Read Women discussion

Happy New Year, members!
March 2024 nominations are open.

Fiction: feminism
Read Around the World (RATW): Wales or Ireland

Nominations will close January 8th when the polls go up.

Criteria:
1. Book must be by a female author ( trans women and women using male pseudonyms are women).
2. No books that have already been group reads within the past 3 years/36 months (check the group's bookshelf).
3. Do not nominate a book you have written or for which you are the publicist or lead marketer.
4. Consider availability. If a book is available in the US and UK (at minimum), and in paperback and ebook formats, more members can participate than if not.

To Nominate:
1. Give both the title of the book and the author's name when nominating to avoid confusion. Please use the 'add book/author' button when nominating.
2. Indicate whether you are willing or not to lead discussion if your nomination is chosen.
3. Maximum - one nomination per member, per category.

Nominations so far:

Feminist fiction:
-All You Have to Do Is Call by Kerri Maher, Gail W
-Sabrina & Corina by Kali Fajardo-Anstine, Jen
-How Not to Drown in a Glass of Water by Angie Cruz, Carol
-The Pull of the Stars by Emma Donoghue, Stef
-The Women's Room by Marilyn French, Lyn

RATW Wales/Ireland:
-No Refuge by Nicola Clifford, Wales, Gail W
-Neon Roses by Rachel Dawson, Wales, Carol
-A Book of Migrations: Some Passages in Ireland by Rebecca Solnit, Ireland, Jen
-A Line Made By Walking by Sara Baume, Ireland, Naomi

For the fiction choice I wish to recommend All You Have to Do Is Call by Kerri Maher, a historical fiction about the Jane Collective from the 1970's.

For Read Around the World, I recommend No Refuge by Nicola Clifford. This is the first in a mystery series based in mid-Wales by a Welsh author.

I can lead for both.

I nominate Sabrina & Corina, short stories by Kali Fajardo-Anstine for Fiction:Feminism.

For feminism, I nominate How Not to Drown in a Glass of Water by Angie Cruz.

For Wales, I nominate Neon Roses by Rachel Dawson.

I can lead.

For feminism I nominate The Pull of the Stars by Emma Donoghue I could lead if needed. If my nomination doesn't win you should all read it anyway (but warning it is sad)

For Wales/Ireland, I'd like to nominate A Book of Migrations: Some Passages in Ireland (nonfiction) by Rebecca Solnit.

A Line Made By Walking by Sara Baume for Around the World/Irish Author category.

Naomi wrote: "A Line Made By Walking by Sara Baume for Around the World/Irish Author category."

Ah! I read Seven Steeples by her, wonderful book!

I’ve been curious about her- have Handiwork on my bookshelf awaiting me!

Loving Carol’s noms too. My heart kinda skipped a beat when I saw the Cruz nominated. Really been interested in that one.

Jen wrote: "Loving Carol’s noms too. My heart kinda skipped a beat when I saw the Cruz nominated. Really been interested in that one."

Thanks, Jen. I had the same response to your solnit nom.

These are just a wonderful set of nominations so far. I'd be happy to read any of them.

I've read "Sabrina and Corina", "How Not to Drown in a Glass of Water" and "The Pull of the Stars" already, and highly recommend all of them. A Line Made By Walking sounds intriguing and I've added to my TBR!

Carol wrote: These are just a wonderful set of nominations so far. I'd be happy to read any of them."
My thought too Carol! I've read a couple of the noms already but what a great selection for March.

I'd like to nominate Juliet Takes a Breath by Gabby Rivera for feminism. It explores the intersectionality of feminism. I'm unsure if I could lead discussion, probably not though.

(Also for the OP, it's trans women. Trans is used as an adjective, an additional descriptor that isn't necessary since trans women are women. Transwomen is an antiquated term which denies full womanhood by reducing it to something "other" altogether. It's nowadays used as a slur and I'd appreciate if it'd be possible to take note of that for future posts.)

