Catching up on Classics (and lots more!) discussion

This the thread for the August-September 2026 buddy read of Tigana by Guy Gavriel Kay

I'm really looking forward to this one. I first read it in high school. I was visiting a friend's house, and she got a phone call, so I picked up a random book on her floor and started reading. I'd never heard of Guy Kay. I just read the prologue, which is what, 3 or 4 pages long maybe? I was crying by the end of those few pages. Guy Kay remains my favourite fantasy writer to this day. I've attended his book readings a few times, and have signed copies of some of his books from those occasions.

I have one book to finish first, but I expect to be able to start this one in the next few days. Thanks for suggesting it, Teri-K, it's been too long!

Now that I've finished Bleak House I feel free to pick this one up. I first read it about 15 years ago, when my husband died after 3.5 years when he was brain damaged and I was his full time caregiver. Then I lost my parents , too, and for a while I was so exhausted and stressed I couldn't read anything.

I started listening to audiobooks on Libby and eventually picked this one because it was long. haha I loved it so much I immediately bought the book and read it right after, which I've never done before or since.

I remember being caught up in the questions of right, the greater good, personal responsibility... So much to think about. I'm eager to dip into it again and see what we both think now after so many years.

It has been a few years since I last read this one. Like Wobbley, this is one of my favorite fantasy authors.

Teri-K, I hope the read this time around brings you good memories to go with the hard ones.

Teri-K wrote: "Now that I've finished Bleak House I feel free to pick this one up. I first read it about 15 years ago, when my husband died after 3.5 years when he was brain damaged and I was his full time caregi..."

This sounds impossibly hard, Teri-K. It's not much consolation in comparison, but at least this tortuous path led you to an excellent book.

I just read the prologue. I cried again.

I never read fantasy, but I am not going to pass on a book that made Wobbley cry twice. I have asked for the library to get me a copy. Not sure how present I will be, but I will check in as I can.

I have read a number of GGK books but have saved this one and will be starting in a few days.

Sara wrote: "I never read fantasy, but I am not going to pass on a book that made Wobbley cry twice. I have asked for the library to get me a copy. Not sure how present I will be, but I will check in as I can."

I hope I'm not overselling it! :)

Yay, I'm glad so many people are joining this one.

After a couple of months where I have barely had the time/energy to read at all, I’m so looking forward to reading this book with all of you. Teri-K I’m so sorry you had to go through all that, but I’m glad that this book found you at a time when you needed it. I first read it maybe 20 or 25 years ago. Like Wobbley, I definitely cried in the first few pages, and expect to do so again (not for the only time in this book). Guy Kay is also one of my very favorite fantasy authors (or perhaps even just one of my very favorite authors, without the genre qualification needed) and I’m looking forward to reading this book again and seeing if it still holds up all these years later. I suspect it will. Hoping to start on it in the coming days.

This post has spoilers for the first 3 chapters

It's been a long time since I read this, so I don't remember all the details, though I remember the broad strokes of the book.

I'm not surprised that the prologue made me cry again -- that's a very strong 5 pages! It's pretty impressive that he can get readers to tears in so little time with characters we don't know. I find the writing in this section quite beautiful.

The first two chapters are mainly introducing us to some characters and the basics of the politics in this land. In the troupe (chapters 2 and 3), so far I'm starting to like Devin and Alessan (the piper) and Eghano (the very chill drummer). I also quite liked Rovigo from the bar, and I hope he'll turn up again.

I don't recall whether there's a point to the characters in the first chapter, or whether they were just there to introduce the region's politics and culture. Will Adreano become an important character? Is the unnamed stranger someone we know -- maybe Alessan? I don't remember, so time will tell.

The sex scene. Well, I never enjoy Guy Kay's sex scenes, but this one was a lot more benign than some (possibly because it's an early book from him, before he started getting carried away??). It's a suspect decision to add a scene like this so early, before we are attached to the characters. But what I like about it is that we learn by the end of the chapter that it's not gratuitous or idle sex; it was initiated intentionally as a distraction technique.

