The Readers Review: Literature from 1714 to 1910 discussion

This section was slow, in my opinion, until we got to the convent. We find Odo in Naples, two years after the events of the previous section.

Do you have any opinions of the Abate de Crucis, the Procuratessa Bra, or Marquis de Coeur-Volant?

What does Odo like and dislike about Venice?

What was unique about the convents in Venice?

We end this section with a dramatic “jailbreak” of Fulvia from the convent. What did you think of Sister Mary and the various scenes?

Lori wrote: "Do you have any opinions of the Abate de Crucis, the Procuratessa Bra, or Marquis de Coeur-Volant?.."

Actually I don't. But I chose to comment anyway because the reason I don't have anything to say is that, after finishing the section, the characters once again blurred together for me. As I commented in a previous section, when Odo is traveling around, the names and settings start becoming jumbled and the story loses its focus for me. But, as you said:

Lori wrote: "This section was slow, in my opinion, until we got to the convent. .."

The story and characters certainly became clearer and better when the story stopped moving around and settled into the convent escape plot. I found Sister Mary an interesting character whose actions kept Odo more mystified than me about her intent. I enjoyed the convent scenes, especially those with Sister Mary. The Odo/Sister Mary dialogue had more spark than the Odo/Fulvia ones did.

I certainly agree that the story becomes more engaging once Fulvia re-enters it. Odo becomes a more fully realized character then, although I wouldn't rank him as a memorable one. Perhaps (I hope) that will change.

Is Odo's infatuation with Fulvia a case of love-at-first-sight, and/or has he idealized her as the daughter of Professor Vilvaldi, the scholar he so admired? Does his caring for her alleviate his guilt about the Professor's unfortunate end. Odo is attracted to Fulvia, but does he also feel responsible for her? Does Odo actually have any complex feelings? In any case, it's not at all clear that Fulvia is similarly attracted to him, although I assume we all expect that to change.

I don't have much of an opinion of the Venice characters either other than Sister Mary, who was fun.

Yeah, Odo's not a very memorable character, is he? Perhaps it's something to do with being pushed into a role from a young age (but in this book, who isn't?), but he seems to soak up the opinions of whoever he's been around most recently.

Even though the setting of the novel is historical, it's clearly a work of Wharton's fertile imagination, and in this week's reading it struck me that she set out to shock her Guilded Age readers. The obscene extravagances, the wastefulness, the shallowness, the selfishness and self-absorption, the blind eye to poverty and suffering, not to mention the vices and the megalomania of the church are all appalling. If this novel were to be re-written in the 21st century, I'd expect there'd be a lot of sex and drugs.

That said, I'd like to turn to Brian E. to put what I call shocking in the context of her other novels. Was Wharton not only writing imagined history, but also saying something about her own time?

Gary wrote: "I'd like to turn to Brian E. to put what I call shocking in the context of her other novels. Was Wharton not only writing imagined history, but also saying something about her own time?"

I'm not sure. It's her only historical novel. In looking at her other works for insight, many of her novels and novellas could technically be called historical novels too. They were written between 1900 and 1930 and set back some 10 to 50 years previously, during the Gilded Age of 1870 through 1900.
In her Gilded Age works, Wharton sometimes merely portrayed her own upper class society, sometimes offered social criticism and commentary largely critical of her class, but always used great character portraits both of victims (Lily Barth of House of Mirth) and encouragers (Undine Spragg) of the societal pressures.

Her novels of the 1920s after The Age of Innocence did offer commentary on the excesses of the contemporary time of the Jazz Age and resembled F. Scott Fitzgerald works. However, I don't remember depictions of obscene extravagances, or much sex and drugs. Whatever sexual situation shown were never explicit or shocking as a D.H. Lawrence or even an Emile Zola.

So, no I don't see Wharton as being a writer who has a strong interest in shocking the reader. The closest I find to shocking might be her depiction of the excesses of the 1920s culture in Twilight Sleep, which touches on drug use, but that was written as a tongue-in-cheek satire.

I really haven't be able to find a connection between this book and Wharton's books about either the Gilded Age or contemporary New York. I don't think she's saying much about her own time. I'm probably wrong because I can't think of any other good reason to write a historical novel, something she doesn't have a strong interest in doing. It seems to have given her free reign to be more melodramatic than writing about a time period she actually lived in.

Thank you Brian. Your perspective on this novel in the context of the other Wharton novels you've read is appreciated. I've changed my mind about calling some elements of the novel shocking. The word you use, melodrama, is better.

On a lark, I thought to ask Google AI why Wharton wrote Valley of Decision.

Here's the reply: "Wharton used this setting and character to examine broader themes of social reform, personal responsibility, and the struggle between old and new ideas, drawing parallels to her own life and the societal changes she witnessed."

It goes on to say there are "parallels between Odo's internal struggles and Wharton's own experiences. She was a woman of her time, navigating social expectations and personal desires."

Not definitive certainly, but interesting nonetheless.

Actually AI makes sense in this case. As I said, I really couldn't see any good reason for Wharton to write this except to apply it to her own time. It's just that I couldn't see it. While I certainly did see Wharton's criticism of the Italian society and especially the church in this book, I didn't see it as being a similar type of social criticism and commentary that she used in her other novels. The foreign setting and melodrama hid it from me.

I have read in various places that The Valley of Decision was a popular novel. My guess is that this popularity was because most readers loved the escape into 18th Century Italy and, like me, did not make a connection that Wharton's addressing of social reform in 18th Century Italy was intended as a commentary on the same themes in her present day New York society.

Thanks to Brian E for all the insight into Wharton's works.

I'm not sure if Odo's feelings for Flavia would stand the test of time in a modern world, but I feel certain they will in this imagined world. The novel has certainly picked up with these chapters. Flavia is an intriguing character - beautiful, intellectual, dedicated to the ideals of her father, which are the same ideals that Odo espouses. I can only hope that the rest of the story continues to be as fast-paced.