Victorians! discussion

Apologies to all. I’m running late this week. I’ll get the summaries & questions up as soon as I can. In the meantime, feel free to comment on this section.

Update….

Chapter Summaries 36-42

Chapters 36-37
Mrs. Mountstuart arranges to have Vernon take Clara off for a walk after luncheon. She engages Colonel DeCraye in a plan to guide the luncheon conversation and manage the local “cats.” Afterwards, Willoughby realizes that Clara’s private conversation with Mrs. Mountstuart did not go as he had hoped.

Chapters 38-40
Willoughby and Clara discuss Vernon’s marriage before the death of his wife, with Willoughby describing the union as unequal and unhappy. Willoughby begins to consider that “Clara must be given up,” but only if he can be assured that his ego will not suffer. He believes and cannot bear that Clara intends to run off with his dashing friend, Colonel DeCraye, and so devises a plan where Clara is married off to Vernon, whom Willoughby considers a match which will dim her social standing. Willoughby also reevaluates Laetitia as a match more suited to his needs and makes arrangements to meet Laetitia privately. In the meantime an exhausted Crossjay returns and nearly falls asleep in the drawing room when he overhears Willoughby’s proposal to Laetitia Dale. However, Laetitia does not respond as Willoughby expects. Later, Colonel DeCraye catches the boy leaving the drawing room and gives him a place to sleep, but after a few hours rest Crossjay heads off to make the most of his information.

Chapters 41-42
The next day Clara learns that Leticia has left the Hall surprisingly early. She dreads the impending confrontation between herself and her father. When Willoughby discovers Dr. Middleton castigating Clara for breaking her vow, he takes the opportunity to press his suit again, manipulating the situation in his desperation to avoid becoming a failure in the eyes of society. Finally, Clara makes her escape from the harangue of these egoists by promising to return with an answer. In the meantime Crossjay has gone in search of Vernon, but a conversation with Colonel DeCraye gives up the secret of Willoughby’s indiscretion. DeCraye shares the information with Clara, knowing that she can use it to free herself from her unwanted engagement to the man whom he has come to realize is too self-absorbed to be a worthy husband.


Questions
1. How does Mrs. Mountstuart thwart Willoughby’s plans?
2. Were you more surprised by Willoughby’s proposal to Letitia or by her response? What things foreshadowed this turn of events?
3. How is Crossjay’s knowledge likely to affect the other characters?
4. Clara is surprised to hear that Colonel DeCraye has uncovered Willoughby’s true nature. What has exposed Willoughby? For what reasons might this disclosure have previously been the exclusive purview of women?
5. Do you believe that Willoughby will be outed to other characters before the end?

Thanks Renee. I do like to wait for your summaries (it helps to be reminded of what happened within the limits of the 7 chapters) and also like using your questions to give some direction but, I finished and feel like making some initial comments, so here goes:
1) my suspicion of Laetitia in the last section appears to be accurate; she appears to think less of Willoughby, and doesn't want to marry him now. However, her verbal expressions are unclear enough for me to still wonder whether she still loves him despite being more repulsed by some of his personal ethics. Then again, maybe Meredith meant to make her feelings clear but its his verbiage that makes it unclear to me.
2) This section ends with my being very interested in seeing the conversation of Laetitia and Clara. I also like to envision a very pleasant scene with the two of them ganging up on Willoughby. I also envision Dr. Middleton somehow getting out of the way - perhaps hospitalized after injuring himself while over-imbibing wine and port.
3) Many of the characters really, really like Crossjay. He doesn't seem like anything that special to me.

I have updated “message 1” with summaries and questions. Thank you for your patience.

I enjoyed the conversation between Willoughby and Laetitia, as it revealed more about their changing ideas. Willoughby still doesn’t really value Laetitia, except as a model of devotion, in other words in a way that reflects glory to him. He had to remind himself to overlook the fact that her beauty had faded, and to ask her to marry him quickly before he changed his mind again! Laetitia shows some courage and self respect here in refusing Willoughby.

De Craye seems to have picked up the same point, that Willoughby only wants to collect a woman who is a ‘trophy wife’ and will serve him. He recognises that Clara will be unhappy with him, and he will be equally miserable. De Craye is treating this situation more seriously now, before it was like a game.

Crossjay overhearing the conversation and being trapped by De Craye before he can get to Vernon reads like it could have been in a play. There’s that farcical theatrical feel to the coming and goings. Brian questioned Crossjay’s appeal to the other characters - I wonder if it is his innocence and straightforward character that they warm to, compared to all the manipulation and egoism of Willoughby, Dr Middleton etc. Also that they are aware of the appalling rude and inhospitable way Willoughby treated his father - that is mentioned here again by Crossjay so it obviously still hurts - and they feel protective towards him.

Vernon’s marriage was a bit of a shock - did this get mentioned before? I can now understand him being a bit gloomy and wary of getting hurt again.

Brian wrote: "Thanks Renee. I do like to wait for your summaries (it helps to be reminded of what happened within the limits of the 7 chapters) and also like using your questions to give some direction but, I fi..."

I like the idea of Dr. Middleton reaping the grapes he has sown!

The adolescent Crossjay does seem to have less character development than do other characters in Meredith’s hands. I wonder if Meredith had any life examples from which to draw when writing this, or if Cj was just a device?

Pamela wrote: "I enjoyed the conversation between Willoughby and Laetitia, as it revealed more about their changing ideas. Willoughby still doesn’t really value Laetitia, except as a model of devotion, in other w..."

I agree that Willoughby offers Laetitia marriage for all the wrong reasons ... which is a great shame because there are very many right reasons why they are a well suited match ... if Willoughby could be somehow divested of his narcissism. I rather despise both Willoughby and Dr. Middleton after the scene in the library. And Laetitia has further redeemed herself in my eyes after the drawing room. It has taken a lot for Willoughby to finally defeat even her great love for his sorry selfish soul.

“Vernon’s marriage was a bit of a shock - did this get mentioned before? I can now understand him being a bit gloomy and wary of getting hurt again."

I think it was mentioned, but maybe only once in passing. I have a vague recollection of thinking that I had misunderstood and shrugged it off to keep the train of the story. Although I love a good word, I do get lost in some of Meredith’s verbiage.

Renee wrote: " “Vernon’s marriage was a bit of a shock - did this get mentioned before? I can now understand him being a bit gloomy and wary of getting hurt again."

I think it was mentioned, but maybe only once..."

That did seem a very bizarre throwaway conversation, as if Meredith had only just thought of it and put it in at this point, rather than it being part of Vernon's initial character. I wonder if it will get mentioned again?