Reading Envy Readers discussion

Wow, this week will be the end of the book. You should expect all spoilers here.

I'm honestly going to miss my weekends curled up under the covers reading this book!

I am just starting part IX and it is strange as karin comments that this book has become my weekend reading routine. I realise that I haven't commented on partVIII and the remarkable story of lavinia but I am already now into Aaron's tale so will have to pedal backwards before so doing.

I finished it last night! What a work! The research she must have done is staggering. And I learned last night as well that Annie Proulx was in her EIGHTIES when this was published. Do not ever let age get you down!

I noticed Alice posted this in an earlier thread
"What's coming up for me again and again with this is a sense of generational threads being lost. Even when the DNA manages to flow forward, after a couple generations there's little to no memory or understanding of the life experiences that led to the present, despite some assumption on the part of the living that by crafting legacies, they can and will project their own existences into the future. Of course the actions of the living impact the future (mostly negatively, in this book) but the impact is not controlled or managed as we think it can be when do things like plan legacies. The situation is depressing, but also oddly comforting, possibly because looking at things as they actually are is almost always comforting."

I totally agree. It got me thinking of my own family heritage, I know a bit about my great grandparents on one side, but that's as far back as I go.

So much to process here. The loss of natural land, and the role that so many people played in this book towards it. The swiftness of change of fortune--how so little is truly in your control, how your fate can change in an instant and that instant has ripple effects for generations. The loss of familial history, of family bonds.

I felt the ending might have been a little too on the nose, but I think Ms. Proulx deserved the ending she wanted after such an incredible novel.

My favorite section to read was James and Posey. They weren't my favorite people--they were rather awful!--but I found it a delight to read.

Karin wrote: "So much to process here. The loss of natural land, and the role that so many people played in this book towards it. The swiftness of change of fortune--how so little is truly in your control, how your fate can change in an instant and that instant has ripple effects for generations. The loss of familial history, of family bonds.."

I just have the last section left, and yes to everything Alice and Karin said - individuals lost to history, the arbitrariness of fate. I love that we get both the sweep of time over the centuries, and the daily life of so many characters. The contrast is so powerful, it makes me so emotional - I mourn the loss of each character, the ones I love and the ones I don't. And mourn the loss of every tree wantonly destroyed. And I wonder just how different it is today when we treat so many things as disposable and ignore the mountains of trash we create and how it's killing the natural world. I really can't remember a book that made me this emotional. I'm almost afraid of what the last section will do to me ;)

I've also been thinking about Alice's reference to legacies in the context of what's happening today in the US with the removal (finally!) of Confederate statues. How the idea of 'legacy' is so easily manipulated and fraught.

I just realised that I finished last weekend and forgot to post anything about the final two parts. I will echo what karin and nadine have said and throughout have really enjoyed everyone's very insightful comments which have certainly enhanced my reading experience.
I am not sure about how I felt in the end beyond incredibly sad about the destruction of a landscape and people over 300 years and I don't feel that 5 years on from publication the world has learnt any lessons.
The book remained fragmentary until the end with wonderfully drawn characters who deserved a novel in themselves such as Sapatisia but whilst this may be seen as a negative I quickly took this as a series of short stories connected by an overall theme. in the end the overall book was a unique experience and in the end a very memorable read.

Running a bit behind but hope to finish this weekend. Thanks for pointing out that the author was in her 80’s when this was published. Amazing!

I finished this last night and listened to the last chapter twice to make sure I picked up on everything.

I just loved this. The fragility of life was on full display - human and nature alike. The "infinite" tall, strong trees eventually all fell and so did so many of the people, many of who were young, brash, and seemingly indestructible and some were pillars of the business world who couldn't save themselves with their riches. What a brutal time to live and work if you were a physical laborer. An infection or workplace accident could end your life. There were times walking my dog at night when I would exclaim out loud, some of the events were so sad and shocking.

I agree with the comments of Nadine, Karin, and Andrew. It was all so sad. You look at what North America is today and realize that it was literally built by the trees that used to cover the land and other natural resources ripped from the ground. It was sobering to read of the incredible deforestation of North America (and other locations) and other effects of the wave of immigration on this continent through the characters in this book. I've always know of all this but it just felt more poignant while reading this.

