J.D. Robb discussion

So there's a thing that I've been doing in some other fangroups that I'm hoping to try out with this group. To explain the definition of headcanon, it's a concept that you have in your head related to a media thing that you follow.

I'll give out the first example of an In Death Headcanon: A lot of you will occasionally complain about Eve's characteristics and mannerisms, whereas in my case it doesn't affect me as much, to the point where I just shrug it off. But then it made me realize that Eve might be like me, someone who is on the High Functioning Autism spectrum, but in her case she hasn't yet been formally diagnosed as such.

Now in Roarke's case, I think he's as good as a soccer player than he would like to admit.

Baxter: with his knack of wearing expensive suits, I think he's probably just as smart as Roarke when it comes to making money. But his desire of being a cop is too strong for him to try out being an entrepreneur.

Those examples are what I call headcannons, if any of you got anything similar feel free to share them.

Let me give this some thought.

Trueheart: I think deep down he wanted to be a priest.

I love the Baxter headcanons.

I would have never thought Trueheart as a priest but now that you've mentioned it it kind of makes sense.

His name, “True-heart” sent me there😏

Another Eve headcannon: a few years ago, a fan group was talking about Delusion and the part where we meet Lowenbaum and how he tried to get closer to Eve. Yes I think they had sex, but I think pre-Roarke, she probably got around a time or two, but not very often.

Edit: Another one came to me about Eve, with the sociological evolution of sexuality, she probably had to gently break it to other females that she was not interested in females sexually.

Thanks for introducing me to something new!

My next Nora ‘s book will be DC detectors

Would anybody be willing to bet that Eve and Roarke probably passed by each other before Naked in Death?

Oh, I’ve thought that many times. I’m hoping one day that there will be a case that connects the dots from the past.

Jonetta wrote: "Oh, I’ve thought that many times. I’m hoping one day that there will be a case that connects the dots from the past."

I would be willing to bet that if it were to happen, Eve will get a case that is so fucked up, it'll make her really dig into the lives of her demon parents and their histories, but also I think it will be when the series as a whole will start to wrap things up. I know some of you don't like to hear that, but it's gonna happen at some point.

Another head cannon I have, this is in regards to Eve and Roarke's sex life. With the deep emotional connection that they have, I think there is some room in their sex life for tenderness and sensuality.

But I'm also of the opinion that there are times where they'll get pretty rough when the night calls for it. For the record, I'm not saying that there's any bondage play between them, but I am saying that there are nights of feral roughness.

One fantasy I had in my head was them having one of those nights at Purgatory in Roarke's private suite, with glass windows around the suite, where Eve and him can see the crowd, but the crowd can't see them. Partial exhibitionism, if you will.

Another headcannon that I've had a few years ago. In 2016, I began listening to the Caitlin Strong series on GraphicAudio. For those that may not know who that is, she is one of the few female Texas Rangers created by Jon Land and that series is still continuing to this day.

The characteristics between Caitlin and Eve were so similar to each other, it's lead me to form this head cannon that Caitlin Strong is Eve's long lost relative because there's no way that Eve's connection to Texas could be a coincidence. Now some of you might ask about the family tree, but I think everybody has had that one bad apple in the family, and Eve was just a victim of those TWO bad apples, but that didn't stop her from getting the same drive for justice like Caitlin Strong did.

If any of you are curious about Caitlin Strong look up Strong Enough to Die and you'll see what I mean.

Indulgence in Death now it's been a long time since I listened to this installment, but this headcanon has been stuck in my head for a few years.

Now we know Roarke to be very primal and adversarial when it comes to Eve, but she has been known to give him a short leash when it comes to retaliating against their enemies (married cop with a billionaire husband can create some very bitter enemies on both classes).

One form of retaliation I think Roarke would've been willing to try out is to get his team of lawyers together and work with every family of the victims that were killed by the antagonists of Indulgence and put them in a class action wrongful death lawsuit.