Ryo wrote: "I'd like to nominate Juliet Takes a Breath by Gabby Rivera for feminism. It explores the intersectionality of feminism. I'm unsure if I could lead discussion, prob..."

Thank you for providing that information. I'm certain the moderators will adjust the descriptor in the instructions for future months. I understand that the information is there to provide clarity for people that may not be certain about which authors might be included under the concept of "women authors". In the group we are very open to all and I have never witnessed any attacks on any people, religions, races, genders etc. We are also members of all age groups so not all of us may be fully up to date about terminology. I hope that you have not been offended by the misuse of the word.

We are also members of all age groups so not all of us may be fully up to date about terminology. I hope that you have not been offended by the misuse of the word.

Of course! It happens and I fully understand since terminology is ever changing, even more so given that transwomen used to be a valid standard terms just a few years ago. Merely wanted to point it out since I was caught off-guard and had to do a double take. Thanks for your understanding!

Ryo wrote: "I'd like to nominate Juliet Takes a Breath by Gabby Rivera for feminism. It explores the intersectionality of feminism. I'm unsure if I could lead discussion, prob..."

Thank you for sharing this insight Ryo. I wasn't aware of this but it totally makes sense. Also - great nomination!

Thanks Ryo, although see you are in Germany and the ways in which gender terminology is deployed does vary in different cultural settings, so here in the UK have friends who would define themselves in the way you describe but also those who prefer to incorporate 'trans' as for them it's an important part of their identity which they want to assert/have acknowledged, partly because it signals their specific experience/history, dealing with particular forms of oppression etc Also those who just prefer to be known simply as women/men. But I agree in general using trans as an adjective is preferable.

I really didn't mean to derail this thread so you have my apologies! I currently do live in Germany, but I'm aware of international experiences, partially due to my past and current community affiliations.
And you're completely right! Transman and transwoman as term are used as labels by trans people who want to signify their gender identity while affirming their past. It's just getting problematic when people use them as general terms to describe all trans people as it can be seen as quite offensive by trans people who do not want to highlight their past hence these terms also primarily being used for generalization by TERFs to trigger dysphoria in some. Hence these terms being regarded as slurs due to the malicious intentions.
Additional resources which could be helpful (in case there's an interest):
https://glaad.org/reference/trans-terms/
https://www.etsu.edu/equity/mcc/progr...

Ryo wrote: "I really didn't mean to derail this thread so you have my apologies! I currently do live in Germany, but I'm aware of international experiences, partially due to my past and current community affil..."

As a queer, woman of colour I get that! Although I wouldn't personally use the term 'TERF' as a way of referring to gender-critical women despite my disagreements, as it is considered/experienced as "abusive" by many people here, and I see no need to use potentially offensive terminology to put forward my views. I'm an atheist but would not use the term 'God botherer' to refer to Christians for similar reasons.

Sorry for all the edits, new laptop has different keyboard spacing and it's throwing off my touch typing!

Oh, I'm really sorry about it! Noted.
So far seen it as pretty straightforward - a feminism approach that excluded trans identities, but if it's considered abusive and derogatory then I'll instead use gender-critical for it. Again, really sorry about it. Thank you for explaining it!

I persist in nominating "The Women's Room" by Marilyn French for feminist fiction, and I can lead.

TERF = derogatory, gender-critical=better, this info is new to me, appreciate that, Alwynne.
Saying “trans women” as opposed to “transwomen” makes sense.

Perhaps we just shouldn't label people. We are living in a time of progression and I think that we should respect people's right to ask questions, particularly on some of the more complex issues that are relevant to the discussion of gender. Not everyone is coming from a negative or unaccepting position. What is important is that everyone is respectful when they approach these matters.

To be honest, I don't think that gender-critical is much better because it still has a negative connotation-

Labels can just be necessary shorthand to describe a certain set of characteristics - do you have a preference for how we can refer to TERFs/gender critical people, or do we just have to avoid talking about them altogether?