My favourite quote so far (yes, it's full of flowery fantasy stuffs, but the underlying sentiment is so right):

In mourning Sandre, Duke of Astibar, they mourned -- as was proper -- the dying of all the Triad's mortal children, brought through Morian's portals to move on Adaon's earth under Eanna's lights for so short a time. So sweet and bitter and short a season of days.

This post has spoilers through chapter 5.

Chapter 4 is the one in the hunting lodge. After the very strong prologue the first few chapters were really just setting the stage. I feel like chapter 4 is where the book starts getting pretty riveting, at least for me. We find out that Alessan is an important character, and we find out about a few conspiracies. Alessan feels very reassuring, like he has most situations in hand and is probably a good leader. I'm a bit sad that Tomasso doesn't look like he's going to get out of this; I was starting to like him. And I kind of liked his co-conspirators too.

Chapter 5 is interesting. We find out the premise of the book, in the sense of learning what is driving these characters. What I find interesting is that at first glance, it's almost a bit "so what?". Why can't they just use a different name for their province and cities? Surely the loss of all those people is more important, and securing the safety of the remaining people should be a higher priority for the prince than restoring a lost name. But. I feel like this is about how important symbols are to us. It's about what it means to lose not only people but a culture. It's about the power of memory, and about how much bigger and more tragic a loss is if it can't even be remembered. (Plus, honestly, Alessan's goal, should it be achieved, is also going to be better for the remaining people.) I also didn't at all see coming who the 6th person at the meeting was going to be. Sneaky.

Well, obviously I'm enjoying this so far.

This post has spoilers through chapter 6 (end of Part 1).

I'm giving this chapter its own post because chapter 7 starts a new section with new characters.

I enjoyed chapter 6 very much. Happily, we were reunited with the engaging Rovigo, and we also met his family. This entire section was pretty great, and among the new characters I particularly like his daughter Alais (predictable of me, since she got the most attention and is being set up as a possible end-of-book match for Devin, though I don't think she'll play a big role in the adventures between now and then). There was a twist with Rovigo already knowing Alessan. This didn't surprise me, but I think that's only because I sort of remembered it from a previous reading.

I don't know why it took me so long to realize it, but Devin is totally the "Harry Potter" character (or Arthur Dent, or Watson): the reader's guide to this world. He starts with very little more knowledge than we do, and is the legitimate within-story reason to explain all the things that most of the characters know but that the audience doesn't know (so that the need for explanation comes across as natural).

The ending section with Tomasso was heartbreaking, and yes, I admit it, I cried (again, over another character I barely know). But that's the thing about Guy Kay's best books: you have to be ready to have your heart broken.

This post has spoilers through chapter 8 (end of Part 2).

This part was pretty good, but I didn't enjoy it as much as the other characters we are following. Still, it did become quite engrossing, particularly in chapter 8. For me the most compelling parts of these chapters are the parts that take place in the present, in the palace. One of the things I like about Guy Kay's books is that the different sides in a war can all be filled with people we root for; there doesn't need to be a good side and a bad side. This is an early Guy Kay novel, and we see him starting to experiment with that here: Brandin is not purely a villain, and this section shows him through the eyes of someone who loves him.

The reveal about Dianora's brother being Baerd was something I did remember from a previous reading, so I can't comment on how well that surprise was handled. I will say it's economical, since it handles the back story of two characters from different sections of the book at the same time. The scenes of the soldiers bullying a 15-year-old Baerd help us to understand why it was hard for him to tell the story of Tigana to Devin, and to wait to see whether he could hear the word. Also, the sculptor from the tragic prologue returns as their father. Thinking of things from his perspective the night before the battle (in the prologue), and how he was remembering his family, I was particularly saddened by his wife's fate.

