Never too Late to Read Classics discussion

August is our Mystery, Thriller and Spy Month

Suggested reads are:
The Daughter of Time by Josephine Tey
Our Man in Havana by Graham Greene
The Magus by John Fowles

The Daughter of Time is a 1951 detective novel by Josephine Tey, concerning a modern police officer's investigation into the alleged crimes of King Richard III of England. It was the last book Tey published in her lifetime, shortly before her death.

Our Man in Havana is a novel set in Cuba by the British author Graham Greene. He makes fun of intelligence services, especially the British MI6, and their willingness to believe reports from their local informants.

The Magus is a postmodern novel by British author John Fowles, telling the story of Nicholas Urfe, a young British graduate who is teaching English on a small Greek island. Urfe becomes embroiled in the psychological illusions of a master trickster, which become increasingly dark and serious.

Which one of these puzzling, secretive or exciting novels do you want to read this month?

I'll be reading Our Man in Havana; its many years since I read it, and I can't remember much about it - other than the fact that any book by Green is always a pleasure.

I've read A Daughter of Time twice. It's good.

I plan to read A Daughter of Time as it has been on my TBR since a while and The Magus as it sounds quite intriguing.

I hope to read The Daughter of Time and Our Man in Havana.

I’ve read The Daughter of Time and it’s really good. I think I will read Our Man in Havana!

Glad everyone has picked out something different in this genre. Will be interesting to see how things turn out in our mysteries thrillers!

I have not read any of the suggestions. I have two of them and hope to start with The Daughter of Time to check off a Scottish read as well!

I got the Greene book from the library today. The Classics sign was broken, and had been removed, but fortunately I found a librarian, who directed me to the right place.

That is wonderful Bernard that the Librarian was able to help you locate the book. I find ours very helpful too!

Thank you for joining in with us too!

I've read The Daughter of Time a few years ago- Not sure when I picked up the book, but I really did enjoy my time with it. It was the first time I was introduced to Josephine Tey as a writer.

The other books I don't know about. Though, I do recognise John Fowles. Not sure if I'll pick up the other books or if I will just do a reread of The Daughter of Time. The lead detective reminds me a bit of me, though... It's scary.

Tiffany wrote: "The lead detective reminds me a bit of me, though... It's scary..."

Haha!

Whatever you decide happy to have you join in with us.

Lesle wrote: "Tiffany wrote: "The lead detective reminds me a bit of me, though... It's scary..."

Haha!

Whatever you decide happy to have you join in with us."

I don't think I'd have the patience to try to investigate and solve a historical mystery like the Princes of the Tower. At least Inspector Alan Grant tries his damnedest to do so. ;)

However, I hope that upon my re-read that I'll be able to give this one a solid five stars. I have a better understanding of what happened during the Wars of the Roses and of Richard III. Sad that Josephine Tey isn't as well known as some of her contemporaries- though maybe she's more known in the UK? However, I've noticed that not many people talk about her and she seems to be a very excellent mystery writer.

Hopefully we will broaden some Members thoughts for her.
I had not heard of her till our group mentioned her. Actually I think it was Rosemarie.
She also falls under our Buddy Read for Scottish Authors as Josephine Tey was a pseudonym used by Elizabeth MacKintosh,

Inspector Alan Grant novels:
The Man in the Queue (also published as Killer in the Crowd) (1929)
A Shilling for Candles (1936) (the basis of Hitchcock's 1937 film Young and Innocent)
The Franchise Affair (1948) [Inspector Grant appears briefly at the beginning, mentioned a few times] (filmed in 1950 starring Michael Denison and Dulcie Gray)
To Love and Be Wise (1950)
The Daughter of Time (1951) (voted greatest crime novel of all time by the British Crime Writers' Association in 1990)
The Singing Sands (1952) (turns on the discovery of the lost city of Wabar, based on the legend of Iram of the Pillars)

Stand-alone mysteries:
These novels are set in the same fictional 20th-century Britain as the Inspector Grant novels.

Miss Pym Disposes (1946)[14]
Brat Farrar (or Come and Kill Me) (1949) (the basis, without on-screen credit, for the 1963 Hammer production Paranoiac)

If you have already read The Daughter of Time you are more than welcome to read another of her mysteries and let us know what you think here as well!

Lesle wrote: "Hopefully we will broaden some Members thoughts for her.
I had not heard of her till our group mentioned her. Actually I think it was Rosemarie.
She also falls under our Buddy Read for Scottish A..."

