SFF Hot from Printers: New Releases discussion

I'm curious about the experience of officially voting for the Hugo's and I don't want to spam other threads with questions that are off topic. I think a bunch of you have said you are officially voting this year and/or have in the past. Things I'm curious about...

1) Do you vote in every category? Even editors and stuff? How are some of these categories even on anyone's radar? I definitely don't pay attention to editors.

2) Do you make sure to read every nominee or do you just vote for the ones you already know and like?

3) What do you get? I seem to remember hearing that they send you ebooks of all the short stories?

4) Have you been to the conference? What is that like?

5) What makes it worth it to you to be an official voter?

I'm doing it this year for the first time, so I can't answer all of the questions

1.) I only vote in those categories where I know what I'm doing

2.) I will read every nominee in the categories I'm voting in (with some minor exceptions if series books get nominated where I couldn't stand the first volume)

5.) I'm honest - the only reason why I bought the membership this year was to push Adrian Tchaikovsky - so for me the worth is to know that at least I tried to get the best SF author into the supposedly best of list.

Hi Kristen, I'll answer in hopes of convincing you to join us in voting. :)

1) Nope, in an ideal world I'd be able to read/learn across all categories, but some of them are (editors/zines/fan works) are too much work for me, and I don't have enough knowledge to feel comfortable voting in them. I think the voting stats also show a huge disparity between number of votes for the big 4 fiction categories and these smaller categories.

2) I try to read every nominee in every category I plan to vote for. It's not fully possible because of time constraints. It's also not fully possible because not every publisher makes their full works available. One example is this past year's Best Related Work category, which had very different types of works competing against each other: Jeannette Ng's speech, a documentary about Le Guin, and four full-length books. The speech was easily accessible, and only one of the books were provided for free to voters. So I naturally didn't even submit a vote for them -- but then didn't have time to read the ebook I received anyway, so I don't think I voted in the category. (I didn't want to vote for Ng's speech, as awesome as it was).

3) It's called the Hugo Voter Packet, which used to be hard copy but is now fully digital. The file formats depend on the category, as well as on the publisher. Not every publisher offers full access, so for some titles you just get excerpts or watermarked PDFs. But for many books you get the full ebook in your choice of epub/mobi/pdf formats. You don't get any extra access to dramatic presentation categories. For the 2020 Voter Packet, in the novel category I received a fully ebook copy of The City in the Middle of the Night, The Light Brigade, Middlegame, and Gideon the Ninth; only a PDF for A Memory Called Empire; and only an excerpt for The Ten Thousand Doors of January.

4) Nope, I've never been to a convention in my life, and I'm not big on crowds, so I've never felt compelled to travel for them. Attending in person is the only way to participate in "WSFS Business" (ie. vote on matters relating to the running of the Hugos), and occasionally I feel a tinge of regret that I can't fully participate in that. There are ongoing campaigns to include two new categories, one for translated works, and one for video games, and I'd like to support both of them, but won't be able to formally vote to adopt them unless I attend in person.

5) You get a ton of reading material from the voter packet. Things I would never pick up on my own but end up loving. But beyond that, I just find it fun. It's like making a best-of-year list but with a whole community of dedicated readers, and not just for funsies but with real stakes involved for authors and future readers (our H&N group's entire reading list is based on decisions of past voters, and being a voter gives the opportunity to influence what joins that "canon").

I was a Hugo voter a few years ago (and am considering becoming one again), so I can answer with that experience:

1) I only voted in the categories I cared about: best novel, novella, novelette and short story.

2) I read all the short works and most novels.

3) Once the nominations are confirmed, you get a "voter packet", with all the nominees in ebook or PDF form. Some novels offered only excerpts, though.

4) I attended Worldcon 75, the one that was held in Helsinki. It was great fun! The panels were really interesting and there were a lot of them. I had real trouble managing my schedule, since there were so many overlapping events. In fact, I had to steel my heart and skip a few just to find time to eat!

5) I like the idea of participating in the process; plus, I feel like I can complain more loudly if I have literally and figuratively paid my dues!

Kristenelle wrote: "1) Do you vote in every category? Even editors and stuff? How are some of these categories even on anyone's radar? I definitely don't pay attention to editors."