I guess the elephant in the room is the sexual relationship between Dianora and Baerd. First I'll say, the sex scenes here are not tasteless, and that's always nice in a Guy Kay (I've mentioned before that I think he sometimes gets carries away with them). He seems to know that restraint is needed here. My general feeling is that the sexual relationship is unnecessary for moving the story forward, that the normal brother-sister love would have fulfilled the same purpose. But maybe I feel that way simply because I'm from a culture where there is a strong taboo against this. I'm trying instead to think of it as demonstrating to the reader just how unimaginable their situation was in the wake of the war. In a way this section is about what happens when people reach their breaking point, both in terms of the relationship between the siblings, and also the paths they each choose moving forward.

You are cruising through - I haven't read your comments in detail yet as I want to approach it "fresh". Unfortunately I have a very sick cat and can't find it in myself to pick up a heavy book right now, I hope to get to it soon, though. I do look forward to reading your thoughts soon. :)

Teri-K wrote: "You are cruising through - I haven't read your comments in detail yet as I want to approach it "fresh". Unfortunately I have a very sick cat and can't find it in myself to pick up a heavy book righ..."

Oh I'm so sorry Teri-K! A sick cat is really stressful. I hope your kitty recovers soon!

Yes, I'm getting a bit too far ahead of everyone. I'll see if I can talk myself into taking a short break to let people catch up. I'll admit it is a bit daunting to be trying to make progress in both this and Bleak House at the same time, since they are both door-stoppers in their way (especially the Dickens of course).

Wobbley wrote: "Teri-K wrote: "You are cruising through - I haven't read your comments in detail yet as I want to approach it "fresh". Unfortunately I have a very sick cat and can't find it in myself to pick up a ..."

You should read at whatever pace works for you - even if it's torpedo speed. :)

This has been on my tbr for ages. I'll get it started in the next couple of days.

I've read several fun, light books since Bleak House, so I think I'm ready to pick it up now. I needed to clear some space in my brain first.

I have finished, I found it to still be a lovely reread.

My copy shows as "in transit" so I might have it soon. I have so many going right now that I might be a few days starting even when it comes. BTW, I am skipping the posts with spoilers until I can get it and get started!

So sorry about the kitty, Teri. Hope it recovers quickly. I hate when anything is wrong with mine!

Katy wrote: "I have finished, I found it to still be a lovely reread."

Yay, I'm glad you enjoyed it Katy. It's so nice when the books we like stand up to a reread!

I'm happy so many people are starting reading this soon. :)

This post has spoilers through chapter 12 (end of Part 3)

I've been suffering from some Dickens-fueled reading paralysis for the past few days, but I'm back on the horse today reading this book.

I'm glad to be back with this group of characters (Alessan and his allies), I'm enjoying their storyline quite a lot. My only complaints about this section are:
1. I think the Night Walkers feel a bit superfluous, like they are one storyline too many (though perhaps I'll change my mind as the story progresses). I suppose it was nice that Baerd had a chance at some catharsis, that hopefully can help with his guilt about being too young for the original battle. But it feels like we could have found some peace for Baerd without introducing a whole new storyline.
2. I've said it before and I'll say it again: Guy Kay should just stop writing sex scenes. (warning: opening this spoiler leads to text from the book that is not suitable for, well, certainly not for me anyway; it's pretty tasteless) (view spoiler)[Impaled on his sex? Really???? (hide spoiler)]

My favourite part in section 3 (chapters 9-12) was chapter 12, the meeting in the mountain pass. I enjoyed getting this new glimpse into Alessan's past and friendships, and I thought Devin's mission to stop the assassination attempt was pretty exciting, with a nice payoff in camaraderie between the characters.

Wobbley wrote: "
I've been suffering from some Dickens-fueled reading paralysis for the past few days..."

I was just wondering how Bleak House is going,

I'm picking up Tigana as soon as I get off this computer...

Through Chapter 2:

That Prologue was so moving, I could have stopped there and felt I'd read something worthwhile.