I really wish that Arcturus Publishing LTD brought an entire boxset of the Inspector Alan Grant series. They only came out with The Daughter of Time in a really pretty cover (total cover buy for me), but they didn't publish the remainder of the books. I'd love to have the books in a matching set but it's okay... They usually don't have entire series published unless they feel like they'd sell.

Miss Pym Disposes is a fun read.

I finished The Daughter of Time and found it so interesting because of all the English history. I've never read a mystery where the detective goes back in time to try to solve a case hundreds of years old.

A few years ago I read The Franchise Affair and rated it five stars, which I normally don't do with mysteries. That was another fascinating case so well done.

I'll have to try Miss Pym Disposes.

Just starting Our Man In Havana; I'm sure I read it many years ago but can't remember it. Not that it matters since I don't think I've ever read a Greene novel that I didn't enjoy.

The Daughter of Time

While I do well now realise and accept that Josephine Tey's The Daughter of Time is in many ways rather massively speculative with regard to Richard III and the fate of his two young nephews Edward and Richard, the so-called princes in the tower (the Tower of London, to be exact), I still and always will have both a nostalgic love for The Daughter of Time and yes, indeed, continue to be impressed with and by Josephine Tey's narration and much of her background research (and of course by extension also her main protagonist, detective Alan Grant).

And although I certainly now no longer have the massive literary and historical crush on (to and for me sadly misunderstood and unjustly maligned) Richard III that I had in 1984 (when I was a lonely teenager and read The Daughter of Time for a high school English literature project) I still and nevertheless firmly believe and continue to agree with Josephine Tey and her literary creation Alan Grant that Henry VII actually had considerably more and obvious reasons for wanting the two princes in the tower removed, for needing them to be gone forever than Richard III did (as they in my opinion were much more of a potential obstacle and threat to the former’s path to the English throne than to the latter). For Edward, Richard and their sister Elizabeth had indeed been declared illegitimate by an act of parliament (and whether wrongfully or rightfully does not really all that much matter here). However, after their uncle Richard III's death in battle and the repeal of said very parliamentary act which had declared Edward IV's and Elizabeth Woodville's children illegitimate (and this indeed needed to happen for Henry Tudor to be able to legally wed Elizabeth of York), the two princes in the tower would of course then have been first and second in line to the English throne, and their claim to the British throne was always much stronger and considerably more solid than Henry Tudor's own claim ever was. And with the children of Edward IV and Elizabeth Woodville suddenly no longer illegitimate, young Edward would have of course been king, with his brother Richard his heir apparent (and no, NOT Henry Tudor).

Entertaining, thought-provoking, readable and above all, delightfully fun, I have definitely enjoyed The Daughter of Time as much this time around as in 1984, and yes, I do recommned it warmly and highly to anyone with an interst in historical mysteries, and especially the life and times of Richard III (who might indeed have well been shown a bit too glowingly and positively by Josephine Tey, but who in my mind was most definitely also not the vile and horrid monster as envisioned by Shakespeare).

I read The Daughter of Time because it was the only book of the 3 that was readily available at my library.
I was about 100 pages in before I realized the mystery was actually about Richard III. I thought that was a long diversion from the real mystery. There was no dead body, murder weapon, or list of suspects.
The only Richard III I know is Shakespeare's version. I saw a wonderful performance a few years ago and that has stuck with me. So reading about a different sort of Richard III was intriguing to me. Clearly, as others have noted, Tey did her research for this book.
Glad I got a chance to read Tey. I will have to pick up another mystery by her.

Natalie glad you enjoyed it so much you want to look for another Tey book to read.

With everyone's descriptions it would be hard not to read her mystery!

I finished The Daughter of Time and this is my review.
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

While I didn't love the book, I'd still try another more normal Inspector Grant mystery. I might have liked this one better if I had previous knowledge about him.

Like Manybooks, I did find Tey's identification of the killer and Henry VII/Richard III comparison to be convincing. But then I probably should feel that way after reading this book.

Our man in Havana

This spy story makes an interesting contrast with the James Bond books. Even with the exaggerations of the acerbic humour, it is more realistic. But it is much more than a regular spy story, it is a rich blend of philosophy, psychology, Catholicism, and draughts.

This is the first novel I have enjoyed all the way through for ages. It was more vivid, and it was hard to guess which way the plot was going to jump. The characters felt real: in fact, I would welcome a sequel with Wormald and Beatrice living in England. But failing that, I must be content with reading some more Greene books.