Voting/nominating is your right, not obligation. Last year I filled our nomination lists and I added a few editors, but for less popular categories having 1-2 instead of 6 allowed is the norm. Here link to Hugo 2020 statistics and you can see that best novel got 1873 ballots, best short story 1432 and best Editor, Short Form only 877. So a lot of categories get less attention than the "main one" - novels.

Kristenelle wrote: "2) Do you make sure to read every nominee or do you just vote for the ones you already know and like?"

I've read novels (all) and in other categories where I voted I've read most/all and plan to read this year too. However, it seems likely that many members have a kind of internal bias check - as we discussed elsewhere not a single man in best novel since 2015 seems statistically unlikely (in 5*6=30 nominations)

Kristenelle wrote: "3) What do you get? I seem to remember hearing that they send you ebooks of all the short stories?"

You get a member's package that contains most (due to copyright some may be missing) works in all categories i.e. including an episodes of TV series, related works, arts, etc. last year also NZ local SFF award nominees like The Dawnhounds. the whole package (can be downloaded by category) was over 3 GB is size - mostly videos


Kristenelle wrote: "5) What makes it worth it to you to be an official voter?"

So far I try to make authors I like more known for the fandom, like Adrian Tchaikovsky, so I nominate them. Not a lot of success though

Oleksandr wrote: "So far I try to make authors I like more known for the fandom, like Adrian Tchaikovsky, so I nominate them. Not a lot of success though"

If that is your goal, I think the best option would be to nominate only one work per category: every member has just one "point" per category. Therefore if you nominate six novels they all get 1/6th of a point; if you only nominate one it gets your full point.

I understood they made this rule change to disincentivize slate voting, but I still think it is the most annoying rule about the Hugos. It gives too much voice to fanpersons who love just one book.

Thanks for all your answers! Antti, you make worldcon sound really fun. I love conferences in general anyways (minus the crowds...feel you on that one, Kalin.)

I was thinking about joining but then I was like, "$50 isn't much but it is still kind of lot for basically just bragging rights." But then I started thinking about how sad I would be if my favorites didn't get nominated and I hadn't voted. So I'm going to do it!

Are ballots turned in online?

Oleksandr wrote: "last year also NZ local SFF award nominees like The Dawnhounds. "

That was because ConZealand was also hosting the local Julius Vogel Awards, not part of the Hugo process. But I assume if there's similar overlap at other worldcons, the same would happen.

All voting is done online now, though there may be a legacy post system.

I nominated / voted for the Hugos for the first time this year. My answers are much the same as other peoples: I voted only in the most popular categories, where I felt I could make an informed opinion. I read all the nominees, and in fact my pre-reading had meant I'd already read everything for best novel anyway.

On question 5, for me it was more an opportunity thing: WorldCon was in NZ, I'd be able to attend for the first and only time, and voting was part of that (In the end the con went virtual, so I felt no need to upgrade my initial supporting membership to online attendance since that wasn't my thing). I guess for me it was worth it because it made me go back to reading, and to keeping up with the genre (I'd slacked off, and was very far behind; I think the 2010s are mostly a black hole for SF books for me). As I backfill that pressure will get less, but I'm wondering myself if paying US$50 to be able to vote again is worth it just to keep me reading.

1 & 2. I voted in every category since I usually clear my schedule right after I receive the packet to read the whole content, yes even listen to the podcasts or read the related works category.

The exception would be series or YA nominees that I don't follow/like/not interested to read, or if the provided copies were just samples or pdf that could not be converted to mobi files.

3. Already been answered by others.

4. I was in ConZealand (online) last year and it was a blast. Met lots of cool people - some became friends, attended some fantastic panels, followed tons of authors and even befriended some, and of course added more tons of books in my wishlist. Using Discord as the main comm channel was also great, so easy to move between 'venues'. We even have another Discord channel to continue discussions or get updates since the official one was closed after the event. I also got to hang out via Zoom with some fans who are con organizers themselves.

I wish I could attend DisCon this year but the past few US based cons I attended ruined my sleeping schedule and I did not get much of it at the end. Watching recordings of panels are just not the same.

4. What makes it worth it?
- the packet (I love the graphic novels - too expensive to collect by myself, best related works (found many gems here), editors stuff - normally I won't be reading much of them if I am not a voter)
- ability to nominate your fave authors, creators, and works, make them more visible even though they might not win.
- I am the only voter from my country so it's cool to represent it

MH wrote: "I'm wondering myself if paying US$50 to be able to vote again is worth it just to keep me reading.."