Being put in jail is one thing, but I think there's room to stick the knife deeper when the antagonists have deep pockets.

I'm not sure that I understand "headcanon." Is this a form of "fanfic" where you create what you think is going on or what you wish is happening in a story, but the author left unclear?

Sharon wrote: "I'm not sure that I understand "headcanon." Is this a form of "fanfic" where you create what you think is going on or what you wish is happening in a story, but the author left unclear?"

The latter and also head cannons is just another word for fan theories.

Here's another fan theory: Secrets in Death, Eve finds out that there are tabloid rags depicting her or Roarke as having affairs with other people and not having a happy marriage.

I think she'd be capable of maybe planning out a prank on the tabloid press, by disguising herself as another woman and being able to seduce Roarke in an open bar or club, and them having a one night stand as a result. They let word go around that Roarke was cheating on Eve, but both of them go on Nadine's show and let the public know that it was Eve playing the other woman and that it was done as a prank against the tabloids.

Post-Conspiracy in Death, and I'm talking about the books Loyalty, Witness, and Judgement: I think there was an air of distrust between Eve and the NYPSD, and to clarify, yeah she may have taken her badge back, but I think there was a big apprehension of whether or not she could trust Whitney, Tibble, and Webster again.

I think Judgement is where the distrust came to a head when Eve and Webster were arguing over Max Ricker, but she learned to let go of the distrust.

Now you guys might ask "Why would she have a distrust at the NYPSD?" After dealing with something traumatic like what happened in Conspiracy, combined with her past as a victim of rape/incest, it would have made her build some walls around her heart, and sure Roarke may have stopped her from completely building those walls, but there were still some walls that she needed to tear by herself and the trauma of seeing Webster being stabbed by Clooney made her realize that.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CbIX9ChNjYk/

This little moment inspired this headcannon: I think McNab and Peabody are closet fans of anime and manga to the point of being otaku (definition: a young person who is obsessed with computers or particular aspects of popular culture to the detriment of their social skills.)

Although I think they are fine with the social skills aspect, because you gotta have them when you're a cop.

So this is a sex question that I was hoping to get opinions on: Pre-Naked in Death, does anybody think that Morris and Eve had sex in the early days?

Nope.

No. Eve mentions a couple times throughout the series that she never thought about Morris as a sexual partner. They are strictly friends.

ElectricOutcast wrote: "Post-Conspiracy in Death, and I'm talking about the books Loyalty, Witness, and Judgement: I think there was an air of distrust between Eve and the NYPSD, and to clarify, yeah she may have taken he..."

Your making me want to reread the early books again. I honestly can't remember them all that well to comment on your observation.

When I was going through book after book in the Hercule Poirot series by Christie, I thought most long running ones would be subject to my enjoyment. After all, I enjoyed reading about all the Holmes stories, and most Arsene Lupin ones. But I was wrong because now I cannot enjoy Inspector Gamache at all and can only love the odd Eve Dallas book. This is how things are for me now. I'm fortunate in the fact that though relatively, few people read books, there are lots of authors and new ones keep popping up.

Luffy wrote: "When I was going through book after book in the Hercule Poirot series by Christie, I thought most long running ones would be subject to my enjoyment. After all, I enjoyed reading about all the Holm..."

Don't take this the wrong way, but that comment had very little to do with my topic. It's about theories that you might have about the characters and the universe of the Eve Dallas/Roarke series.

Eve’s relationship with Morris is special. While both seem to appreciate each other’s physical qualities, they seem to place a higher value on their shared connection to being a stand for victims. Their bond feels somewhat spiritual and a sexual relationship would just mess that all up. I love what they have together but never have felt a whiff of sexual tension.

Maybe so, but I would've liked to see a character who had sex with the protagonist but was adult and mature enough to know that Eve didn't want to go past a one-night stand.

Michelle wrote: Your making me want to reread the early books again. I honestly can't remember them all that well to comment on your observation."