That's good to hear, Bernard.

Brian wrote: "I finished The Daughter of Time and this is my review.
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

While I didn't love the book, I'd still try another more normal Inspector Grant..."

Not sure if this is accurate but I heard that The Daughter of Time is considered a companion story and isn't considered any kind of sequel to the Inspector Alan Grant series. I found that interesting when I read up on the book. Not sure if many mystery writers have companion stories to their detective series- the only time I've seen this play out well was within the realm of historical fiction where authors write companion books to their series from the perspective of other characters.

It's usually done very well but I haven't read any more of Josephine Tey's works and they are incredibly difficult to find in my part of Canada. Not even my library carries her books... or the two other library districts that I have a card at.

That is too bad, Tiffany.

While I've thought about reading another Tey book someday, I have realized that neither of the two I have considered reading, Brat Farrar and Miss Pym Disposes, are Inspector Grant mysteries.

Bernard wrote: "This is the first novel I have enjoyed all the way through for ages..."

Happy that you had a positive read for once Bernard!

Yes, it was a pleasant surprise. I was resigned to a diet of short stories and non fiction. But of course something that is long awaited is extra joyous.

Rosemarie wrote: "That is too bad, Tiffany."

It is a great shame. I feel that more people need to read Tey's works, in my opinion. Do we know if Tey's works have been added to Gutenberg or are they still protected by copyright?

Tiffany, Tey’s work is still under copyright all over the world. Tey died in 1952, and usually books pass into the public domain 70 years after the author’s death.

Finished, and thoroughly enjoyed, Our Man In Havana, which was entertaining and beautifully written.

After we read The Daughter of Time for school and I really loved it, I tried a few of the other series books and did not really find them that good, as for me, the main mysteries I like are historical ones.

John wrote: "Finished, and thoroughly enjoyed, Our Man In Havana, which was entertaining and beautifully written."

Wonderful! We do not expect anything less from Greene.

Well I’d like to read all of these, but I’m going for The Magus as it’s been on my list the longest. I’m so far behind with my group reads, but I’m starting it in August, so I’m taking that as a win at the moment :)

Sounds like a good win!

I read the first book with Alan Grant, The Man in the Queue. It had me guessing with likable characters. I enjoyed it.

Rosemarie wrote: "I read the first book with Alan Grant, The Man in the Queue. It had me guessing with likable characters. I enjoyed it."

That's good, Rosemarie. I hope to get back to Josephine Tey again.

Georgina wrote: "Well I’d like to read all of these, but I’m going for The Magus as it’s been on my list the longest. I’m so far behind with my group reads, but I’m starting it in August, so I’m taking that as a wi..."

That is a win, Georgina. I had planned on reading Our Man in Havana but didn't get to it yet!

I just started Our Man in Havana and I am really enjoying it so far!

Good to hear, Nora.

Kathy wrote: "Good to hear, Nora."

Thanks so much, Kathy.

I’m still reading Our Man in Havana and I’m not sure how to feel about this chapter on American bankers vs. British Bankers. It seems to discuss harsh feelings because the British lost the Revolutionary War., but I’m not sure. Does anyone else have any thoughts on this?

I’m not going to finish Our Man in Havana because I’m worried that it’s going to effect my mental health because one of the characters has something similar to what I have.

It is ok Nora.
Sometimes a book just is not for us.

A return to the Hobbit might be what is needed! :)

Lesle wrote: "It is ok Nora.
Sometimes a book just is not for us.

A return to the Hobbit might be what is needed! :)"

Thanks so much for understanding, Lesle. I think I will return to the Hobbit! :))

I’ve enjoyed other books by Greene more than Our Man in Havana, especially The Quiet American.

Rosemarie wrote: "I’ve enjoyed other books by Greene more than Our Man in Havana, especially The Quiet American."

I enjoy The Quiet American too. I also have End of the Affair that I haven’t read yet.

Rosemarie wrote: "I’ve enjoyed other books by Greene more than Our Man in Havana, especially The Quiet American."

My feeling was that although both are about espionage - they are totally different; I thought The Quiet American was a superb and serious novel, while in Our Man in Havana he couldn't resist - particularly given his own background - having a satirical and hilarious dig at the secret services.

I thoroughly enjoyed them both, but I've yet to read a Greene book that I haven't enjoyed, so I'm probably not the most objective judge!

I agree with you all! The Quiet American is a superb book! I enjoyed it so much.