Maybe if you think about it more as a reward for reading rather than a motivation?

@Silvana - I hadn't realized that there was an online con last year. That's cool! And it is super cool that you representing your country.

I think many this year will stay online. Actually I really want to watch Sheree Renée Thomas and Malka Older hosting this year. I hope I could still watch some videos on YouTube later.

Antti wrote: "Oleksandr wrote: "So far I try to make authors I like more known for the fandom, like Adrian Tchaikovsky, so I nominate them. Not a lot of success though"

If that is your goal, I think the best option would be to nominate only one work per category"

That's true, but (a) when I said "i nominated" etc I meant I filled in our group nomination list that won and I guess it is hard to "lure" members to support one's list if it has 1 nominee and (b) more nominees can lead to at least one getting to the shortlist

So those of you who said you want to vote--you do realize it is too late for this year, right? You had to sign up by Dec 31.

I might do it next year. I was going to do it this year, but Z was doing it, so I didn't need to . . .

I do believe you can still sign up to vote, as long as you're (at least) a supporting member of DisCon III.

Signing up after Dec. 31 means you're no longer eligible to nominate.

edit: I checked the website, you can still buy a supporting membership in DisCon III, so you're still able to vote.

Oh, thanks Kalin. I thought the deadline was for everything. '

So they will send me the packet with all the goodies (which is why I was thinking about it), but to vote I have to actually go to the convention. So I will go look at the website and decide

Oh no! I wasn't paying attention to deadlines. Kateblue, I'm imagining that you can still vote online. You just can't send in nominations. What is the deadline for getting your nominations in assuming you didn't miss the deadline for purchasing a membership?

Nominating hasn't even started yet. Last year it was mid-March I think? They'll send out an email when it's open with more details. I know that DisCon recently polled members to see if they would attend in person if they changed the date to December -- they're hoping vaccinations will allow travel instead of the con being fully online. So that might change all the deadlines.

Kate, all voting is online.

Kalin wrote: "Nominating hasn't even started yet. Last year it was mid-March I think? They'll send out an email when it's open with more details. I know that DisCon recently polled members to see if they would a..."

Last year the nomination period started on Jan 5 and ended on March 13.

I think losing a chance to nominate diminishes the total fun - you can nominate and worry whether there'll be enough votes like yours to boost a work

@Z - yeah....I think I’m probably going to wait and see what the nominations are at this point. Getting to promote my favorites was what I was looking forward to.

I think I am going to skip for at least this year. I have this huge list of TBR for a challenge in another group. Most are books that I have wanted to read forever but just have not had the time. So I will concentrate on that.

I noticed by reading all the novellas last year around this time that there were a lot of them I didn't really like, and some I hated. So I think I may wait a little longer and then just read the nominees, particularly in light of my New Year's resolution to quit reading books when I don't like them.

Kateblue wrote: "I noticed by reading all the novellas last year around this time that there were a lot of them I didn't really like, and some I hated."

What about Connie Willis read this December?

Z, I loved Take a Look at the Five and Ten. But then, I know that I will usually love anything Connie Willis writes.

I'm not saying that there aren't great new things. I'm just saying that, by making a promise to read new stuff, I often read stuff blindly, stuff that I end up not liking. Life is too short. Hence my New Year's resolution. (I have said that I was going to stop reading things I didn't like before--and I am sure I will read some again. But I can TRY not to!)

Nominations are now open. They close on March 19.

https://discon3.org/whats-on/hugo-awa...

MH wrote: "Nominations are now open. They close on March 19."

Thanks MH. We'll start a thread with nominees of H/N novels group soon

I am so annoyed that they gave us much shorter period than the previous ones.

Silvana wrote: "I am so annoyed that they gave us much shorter period than the previous ones."


last year was till March 13th IIRC

Oleksandr wrote: "Silvana wrote: "I am so annoyed that they gave us much shorter period than the previous ones."


last year was till March 13th IIRC"

It was open much earlier, i.e. since Jan 7th. It gave me more push to read more eligible works much earlier too. Dublin was earlier too.

I have read very few books from 2020, so I am not sure I am qualified. But I will think on it.

