Random Reads discussion

Let's talk about chapters 7-16 here.

Wow. There is a lot to unpack from these chapters. I honestly don't know where to begin.

Orry is trapped in slave holder tradition, and it was disappointing to see him plant a stake in the ground and defend that position...even to the point of thinking that Priam's "cat-hauling" was valid and necessary. I'm not sure if we are supposed to feel bad for Orry as he has lost his arm and can't act on his feelings for Madeline. We get it, you are frustrated, Orry, but you are wrong here. I loved George's response..."It shouldn't be necessary for one human being to hurt another. If the system makes it necessary or condones it, the system is wrong." Right on, George. Sad how relevant this quote is today.

I've seen reviews that say North And South is too much of a soap opera, and that comes out a little bit with these chapters as Orry and Madeline want to be together, but have to live with their misery over the situation, and George finds love with Constance (even though she is *gasp* an Irish Catholic and his family will not be happy about that).

There is a lot more that happens, and I'll be interested to hear what everyone else has to think...

I also found the quote from George pretty profound Mike! I really don’t know how to feel about Orry. Obviously I feel for him in that he lost his hand and that the woman he’s in love with is married to another (awful) man. But calling cat-hauling another human being “necessary”? No way man. By the way, that scene when Priam was cat hauled had me googling because I had never heard of it and I can’t believe that was actually practiced! Absolutely horrible.

I have to say, the romance aspects in the book so far have me rolling my eyes a bit lol. It might be because I just don’t care for romances in general, but the instalove between Orry and Madeline was kind of ridiculous and the scene where they first secretly met had me cringing 😬 George and Constance at least got to know each other a little bit before declaring their love lol. So yeah I could easily do without all of that. Who knows though, it might grow on me as the book goes on.

I agree with both of your comments about Orry. I don’t know how I feel about him and I find his relationship with Madeline to not really align with his overall character. No matter how he’s described, I can’t relate to him being romantic in anyway and this secret love doesn’t fit for me. I also don’t read romance and I’m not very interested in it so it could be my own personal bias.

The theme of friendship and the tensions that exist between Orry and George over the subject of slavery is engaging. I feel like as the reader, we get more perspective from George than Orry which makes it easier to relate or find George’s family and storyline interesting. George’s character certainly would speak out loud more about his thoughts than Orry’s as he seems introverted and sad. I’m questioning the friendship continuously. An issue has important as slavery at this time, that brings such differences of opinion into light, is no small thing to manage if these two men wish to move forward as friends. My 2020 brain can’t comprehend it.

Good point bringing up the differences on George and Orry's stance on slavery, and the impact it would have on a relationship. Along with that, I found that George seemed more content with Orry's position on acceptance of slavery than he did with his own sister Virgilia's hardline anti-slavery stance.

Virgilia is passionate and outspoken on the subject, and Jakes seems to go to great lengths to describe George noticing that "her waist had grown thicker" and her hands were "almost like a man's", or that she was "too buxom", and that she was obviously just looking for attention. I say give 'em hell Virgilia.

I agree Mike! I thought it was weird that George condemned Virgilia’s stance on slavery given what he witnessed at Orry’s. I don’t like that Jakes seems to correlate her anti-slavery activism with her appearance, like the reason she’s so passionate about these things is because she’s “unattractive”. She’s villainous or is perceived as unlikable because she isn’t skinny or beautiful. Or that if she were “attractive” she wouldn’t care about slavery. Like, why should her appearance matter, yet he’s always pointing it out in a negative way? Does that make sense? It kinda bugs me! So yeah I say get ‘em Virg! Lol

It seems to be implied that the primary reason that Virgilia (being a woman) would have such strong opinions about slavery (or anything besides housekeeping and motherhood) is because she is unattractive and unable to find a man. I don't think George is necessarily against her anti-slavery stance but instead against what he views as her un-womanly brazenness and that she is trying to stir up violence, etc.

I agree with Treeesh's mention that we get a lot more from George's perspective, so, of course, the reader is inclined to sympathize more with him and his family and feel closer to them. We are also meant to do so, naturally, because Orry's family is from the South and owns slaves, etc. I would appreciate a little more from Orry's perspective, just so we could get to know his mindset better, how he grapples internally with the current system, and whether he ever questions what his family is perpetuating.

I am also I'm not buying Orry and Madeline's "instalove." I feel sorry for them both, but their relationship doesn't seem to have much substance. I wonder what he would think of her if he knew she helped Priam. Will he still love her when he finds out about her mother and if so, will that change his opinion of slavery?

I also had to Google cat hauling. How horrible! And I had to Google if Orry lost his arm in the miniseries. I thought I would have remembered that!

So, coming from having watched the miniseries multiple times growing up....I love Orry! He definitely is not as down and depressed as in the book at this point. A few differences, like he didn’t lose his arm in the miniseries. And Virgilia drove me NUTS! Yes, she’s passionate and that’s great, but I did feel like she took things to an extreme and suggesting that southerners be burned along with their plantations is the same type of violence she’s speaking out against. I had a big problem with her character in the series as well. Every time she opened her mouth it was the stir the pot and she just seemed so angry all of the time.

I’m just waiting until Ashton is older because that girl..wooooo...just wait.

And when George decked Bent - YAS!!!!!!