Did anyone else have the feeling that the characters in the last section didn't get the same level of attention that the earlier characters got and that the end of the book was a little rushed? It may just be me - at the end of a long book my attention may be weaker and I might have rushed through that part. I should probably read it again.

I just finished the book and I am so awed by Proulx’s accomplishment. I know I’ve said this before but this book has been the exception to my usual distaste for long sagas. I’ve really liked that the characters appear and die so quickly, the years pass; it’s a story of the trees really. And it’s done in such a nuanced way. Humans are awful really in the way we destroy without understanding and are greedy if we can win at others expense, but we just can’t help ourselves and the book has compassion for us. I love that it came full circle at the end with people trying to mend the wrongs. Not just people, but people related to the despoilers, the corporate giants who took down the forests. I’m so happy I read this book.

Nadine wrote: "Did anyone else have the feeling that the characters in the last section didn't get the same level of attention that the earlier characters got and that the end of the book was a little rushed? ..."

I feel like there's a slipping-away quality to the end of the book, like the brushstrokes are very, very light. Throughout the book we get a slipping away through time, but in the end, maybe because the events aren't historical anymore but taking place right here and now, the feeling of slipping away is even more immediate and pronounced.

The people setting out to right the wrongs are so few and so ill-equipped, given the magnitude of the devastation. I feel like the lightness of the author's brushstrokes could also reflect this. She might not want to give any more space to these characters than she does, because to do so could send a false impression to the reader, making them appear more powerful than they actually are, and the environmental situation less dire than it is in reality.

Alice wrote: "Nadine wrote: "Did anyone else have the feeling that the characters in the last section didn't get the same level of attention that the earlier characters got and that the end of the book was a lit..."

What great observations, Alice, thanks! That image of the brush strokes getting lighter is so fitting and reflects our here and now so clearly. I think you're right, if she made the characters at the end strong and powerful it would be a cheap 'happy ending' that would have contradicted and cheapened the message of the book.

I''m a little behind, but just finished. What an impressive work.
To Alice's point about the slipping away quality - I felt it worked - something about the quicker pace as we near the present and look to the future felt like it grasped an element of how the impact of our actions is speeding up - especially when she spoke about going to the ice and seeing the speed of change with the melting.

I'm not used to being in the unpopular opinion role in readalongs, but I had a very different response to Barkskins from the rest of the group: I think it just wasn't the right book for me. Usually if I'm not enjoying a book it's because there isn't enough of a plot to keep me interested, but this was a rare example where the opposite was true: it was just too much plot and period detail for me and not enough character development. To some extent that's part of this particular project: there are many characters that we don't stay with for very long given the span of time being covered. But being around certain characters like Lavinia and James for longer stretches didn't make me appreciate them more. At times it felt to me like the characters were mouthpieces for a modern perspective on ecology and the atrocities committed against native populations rather than authentic individuals in their own right. Part of me thinks Proulx chose to cleave tightly to action and larger themes to avoid having such a long novel across multiple generations become too formless, but I also know that others liked the characters, so I'm not sure if I just made a premature judgment and it was tough to get reabsorbed in the novel after? In any case, I'm still glad I stuck it out given all the interesting historical elements that I wasn't familiar with regarding the timber industry and Mi'kmaq culture.

I did end up liking this book a lot, although it did seem to touch on so many of the characters so lightly. But I agree with Bryn that the book was really about the trees. The consistency of the trees in comparison with the fleeting human lives is a great image. I also agree with Vinny, though, that sometimes the characters were just mouthpieces.

I picked up Overstory by Richard Powers in a charity shop recently and plan to read it very soon but am just on a Friday night sat watching gardeners World on BBC 2 and a special episode on trees and in recognition of the wonder of our read I have copied the link although am aware this may be a problem for non UK readers
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m001...