Actually someone brought it up to me that Purity was where the distrust really came to a head when Eve yelled at Whitney over her being dragged into doing a press tour as opposed to doing her job. Which btw, I think Eve should've told Whitney and Tibble that she did not marry Roarke just to become some figurehead for the NYPSD let alone take on the Purity group.

ElectricOutcast wrote: "Maybe so, but I would've liked to see a character who had sex with the protagonist but was adult and mature enough to know that Eve didn't want to go past a one-night stand."

That would be Webster.

Jonetta wrote: That would be Webster.

No he was a whiny-ass

Hahahahaha! You’re right about that😏

Jonetta wrote: "Eve’s relationship with Morris is special. While both seem to appreciate each other’s physical qualities, they seem to place a higher value on their shared connection to being a stand for victims. ..."

Ditto! Exactly my thoughts.

I seem to recall some sexual tension between Lowenbaum, a SWAT commander in Connections in Death. I may be recalling it incorrectly but they may have had a history.

Jonetta wrote: "I seem to recall some sexual tension between Lowenbaum, a SWAT commander in Connections in Death. I may be recalling it incorrectly but they may have had a history."

I didn't mind him as much, on account that he didn't get territorial with Roarke. If anything, I think he could be a good older brother figure.

I've said it many times before that I consider the Eve Dallas/Roarke to be part of the Cyberpunk genre but to be honest, I was trying to figure how to visualize New York City if it were Cyberpunk and this is probably the closest visual I have: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shqMt...

I disagree that there was distrust because of Conspiracy. If Eve said it once, she said it at least 10 times, "It is procedure." She was hurt and afraid, but she understood the process. You mentioned many times that you don't like Conspiracy. I believe what you see is your own prejudice or dislike of the book. That happens to most of us when we hit something that rubs us wrong in a series.

I agree with Michelle, Purity caused some trust issues with Whitney and they both were award of it and why.

Luffy wrote: "I cannot enjoy Inspector Gamache at all and can only love the odd Eve Dallas book. .."

Two of my favorite series. I recently found Gamache and love the series so far. I know I will love Eve and company before the book is released.

I understand where you are coming from, though. There are some long-running series that I stopped reading because they didn't work for me after a time.

Stephanie Plum comes to mind. At the start of the series, I couldn't wait for the next book until I hit number 15 or 16. The series became like a soap opera. The cases were so similar, and the character development was non-existent. Even the funny characters didn't make me laugh. I only read a book in that series if I find it at a flea market.

@Luffy and Sharon,
Our preferences for genres, books and authors change over time as we grow and change. It is only to be expected.

Sharon wrote: "I disagree that there was distrust because of Conspiracy. If Eve said it once, she said it at least 10 times, "It is procedure." She was hurt and afraid, but she understood the process. You mention..."

Agree to disagree if you must, but come on, you seriously believe that she was just going to take her badge back and act like nothing had ever happened? No way, any normal human being would have a hard time trusting their friends after being stabbed in the back like that, every workplace culture has had incidences where friendships have suffered because of drama in the work place. I will give Eve and Whitney credit, that they were headstrong enough to work through that distrust and they are both fine as a result, but if you think that there was no period of distrust, you are lying.

You are right, we will agree to disagree, but that is normal. You and I do not see Eve the same way. She is a cop first. She needs rules to understand how to live her life, especially before she was comfortable in her relationship with Roarke. She trusts Whitney even if he doesn't bend the rules. She understands that.

I prefer not to be called a liar when I am voicing my opinion. This isn't the first time you struck out at me like this. I will not respond to your comments again.

Sharon wrote: "You are right, we will agree to disagree, but that is normal. You and I do not see Eve the same way. She is a cop first. She needs rules to understand how to live her life, especially before she wa..."

Though it went unmentioned, I would say there was a period of distrust. It's pure human nature not to just go back to everything being normal when someone has hurt us. I've had friends hurt me, work colleagues try to screw me over and never put my trust in them again.

