I've noticed when my mom and her friends go to the mall, they just buy buy buy stuff : like a sociopathic sport!
it would be best if they could enjoy each other's company and not have to show some sort of status symbol or reflect the mirror image of advertising when they get together .. I used to buy stuff too on impulse buy have been spending the last couple yrs avoiding those places: before that for about 7 or so yrs, taking everything (2 per week) that I don't use to food will bins at StMs: it's only in the last 2 yrs that I've come to understand and realize that my red polo shirt of which I have 2 is a much better thing to take than ratty old kitchen utensils! We are a work in professor, eh : but these gems of knowing should be the advertising we see on a daily basis instead of what we do hear ... ya?!

clearly auto correct said food instead of good
and professor instead of progress!!!! let's hope that's not a Freudian slip!! hahahahaha

clearly auto correct said food instead of good
and professor instead of progress!!!! let's hope that's not a Freudian slip!! hahahahaha

I love the phrase, "sociopathic sport". The culmination of that happens the day after Thanksgiving. I'm wondering how we can resist this tendency during the Holidays.