"Is the night changed by what we do down here? We mortal men in our folly?" I know I've found a lot of solace in nature these last few years especially, when everything seems in such turmoil. I suspect people have looked at the stars and asked these questions in all times and places.

"We are not the last free generation. There will be ripples of tomorrow that run down all the years. Our children's children will remember us, and will not lie tamely under the yoke." I think this sentiment is also repeated by everyone who has struggled for freedom from oppression - it's the hope for a better tomorrow, even if we don't live to see it. Of course in this book, these words are especially melancholy.

So far I've been noticing all the references to memory and home. I suspect I remember less of this than Wobbley, but I do know those themes were important, and I remember why. So it's both lovely and sad to hear people speak about them.

And I've marked one question to possibly understand later - why chapter 2 ends, "His (Adaon's) face when he turned to his rending was that of Alessan."

I'm pretty much letting everyone's names roll over me right now, not trying to remember them all. The ship master is likable - will he reappear? I can't look up his name because the cat is sleeping on my book at the moment. lol

I am intrigued by Alessan, too - I think he's the shepherd who learned so much about humans by watching his sheep and goats. And I'm wondering how much he remembers.

Further thoughts with spoilers through chapter 12 (end of Part 3)

Part 3 also has a couple of major ethical quandaries for Alessan. He's playing a long game and trying to do what's best for the peninsula as a whole. But this comes at a huge cost. In this section, he removed a man's free will so as to have a wizard on his side, and he put the last remaining unconquered province (and all its people) in very great peril. It's exploring the burdens of leadership, and what it really means to decide that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Of course it is admirable that he is trying to solve a larger problem rather than focusing on restoring Tigana's name, but I like that the book recognizes how hard this is, and how morally ambiguous his path can become.

There's also an interesting angle with Catriana's parents. They fled before the great battle, and she is very ashamed of their cowardice. I personally think that getting your family to safety is a totally valid approach to living, and I've never subscribed to the viewpoint that courage is the greatest virtue (or only comes in one form). But this is a Ruritanian romance (as, indeed, are most fantasy novels), so I'm not surprised about the emphasis on courage, honour, and loyalty. I'll be curious to see how this is explored later in the book, or indeed whether it will be explored at all -- it may simply be there to act as a back-story and motivation for Catriana. Alessan, at least, seemed to see this in a more nuanced way when he was talking about Devin's parents earlier in the book.

Teri-K wrote: "I was just wondering how Bleak House is going..."

Bleak House and I are on a small break. It's just so intimidatingly long, and it's hard to be reading that one and this one at the same time, since this one is long too. It made me feel sort of like I wasn't moving forward at all, if that makes sense.

Wobbley wrote: "Bleak House and I are on a small break. It's just so intimidatingly long, and it's hard to be reading that one and this one at the same time, since this one is long too. It made me feel sort of like I wasn't moving forward at all, if that makes sense ..."

It makes perfect sense! I had to finish Bleak House and take about a week to digest it and read other things before I could pick up Tigana. It's wise to recognize your limits and read in a way that works for you. I can generally only have one novel that requires real focus, and maybe one nonfiction, at a time. Everything else needs to be easier. Dickens will still be waiting when you're ready to get back to him. :)

spoilers through chapter 2

Teri-K wrote: "Through Chapter 2: That Prologue was so moving, I could have stopped there and felt I'd read something worthwhile..."

I'm so glad you've been able to start this one now, Teri-K! Yes, you're so right. The prologue is a fairly perfect sad short story. I've definitely had times where I just went to this book to read the prologue.

I love the quotes you picked from the prologue too. You're right, they are so universal. And memory and home are very important themes in this book.

The ship master's name is Rovigo, and I agree, he was very likeable! I love that you couldn't look it up because of a cat on your book -- I have been there! And I really hope your cat is doing better.

=^.^=

Wobbley wrote: "spoilers through chapter 2

Teri-K wrote: "Through Chapter 2: That Prologue was so moving, I could have stopped there and felt I'd read something worthwhile..."

I'm so glad you've been able to sta..."