Being a cop would make it even worst in my opinion. My Dad worked 34 years in the police and if this happened to him, the sheer betrayal would have burned a lot of bridges.

And take it easy on Seth. He said lying, but I don't think he meant it how it came across.

I was just going to ask that you ease up on accusations here, ElectricOutcast. That’s unacceptable discourse. It’s just not productive to tell someone else how they really feel.

We get how you feel and Conspiracy happens to be one of my most favorite books in the series. And, I share Sharon’s perspective and don’t think I should be considered a liar either.

Emma, thanks for your comment but he needs to speak on his own behalf.

Lauren wrote: "@Luffy and Sharon,
Our preferences for genres, books and authors change over time as we grow and change. It is only to be expected."

Lauren,

I agree totally. I went back and read a book that I gave 5* years ago. I even said I would give it more stars if I could. On the re-read I kept asking myself, "What were you thinking?" 🙂

Sharon wrote: ""What were you thinking?" 🙂.."

I have those. thoughts often, especially about books I read and loved years ago. Now I re-read them and can't help but see all of the truly awful tropes that would totally lead to a DNF today!

Jonetta wrote: "I was just going to ask that you ease up on accusations here, ElectricOutcast. That’s unacceptable discourse. It’s just not productive to tell someone else how they really feel.

We get how you fe..."

Sorry, just wanted to smooth ruffled feathers before a row broke out.

That won’t happen but your desire to help is appreciated.

Lauren wrote: "I have those. thoughts often, especially about books I read and loved years ago. Now I re-read them and can't help but see all of the truly awful tropes that would totally lead to a DNF today! ..."

Outside of this series, I rarely reread but fear some of the earlier romances I read wouldn’t hold up. However! My current reread of the Troubleshooters series is having the opposite effect as I’m listening to the series this time.

Jonetta wrote: "Lauren wrote: "I have those. thoughts often, especially about books I read and loved years ago. Now I re-read them and can't help but see all of the truly awful tropes that would totally lead to a ..."

I'm with you, Lauren! I'm listening to the Troubleshooters this time around and finding my enjoyment level (and rating) to be at least the same...in some of the books, even better.

I've done re-reads of the Troubleshooters a couple of times and you are right they hold up so well! I have never been disappointed.

I've also done re-reads of this series several times. As background, I started reading the series in real time -- so I read Naked In Death in 1995 when it first came out and have been reading the series since then as each installment has come out new. My reaction over the years to the re-reads has been remarkably consistent. My favorite ones are still my favorites and my least liked one are still my least liked ones.

I will say two things about the series that I never gave a thought about before but have begun to grate a bit now and in rereads:

1) Eve's propensity to threaten people with hauling them down to central if they don't answer questions when and where she wants them to. She'll barge into people's workplaces and threaten assistants etc. This was amusing at first, but now it kinda grates.

2) The still referring to IAB as 'The Rat Squad'. It feels disingenuous for someone who is such a good police officer as Eve who wants justice for people and will stand for even the worst sort of victim, to have such a snotty opinion about IAB. Since she is well aware and we've have several books that showcased dirty cops -- cops aren't above being terrible people and also criminals as well, they need police who are able to police other cops. My --not exactly headcannon -- but more like backseat writing (LOL) is that Eve would be uncomfortable about the necessity for IAB and not like it becaue in her world every cop should be ethical and like her, but she wouldn't be as sneery about it as she is written.

Also, speaking of Conspiracy -- It is one of my very favorites. And I agree with the assessment that Eve would have happily taken her badge back with relief at first that she was cleared and maybe some small feelings of betrayal. But she was exonerated. The most important thing is she got her badge back because I think by the time that book came around, NR had more than established that Eve's badge was inextricably tied up in her identity. Police isn't just a job to Eve it is part of her makeup as well.

Well stated, Tina! You make some great points, especially about IAB. I keep thinking that Robb/Nora keeps the same attitude because that still hasn’t changed in present day.

Kudos for having the insight to begin this series in realtime, too!