Vinny wrote: "Usually if I'm not enjoying a book it's because there isn't enough of a plot to keep me interested, but this was a rare example where the opposite was true: it was just too much plot and period detail for me and not enough character development. To some extent that's part of this particular project: there are many characters that we don't stay with for very long given the span of time being covered. But being around certain characters like Lavinia and James for longer stretches didn't make me appreciate them more. At times it felt to me like the characters were mouthpieces for a modern perspective on ecology and the atrocities committed against native populations rather than authentic individuals in their own right. Part of me thinks Proulx chose to cleave tightly to action and larger themes to avoid having such a long novel across multiple generations become too formless, but I also know that others liked the characters, so I'm not sure if I just made a premature judgment and it was tough to get reabsorbed in the novel after?"

I didn't like most of the characters either, and a week out from finishing the book I couldn't tell you the names of the characters I did like without going back and looking them up. This isn't much of an issue for me since I'm really not a character-driven reader, but for those who are--yes, I can see the problem. With respect to plot--because of the episodic, short-story-like structure, I'm not sure I'd describe it as strong in plot, either. The plot is constantly disrupted with threads dropped after nearly every chapter. There are through-lines, but they're more ideological and genealogical than narrative. The story is not cohesive, and there's nothing propulsive and forward-moving to motivate readers to keep going at the end of sections. For this reason I think many if not most of us struggled at times to keep going.

Lately I'm kind of stuck on the Nancy Pearl reading pathways thing, with the four pathways being plot, character, language, and setting. As a language- and setting-driven reader, there's plenty for me in this book, since Proulx hits hard in both of these areas. But Vinny, if your dominant pathway is character (and/or plot), imo it makes perfect sense for this book to not really work for you.

I wonder--do others here subscribe to Nancy Pearl's reading pathways, and identify as character- or plot-driven readers? If so, how does the author succeed (or not) in these areas for you?

I haven't heard of Nancy Pearl's reading pathways Alice, but that sounds like a good approach. I guess it's one of those things where I want all four to be good, but if I could only keep two, it is true, I would keep character and plot. And you're absolutely right regarding how to describe the story in Barkskins - it wasn't what people mean by a "plot-driven novel", but more episodic as you mentioned.

I think a good comparison novel using those four pathways is Where the Crawdads Sing. Very strong on both language and setting, but I wasn't so much a fan of the characters or plot in that one.

It's funny that you bring up the four pathways because I'm usually reading Proulx for her writing and that's not really the focus here. I did have to look up my share of words but that's not the same as a sentence that slows me down in its beauty. Really she wouldn't have had the time for such craftsmanship. Not to sell her short though, did anyone feel the writing was the thing?

I also felt a bit underserved by the last few characters and overall there were so many I fear I'll forget.. I definitely got bogged down in sections of this book but almost enjoyed it more binging the last four sections in the last two days than taking more time - it's just my brain, it can't help it

Something I'm left with at the end is how they are talking about South America and I can't help but wonder if maybe North America could have started with an equally diverse and unique ecosystem but because of the way it was consumed (east to west, huge burns, people without expertise just clear cutting) we never knew it that way, like for a while I thought maybe Proulx was pointing to the irony. Maybe not?

Jenny (Reading Envy) wrote: "It's funny that you bring up the four pathways because I'm usually reading Proulx for her writing and that's not really the focus here. I did have to look up my share of words but that's not the sa..." There were a lot of characters, but for me it ended up feeling like a commentary on the scale of human time vs nature time -- we pass through so quickly compared to the lives of the big trees before they were logged. The South America concept is interesting - I will have to go back and think on that. We did lose so much biological diversity when we clear cut through the forests.

I agree with Laura’s comment that the book was demonstrating how brief human lives are in contrast to the lives of nature, especially trees. I also think that make our crazy destruction of these old trees even more poignant. We’re just a flash in the pan but we can create so much destruction.

I’ll put on my scientist hat to say that I think it’s likely the tropical forests of South America have always had more biodiversity because they are in the tropics. There’s a lot of characteristics of that latitude that contribute to the success of so many species. That said, I think what we did to the forests of N America and Europe is a cautionary tale that we are not heeding in the tropics. And I think Proulx was pointing that out.