Rovigo - thanks! I thought it was interesting that he showed such a positive interest in Devin, when pretty much everyone else had been negative. I don't know if he's important or just someone to lighten the mood a bit, though. But I always perk up a bit when someone who can move easily around the setting shows up in a book like this.

The cat, Luna, is much better. She's eating and drinking normally and certainly acts like she's fine now. So that's a huge relief. I was quite worried for about a week.

Teri-K wrote: "The cat, Luna, is much better. She's eating and drinking normally and certainly acts like she's fine now. So that's a huge relief. I was quite worried for about a week."

Super, that's the best possible ending!

This post has spoilers through chapter 15

I'm still enjoying this quite a lot.

Chapter 13 is another Dionara chapter. I continue to think these are good, but not as good as the Alessan chapters. I do really like quiet the friendship between her and Scelto. And I empathize with her situation. She's here to kill Brandin, but she seems to be very much in love with him. That's impossibly hard.

Chapter 14 has Alessan gathering more allies, and more coming-of-age stuff for Devin. I was really happy to see Naddo return, a great payoff from Dionara's nighttime memories.

I thought Chapter 15 was a real highlight. The stuff around his difficult relationship with his single-minded mother was spot-on. We also start to see Erlein empathizing with the group he's fallen in with, and sometimes giving them voluntary help. And we find out what was alluded to at the end of chapter 13, what Brandin has decided to do in the wake of the assassination attempt on him. That throws a bit of a wrench into their plans, and we'll have to see how it plays out.

Also, I wondered after chapter 1 whether the poet Adreano would become an important character. He didn't, but he's come up a couple of times since, which I think is a nice touch. That's something I like about Guy Kay's books: he doesn't forget people. (Same thing with Naddo, actually.)

Through Chapter 5

I didn't remember any of what happened in the cabin, so it was a shock when the soldiers and Alberico himself showed up, and how it all played out.

The telling of what happened is quite moving. I'm someone who, even at 69, thinks of myself as a farm girl from Colorado - the farm no longer exists as it did but I remember every hill, the wild roses, the woods where the Great Horned Owls nested, the beaver ponds with bull frogs, and the sun-baked road that twisted and went up a steep hill to the mailbox. So the idea that they can never have that casual conversation - "Where are you from?" with anyone else is heart breaking to me.

"If something could be remembered it was not wholly lost" Devin feels. And I agree. At some point everyone who was born in Tigana will be dead, and then it will as if it never existed, and all the wars they fought and all they hoped to pass on to their children will disappear, too, leaving a void where those memories should be.

Then there's the shock of the Duke - I'd forgotten all of that. It was a clever plan, and makes it clearer why Taeri killed Herado so quickly. He had to be silenced before he gave that part away.

In chapter 5 Sandre says, "It goes on whatever happens, whoever dies. While there is breath to be drawn and a heart with which to hate. My quest and your own. Until we die they go on." Which is the pity of war, especially if it's based on revenge. The saying "An eye for an eye leaves everyone blind" is so true, and seems to be playing out here.

As much as Kay can move me with he writing, there are some times I'd like to grab a red pen and shorten some descriptions. Maybe it's just me, but I don't think we need to know what the halls and rooms look like in a building we may never visit again. But his quick action scenes and story-telling are great so far.

spoilers through chapter 5

Teri-K wrote: "Then there's the shock of the Duke - I'd forgotten all of that. It was a clever plan, and makes it clearer why Taeri killed Herado so quickly. He had to be silenced before he gave that part away."

I'm not sure about this. Didn't Tomasso say that his father never told him the 6th man at the meeting would be? If I'm remembering that right, I'd think there's a good chance Taeri didn't know either, that the Duke told nobody. That was how I interpreted it at least, that Taeri killing Herado so quickly was just his instant reaction to the betrayal.

Teri-K wrote: "As much as Kay can move me with he writing, there are some times I'd like to grab a red pen and shorten some descriptions."