I'm curious if folks have any thoughts about why Bradley Beaulieu's the Song of Shattered Sands books haven't made it onto the Hugo lists? Could be one of those instances where they aren't very popular, but I'm so enthralled (and they are rated highly on GR) that I wanted to see if y'all had any thoughts? (I'm new to the group, so feel free to tell me this isn't the right place for such questions.)

Hi Rebecca, welcome to the group! It is the first time I've heard about Bradley P. Beaulieu and his work, I guess it is the same to a lot of group's members. There are two main reasons why he hasn't been on the list: [1] there are writers even more popular and [2] he is not popular with Hugo voters. From what I can see from his bio, he hasn't been nominated for any major SFF award, so I guess it is more the 1st reason. After all hugely popular Brandon Sanderson had no Hugo nominations in 2 decades I guess and his fantasy has much higher number of votes than most Hugo winners

Yeah, I've never heard of him either until your comment Rebecca. I don't know if he's that well known among the voting body.

Oleksandr wrote: "It is the first time I've heard about Bradley P. Beaulieu and his work, I guess it is the same to a lot of group's members."

On the Dutch book site where I used to hang around a lot Bradley P. Beaulieu was a name that regularly came back.
His first book is on my TBR-list for ages, but I still have to read it (so many books, so little time).

Just to quickly rush to the Hugo voters' defense: they did give Sanderson two Hugos, one for best novella and one for Related Work (his podcast), both in 2013, and he's also been nominated an additional 6 times (including Stormlight Archive for best series in 2018). What I'd totally love to see is the Archive winning when book 5 is out and the first story arc is completed.

I have Beaulieu's Twelve Kings of Sharakhai as an audiobook and I've heard good things about it (plus gorgeous desert setting), just haven't gotten around to starting it yet. And the Gemmell award he was nominated for is one of my favorites, I tend to like the same books they did. I'm sad it was discontinued.

Thanks all. So many books/authors, so little time. I used to only read Hugo/Nebula books but Beaulieu was recommended by a booktuber I follow and usually see eye to eye with on content. If you'd like to escape the cold winter vibes, these are great books to read, as Eva mentioned - they are set in a gorgeous desert setting.

These situations make me wonder how much I'm missing by sticking to the lists...(coming full circle here) but there is only so much time in a day!

Rebecca wrote: "These situations make me wonder how much I'm missing by sticking to the lists...(coming full circle here) but there is only so much time in a day!

I'd say H/N lists are mostly contain good stuff, so they are definitely better than getting books fully on random. At the same time, there are quite a few novels and authors, which member of this group find underrepresented, with the most prominent example being Adrian Tchaikovsky for SF and maybe Brandon Sanderson for fantasy. I (and several other members) prefer nominees of British BSFA to H/N in recent years, but tastes vary

There are also some significant historical oversights for authors that should have had more recognition, like Octavia Butler and Iain M Banks.

@Rebecca: In addition to Oleksandr:
And there are some members (like me) who really like to discover books that haven't received a lot of ratings here on Goodreads and that therefore doesn't stand any chance to be ever nominated for a Hugo.
By less ratings I mean both books like Fool's Gold (with around 1.300 ratings) as books like Pundragon (with 63 ratings) or The Wound of Words (with only 2 ratings; and yes, I'm still reading the book and I like it, but there are a lot of other books that came in between, I've got a very strange way of reading sometimes).

There are some real gems to be found out there!
Don't miss out on them because they're not on a list.
Just find people with a similar taste like yours (like the booktuber you talk about) and rely on their opinions 😉

*Tau* wrote: "@Rebecca: In addition to Oleksandr:
And there are some members (like me) who really like to discover books that haven't received a lot of ratings here on Goodreads and that therefore doesn't stand ..."

Very good point Tau, and something I will try to weave into my tbr list. Does a thread on lesser known books/authors exists in this group? It might be a bit messy, idk.

Rebecca wrote: "Does a thread on lesser known books/authors exists in this group? It might be a bit messy, idk."

Not that I know of, Rebecca.
But maybe the other members have more information (I'm relatively new here on Goodreads) 😉

If you'd like to discover lesser known works, you can always follow the SPFBO (Self-Published Fantasy Blog-Off).
This is a yearly contest organized by writer Mark Lawrence.
You can find the finalists of 2020 here: http://mark---lawrence.blogspot.com/2...

