The Catholic Book Club discussion

6. Ystevan has a very black and white view about whether Serapia’s father should be healed, while Serapia believes in second chances. Whose viewpoint do you sympathy most with and why?

This question was provided by Corinna Turner.

According to Matthew 12:31, there is one unforgivable sin: blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. What's blasphemy against the Spirit? According to some, the total lack of love; according to others, attributing to Satan the deeds of the spirit.

(view spoiler)[Performing [black] magic to save the life of a beloved person could be considered a case of the unforgivable sin; on the other hand, it may not fulfil the condition of "total lack of love." (hide spoiler)]

My personal viewpoint accords more with what Serapia believes, in this case.

I've read that the "unforgiveable sin" is believing that God is incapable of forgiving whatever sin you have committed. It's saying, my sin is so heinous that God cannot - not merely *will not*, but cannot - forgive it. That's the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.

Larry wrote: "I've read that the "unforgiveable sin" is believing that God is incapable of forgiving whatever sin you have committed. It's saying, my sin is so heinous that God cannot - not merely *will not*, bu..."

Yes, theologians do not agree about what's the unforgivable sin. There are almost as many interpretations as theologians.

According to the Catechism of the Catholic Church (#1864) blasphemy against the Spirit means rejecting God's mercy. Refusing to repent.

(view spoiler)[According to this definition, obviously what Serapia's father did is not the unforgivable sin, for he repented. (hide spoiler)]

Manuel wrote: "According to Matthew 12:31, there is one unforgivable sin: blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. What's blasphemy against the Spirit? According to some, the total lack of love; accordi..."

Here I do agree with the Professor, and my point of view, although I haven't started reading the novel yet, is closer to Serapia's than to Ystevan's. What I had heard, and I'm telling this because it's an interesting discussion I had with my friend, the novelist Ana Estelwen, is the subject of demonic pacts. At first, I did believe in whatLeonardo Castellani proposed using literary archetypes: Tenorio, who exemplified lust, although he can also be the blasphemer; Hamlet, who embodies doubt about whether they could achieve eternal salvation if they repented; but Faust Faust was impossible to achieve eternal salvation; and a person who has made pacts with the devil can no longer be saved. Like C.S. Lewis, she was very hostile. On the other hand, Ana, alluding to Father José Antonio Fortea, believes that it is possible.

Manuel wrote: "Larry wrote: "I've read that the "unforgiveable sin" is believing that God is incapable of forgiving whatever sin you have committed. It's saying, my sin is so heinous that God cannot - not merely ..."
Thinking that when one sins one is already condemned leads us to very serious heresies: Montanism, Novationism, and Donatism, which have been condemned by Holy Mother Church.

Fonch wrote: "...a person who has made pacts with the devil can no longer be saved."

I find this assertion too strong. Cannot a person who has made a pact with the devil repent of having made it?

In the case you mention (Goethe's Faust) I don't think it's clear that he repented.

Manuel wrote: "Fonch wrote: "...a person who has made pacts with the devil can no longer be saved."

I find this assertion too strong. Cannot a person who has made a pact with the devil repent of having made it?
..."
Actually,Leonardo Castellani mentions it, and there are several Fausts, that of Doctor Faustus and Other Plays Christopher Marloweand that of Johann Wolfgang von Goethe. In the first case, there is a willful guilt. I have always preferred other Fausts: The Wonder-Working Magician by Pedro Calderón de la Barca (based on a true story, Saint Cyprian, not to be confused with the Bishop of Carthage), "The Wild Ass's Skin" by Honoré de Balzac, and my favorite, "The Picture of Dorian Gray" by Oscar Wilde And one of my favorite stories that is relevant to this discussion is "The Fisherman and His Shadow." For the German Romantics, the shadow and the reflection are the soul. See the work of Adelbert Chamisso and E.T.A. Hoffmann. I talked about this topic in the last video on my YouTube channel, a review of "The Dog in The Manger" by Lope de Vega.

For video game lovers, one of the subplots and quests in Baldur's Gates: Shadows of Amn, called Throne of Bhaal Baldur's Gate 2: Throne of Bhaal Prima's Official Strategy Guide , uses both authors for a quest. Baldurs Gate II Shadows Of Amn Game manual is my favorite video game.

Manuel wrote: "Fonch wrote: "...a person who has made pacts with the devil can no longer be saved."

I find this assertion too strong. Cannot a person who has made a pact with the devil repent of having made it?
..."
Apart from the fact that there are many authors who are very critical of Johann Wolfgang von Goethe's Faust, among them C.S. Lewis, for example.

Manuel wrote: "Fonch wrote: "...a person who has made pacts with the devil can no longer be saved."

I find this assertion too strong. Cannot a person who has made a pact with the devil repent of having made it?
..."

He can, see Blessed Bartolo Longo.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartolo...

I agree with Larry.
I just don't understand Ystevan's adamant stance here. The God we worship can forgive any sin IF asked by the sinner himself!
But it's not clear to me that the God of Serapia and the God of Ystevan are the same as each other and the same God in whom the Church believes. For example, the heartfelt "Help, help, help" that Serapia utters several times sounds like a prayer to God, but it's always Ystevan who comes to her rescue, and she seeks healing from an elf, not directly from God. Are the elves the only Savior for her and her family?

Jill wrote: "I agree with Larry.
I just don't understand Ystevan's adamant stance here. The God we worship can forgive any sin IF asked by the sinner himself!
But it's not clear to me that the God of Serapia an..."

It becomes easier to understand Ystevan's stance after the final chapters. I think it's because these elves are so different from us, and the story makes the point that, once they turn evil, they almost never come back to virtue — so, from their point of view, humans most probably would fall again after a sin so grievous as sorcery.

Jill wrote: "I agree with Larry.
I just don't understand Ystevan's adamant stance here. The God we worship can forgive any sin IF asked by the sinner himself!
But it's not clear to me that the God of Serapia an..."

In regard to God's aid in healing Lord Alban, the saints always taught that, in cases like these, we should seek every human means imaginable, even when we hope for a miracle. If elves received healing powers naturally (or supernaturally) from God, Serapia would be right in reaching for their help.

Jill wrote: "But it's not clear to me that the God of Serapia and the God of Ystevan are the same as each other and the same God in whom the Church believes. For example, the heartfelt "Help, help, help" that Serapia utters several times sounds like a prayer to God, but it's always Ystevan who comes to her rescue, and she seeks healing from an elf, not directly from God. Are the elves the only Savior for her and her family?"

Knowing Corinna, I'm sure that "the God of Serapia and the God of Ystevan are the same as each other and the same God in whom the Church believes."

Whenever we ask for God's help, quite frequently it's someone else who comes to our rescue. God has given human beings the huge dignity of acting as his hands to help our neighbors.