To that point, if a word describing a group of people has a negative connotation, maybe it's because the individuals described by that term have a real-world negative impact on others' ability to live safely and happily. If that makes you feel bad, maybe it should. Will we start calling misogynists 'women critical'? I'm guessing not...

Moderators, please feel free to kick me out of here, I was going to add some nominations but I don't think this corner of the internet is for me.

Well we surely don’t want to be offensive, so thank you Ryo for pointing that out. We will edit future posts. And thank you everyone for the respectful conversation that stemmed from her sharing. We can definitely pick this topic up somewhere else if anyone wants to continue, but let’s try to re-focus here back to March nominations please.

Thank you everyone!

*eta: I’ve changed the original post to trans women, and hope this is correct. If there’s a better way to say what we’re trying to say please educate me. Thank you.

Ash wrote: "Labels can just be necessary shorthand to describe a certain set of characteristics - do you have a preference for how we can refer to TERFs/gender critical people, or do we just have to avoid talk..."

Well we could start from the issue of accuracy, as my GC colleagues have pointed out to me, one a devout Muslim, one a devout Christian, they hold essentialist beliefs about sex versus gender, which are borne out of their religious beliefs - this is not to say all Muslims and all Christians take the same stance - and there are many gender critical people who are similar i.e. not linked to feminist movements radical or otherwise. So the term "TERF" is misleading when applied in a blanket sense as it often is.

My colleagues and relatives who are also deeply religious attempt to respect my identity as queer. They don't use terms I find offensive, and they respond to my objections when they say things I find uncomfortable, similarly I do what I can to respect their right to their beliefs - which, like my identity, are protected under English law as recent court cases have made clear - and although I don't hesitate to make my disagreement plain I do that in terms that are not immediately going to make them feel attacked.

I also know people who are not in any way gender critical but are anti-choice - as someone who is firmly pro-choice that is also a problem for me. I could, of course, cut off all communication with anyone whose beliefs don't entirely align with mine and label them as enemies - although not sure how that would work to open up dialogue or debate. Although if I did that it would also include most if not all white people, as I've never yet encountered one who hasn't uttered at least one thing I experienced as racist even if on the most "benign" level. I choose not to do that, instead I consider individuals and their allegiances, and what I know of them and make decisions accordingly, so I still, for example, interact with the neighbour who initially referred to me as 'coloured' but was prepared to listen to why that wasn't on, but not with the guy down the road with far-right affiliations. I could of course cursed her out for being a "racist cunt" - and for some gender critical people being called a 'TERF' is the equivalent of that - but instead ended up opening up a dialogue which has turned out to be positive for me and for her. But I completely cut off a previous neighbour who delighted in telling me that two women having sex was a filthy act and expressed concerns that she might hear me through the walls - probably politic not to repeat what I said in response, although it was enough to ensure she kept well clear of me.

I also find it interesting that 'TERF' is such a ubiquitous term since it is almost routinely associated with older women and a particular brand of second-wave, radical feminism - even though reading any decent history of feminism in the West would make it clear the rad fems were only one grouping among many such as socialist feminists and Marxist feminists. So, from what I have learnt, there is often more than a hint of laziness, misogyny and casual ageism invoked by the term 'TERF'.

Thank you Alwynne for taking the time to write this.

Thanks Alwynne, I appreciate your explanations. You've given me food for thought.

Nominations are closed and the polls are up. Please vote by next Monday, the 15th

https://www.goodreads.com/poll/list/1...

Just a reminder to vote by the end of the weekend

We will be reading All You Have to Do Is Call by Kerri Maher, and A Book of Migrations: Some Passages in Ireland by Rebecca Solnit

Book of Migrations sounds good, but my library has only other books by her (at least that!).

The Solnit is also available free online at Open Library. I believe signing up for access may be necessary.
I really prefer actual books but I also don’t like having or buying lots of stuff so lately I read a lot of short stuff on this site.

https://openlibrary.org/works/OL12439...

Thanks Jen!