Yes, I agree, to both of these things. His writing can be so beautiful! For me, as I've mentioned, I particularly want to edit out his sex scenes (the ones where he goes into too much detail). He's so good at so many parts of writing, and so bad at those, one wishes he'd just stick with his strengths. But, yeah, the general world building can also bog things down, though I think that's true of so much fantasy. But I generally love his writing, and particularly how attached he can make me to his characters. Plus his action sequences are exciting.

You're making fast progress!

This post has spoilers through chapter 19

Man I love Guy Kay, and this is one of his best. I even remembered (from a previous reading) that Catriana wasn't actually dead. But still, but still, the part afterwards when they all thought she was dead and Alessan and Devin played the lament for the god, it made me cry. It was so sad and beautiful. (It's possible I'm revealing myself to be a total sap by doing this buddy read...)

So this entire section (I read chapters 16-19 today) was terrific. In Chapter 16 we're following Baerd and company. The part where they are being chased through the city after Baerd knocks down a man who groped Catriana was quite exciting. And I'm glad to find that I was wrong in my prediction that Alais wouldn't play much of a role; it's nice to have her here with the others, and to have Rovigo back too.

Chapter 17 finally sold me completely on the Dionara/Brandin storyline. His intense relief when she doesn't drown humanizes Brandin so well. This is Guy Kay doing Guy Kay to perfection: Alessan and Brandin want each other dead more than they want anything else, and Guy Kay has brought me to a point where I want some impossible third option where they both get to be happy. I also think Dionara's chapters work better like this -- flipping back and forth with the other characters, and not concentrating on only these two characters for a hundred straight pages.

In chapter 18/19, I loved the reunion of Baerd and Naddo at last. I'd honestly be happier with a Baerd/Naddo pairing at the end rather than the Baerd/Elena pairing that I think they are setting up; their story is so bittersweet. Catriana's plan was, of course, incredibly brave, and the part where they were running to try to save her was quite riveting. The sudden switch to present tense (possibly for the first time in the book??) really increased the urgency of that scene. Sandre cutting his fingers to try to save her when he didn't do that for his son is, again, very bittersweet (Kay really excels at bittersweet, and I'm a fan of it).

Whether or not Erlein had elected to stay with them, I was happy that Alessan decided to free him. It's nice to see him take on a more balanced view of his cause. I was glad too that Alessan afterwards addressed Catriana's feelings about her father's "cowardice", and continues to try to change her mind about that. I don't have strong feelings either way about Alessan and Catriana's new relationship -- it wasn't something I was rooting for or against, because it didn't occur to me that anything was different between the two of them than between any two others in the group. So I suppose I would have found that part more satisfying if there had been some earlier hints (maybe I just missed them? If someone saw earlier hints, please tell me what they were.). But I really like Alessan, and it's nice if he can have some happiness. And they've moved the Devin/Alais relationship along, which is a nice one I think.

A couple of my favourite quotes from this section:

"I am learning so many things so late. In this world, where we find ourselves, we need compassion more than anything, I think, or we are all alone."

For a long time after it was remembered in Senzio, that haunting, heartbreaking, utterly unexpected offering of the "Lament" on the mild, moonlit night that marked the beginning of war.

The book has gotten so good at this point. I'm so glad to be reading this again after all this time. :)

Wobbley wrote: "I'm not sure about this. Didn't Tomasso say that his father never told him the 6th man at the meeting would be? If I'm remembering that right, I'd think there's a good chance Taeri didn't know either, that the Duke told nobody. That was how I interpreted it at least, that Taeri killing Herado so quickly was just his instant reaction to the betrayal.."

That's true. So maybe nobody knew and he was killed for his betrayal. Which works, too.