Another way to discover (sometimes less known) authors is NetGalley.
In exchange for an honest review you can download digital ARC's (advanced readers copy) there.
You can find the US-site here: https://www.netgalley.com/
And the UK-site here: https://www.netgalley.co.uk/
Most of the time the offers are the same, although sometimes they differ. You can search by genre (in the left column you can for example choose 'Sci fi & Fantasy').
If this site interests you and you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask here or pm me 😉

I would like to politely disagree with @Oleksandr. For me personally, the H/N lists became *worse* than random about a decade ago. I ended up reading so many books that wasted a lot of my time. It takes me 10x as long to read a book I do not like as one I like. Thus I have to be very careful because that means a book I don't like displaces 9 books I might have liked in my schedule.

I have found that I now must AVOID the H/N lists unless someone I trust recommends a nominee. Now other people will likely disagree. I am just laying out my personal thoughts/reactions on this. It does not mean I am right or wrong or better or worse.

What H/N nominated stuff hasn't resonated with you, George?

Rebecca wrote: "Does a thread on lesser known books/authors exists in this group? It might be a bit messy, idk.."

I've made a thread for such releases here: https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

George wrote: "For me personally, the H/N lists became *worse* than random about a decade ago. .."

It is not a very rare opinion actually, esp. after Rabid Puppies scandal of 2015 shifted nominees notably to the left. However, my take is that while the best books are still selected, not all the best books and sometimes I think voters try to redeem earlier underrepresentations by giving them a greater weight. My approach is "and this shall pass"

Oleksandr wrote: "Rebecca wrote: "Does a thread on lesser known books/authors exists in this group? It might be a bit messy, idk.."

I've made a thread for such releases here: https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/21..."

Thanks, Oleksandr!

@Kalin

I am not going to answer that question on the grounds that it will make people dislike me.

I will just say that as much as I enjoyed the Leckie Justice series, I would gladly sacrifice it to regain the months I lost on Jemisin's sociopathic earhquake magic trilogy.

George wrote: "I am not going to answer that question on the grounds that it will make people dislike me."

Oh man, I hope you'll reconsider. Disagreement about the merits of different books is the salt of this group: I'd hate to think our members felt the need to censor themselves!

I can go first: while I liked both Ancillary and Broken Earth series, I've too become pretty disappointed with Hugo and Nebula nominees. And it's not just this last decade, either: I think the problems go deeper than that. In short, these awards are very fad-driven: queer fiction is hot nowadays, so majority of the nominated books will be queer fiction. But this is nothing new: in earlier decades it was near-future SF/cyberpunk, or New Wave, or fairytale fantasy, or what have you.

There have been good and less good nominees in the last decade, but I for one am starting to get a bit bored with the sameness of the themes. There are only so many woke books I can read before they start to blend together.

George wrote: "I am not going to answer that question on the grounds that it will make people dislike me.."

You are not a $100 bill to be liked by everyone, as my friend used to say. As long as there is a polite discussion with arguments and no personal attacks and understanding that any opinion (including one's own) is not a gospel truth, a discussion may take place :)

George wrote: "@Kalin

I am not going to answer that question on the grounds that it will make people dislike me.

I will just say that as much as I enjoyed the Leckie Justice series, I would gladly sacrifice it ..."

Hey, I know I made you feel judged when we were discussing Piranesi. So let me reaffirm that that wasn't my intention and I don't want you to feel censored or like you can't share your opinions.

I come from a super conservative, fundamentalist Christian background that was super misogynistic and caused me a lot of pain based on my gender. So I'm really sensitive to it and react strongly sometimes. I'm sorry you were hurt and want you to feel safe to share.

Personally, Broken Earth is my all time favorite, but it isn't for everyone and that's ok. I find the awards to be a mixed bag. There are generally a few nominations that vibe with me and a few that don't. For me they are worth reading on the merit that lots of people enjoyed them and they are likely to be written at a good quality level. But if you notice that you never like them it seems like your tastes are at odds with Hugo voters generally aren't likely to please you. So it makes sense that you avoid them.

Do you dnf much? I've recently realized the power of dnf-ing. It means I don't have to feel nervous about starting something I'm not sure I'll like and it also means I don't get stuck with one book for months. I read more when I dnf because I'm always happy about what I'm reading.