It's funny about descriptions. I rarely balk at Dickens long ones, because he's creating an atmosphere at the same time. And I enjoy descriptions of nature or towns in general. Once we get inside I prefer a glimpse, to give me the feeling of the place, and then I generally don't want to know every hallway, wall covering, flooring, drapery, chair... But that just shows you what I care about and what I don't. lol

I remember just enough of this book to feel like I'm watching a train happily chugging along, full of people I'm interested in, knowing it's going to be in an awful wreck any minute, so I can't stop looking. I don't know that I would have gotten around to picking it up without this buddy read, so thanks!

I have resisted reading any of the posts. I got the notice from the library today that my copy is in. Now to get over there to get it!

Sara wrote: "I have resisted reading any of the posts. I got the notice from the library today that my copy is in. Now to get over there to get it!"

Great Sara, I'm glad you'll be joining us soon. :)

This post has spoilers through the end of the book.

An appropriately tragic yet hopeful ending to this story.

It's sad that Naddo died, but that was handled so briefly that it didn't elicit a big emotional response from me. Their plan was clever, but so risky; it relied on wizards who they only found in the last year of their planning, and they had no way of knowing whether they had enough.

The reveal about Rhun is very poignant. That whole scene, leading to his death, was given enough attention (unlike Naddo's death), and I did have a more emotional response to it. It brings everything back around to the prologue again. Did Scelto do the right thing by not telling Alessan who the fool was? Certainly he meant it for the best, to try to stop the cycle of grief.

(I'm not so sure how I feel about the end of Dionara's story, but she was so conflicted at the end, and felt that she'd betrayed everything for Brandin, so perhaps without him this was the only sensible ending? And I do think it was the right decision to not have Baerd and Dionara reunited; that outcome seemed so unlikely at this point in the story.)

I even kind of liked that the three men see a riselka in the last sentence. I think it's a way of saying that the story goes on, these people keep living and choosing and loving and suffering, even though the narrative we've been reading has ended.

I'm really glad we decided to do this buddy read. :)

Sara wrote: "I have resisted reading any of the posts. I got the notice from the library today that my copy is in. Now to get over there to get it!"

Yeah! I don't know about you, but I have to go pick up a book as soon as it arrives, even if I know I won't be able to read it for a while. (Fortunately my library is less than a mile away.)

I look forward to seeing other reactions as people start reading it, too.

I was at the library yesterday and then when I got home they messaged me that this book was there. Ugh! I will now have to wait until I have a chance to go by again...maybe Friday.

Sara wrote: "I was at the library yesterday and then when I got home they messaged me that this book was there. Ugh! I will now have to wait until I have a chance to go by again...maybe Friday."

That's so frustrating when it happens! One of the librarians told me they get their books about 1:30 and send out the messages by 2, so I always check if I'm out then, before I head home. Just in case. :)

This post has spoilers through the end of chapter 5.

First, Teri-K, i'm so glad your cat is doing better. It's so stressful when they're sick!

OK, so one of the things i love about re-reading a book (and maybe especially about re-reading a Guy Kay book) is the things you notice that you didn't the first time because you didn't know enough yet at that point in the story (because he is the master of the partial-reveal). Like Wobbley and Teri-K, i loved the prologue and found it to be a super satisfying stand-alone story (and one where i somehow got attached to the characters immediately and did cry). But it hits even harder on a re-read because of what you know is coming. So, for example, the beautiful quote Teri-K wrote from the prologue—"We are not the last free generation. There will be ripples of tomorrow that run down all the years. Our children's children will remember us, and will not lie tamely under the yoke."—is even more devastating because in fact you know that isn't precisely true. That in fact the children's children have been cursed not to remember.

Like Wobbley i remember initially thinking the first time i read this book that a name really isn't that big a thing to grieve over but, exactly as you say, the name is the symbol: of a people, of their history, of their pride, of their identity... and when Brandin stripped away the name, he also stripped away these other things. So the name is the tangible thing they are grieving, but it's so much more than that (including forgetting the point of the sacrifices of the people who died for that place and its identity). And of course all of this is tied in with memory. So many good quotes about those things; and i love the ones you both chose, Wobbley and Teri-K.

One of the things i especially love in many of Guy Kay's books is that, although some of the "bad guys" are straight-up bad guys, he often makes things more nuanced than that. From the prologue i particularly loved this quote from the perspective of the sculptor:

There was singing on the other side of the river too, he noted, listening to the enemy soldiers north of them. It was curiously hard to impute any absolute sense of evil to those harmonizing voices, or to hate them quite as blindly as being a soldier seemed to require. He wasn't really a soldier, though, and he had never been good at hating.

He also writes rich and flawed characters who i grow to love in a way i seldom love characters in other books (with a few notable exceptions). Probably The Lions of Al-Rassan is the one whose characters i have felt most personally attached to, somehow, but i can already see this far into the story how i will grow to love Alessan and Devin and Baerd and how i already want to know more about (and could grow to love, if he reappears) Rovigo the ship master and others. Often Kay enhances the characters' lovability for me through showing us strong characters' vulnerabilities, like when Devin cries hearing the children's song, or through little intimacies between the characters, like the oath between Devin and Baerd, or this unguarded moment that happens between Alessan and Baerd:

Alessan was still gazing at Baerd. "You know it is only the music i am going back for."
"Of course i know that," Baerd said softly. His expression changed. "I'm only afraid that the music will kill us both one of these days."
Intercepting the look that passed between them, Devin learned something new and sudden and unexpected—on a night when he'd already learned more things than he could easily handle—about the nature of bonding and about love.

And then of course he introduces all these characters that you think will become important side characters—and who you want to learn more about—only for him to kill them off! Probably Tomasso, and especially the two co-conspirators. Their deaths are all the more shocking because he seems to be setting them up to be main characters in the book.

It's also fun to read many books by the same author and notice the motifs they seem to turn to again and again in their stories: small things like a beloved main character who is strong and independent (and trying not to show their vulnerabilities) and has a "characteristic shrug" that the people who know them best recognize. And the one person who dies (or you think is dead) and ends up being saved (or being alive the whole time)—Sandre in this case. And of course the central things like how huge events in history are started in small ways, and how a person's life changes in dramatic ways by seemingly inconsequential decisions (like Devin following Catriana in the palace).

Anyway, that was a bit of a ramble of ideas, but all that to say i'm really enjoying this reread so far, and reading everyone's comments, and i'm looking forward to more.

Glad you're making progress and enjoying it, Svenna!

You've pointed out a few things here that I'd sort of glossed over, and am glad to be reminded of. You're right that the prologue is more powerful knowing what's to come. And that's a terrific quote about listening to the men singing in the enemy camp.

I love the quote you added about Alessan going back for the music. Yes, it's a quiet moment about a very strong friendship. But it's also about the power of music in our lives. That's something I can really relate to.

I do agree with you about the characters in The Lions of Al-Rassan, but I love the characters in Tigana too, and I really enjoy how much more focused it is; Lions feels a bit too sprawl-y sometimes.

I started the book and at about 75 pages in I decided it just isn't the book for me right now. I know you all will understand when I say "timing is everything." My head is full of so much right now that there just isn't any room for all these characters and unusual place names. Maybe someday I will try again. (I did love the prologue).

I do want to say that I am delighted that you are all enjoying this revisit to a familiar love. I know that feeling and it is one of warmth and comfort and rediscovery. Thanks for inviting me to join--Enjoy the rest of the your read and keep that tissue box handy.

I'm glad you were able to figure this out so quickly Sara, and can move on to something that better matches your current needs. :)

Sara wrote: "I started the book and at about 75 pages in I decided it just isn't the book for me right now. I know you all will understand when I say "timing is everything." My head is full of so much right now..."

I totally understand, Sara, it may not be a book for you. If you do decide to try it again I recommend the audiobook. That's how I first found it, and then I didn't have to wrestle with all the names and places, the narrator did that for me. Plus, there's no need to remember everybody, Kay is just setting up the world first, the important people become clear as you listen.

But either way, I hope your next read is a winner.