Outlander Series discussion

Just finished with Dragonfly in Amber and starting Voyager. This is like the umptenth time I have read it but it has been awhile so I am rereading them all, so I can get to the latest book feeling fresh. I love love love these books.

I've been buying them all to have on hand to read whenever I want. I've only done one full read of the series and am looking forward to rereading them in succession without having to wait for them to come in at the library.

I read them all 3 times, and am now listening to them. Still finding new things. I have become a lunatic!

How is the audiobook? I've heard mixed reviews.

I like them very much. It's nice to hear the Scots accents, and some of the Gaelic.

They are phenomenal. Nobody, but nobody, reads like Davina Porter. Female, anyway, and this genre. Now, for male readers, I have a few favs, but my absolute MOST favorite is Frank Muller. He read both of Stephen King's(and Peter Straub) books, The Talisman and Black House, and I have listened to him on other books, and he is awesome..tragically, he is dead now. But his books live on!

JenC. wrote: "How is the audiobook? I've heard mixed reviews."

I know I am in the tiny minority, but I'm not a big fan of the audiobook(s). I've only listened to Outlander for full disclosure. While I enjoyed Davina's voices and accents, I didn't like the way she read Claire's lines; she made Claire sound like an old biddy with the way she read her lines, etc. I know a lot of you are booing and hissing at me, but that is my honest opinion. I couldn't get Davina's voice out of my head while I was re-reading Outlander too which was annoying. Again, JMHO.

I think Davina Porter is amazing. Yes, she portrays Claire a little that way; but, it's the way it's written. Remember she is "adopting my very best ward-sister's tone" when she is afraid or dealing with the men she encounters. And, that's how "ward sister's" sound. It's just a bluff, but helps her feel in control of whatever situation is at hand; the "old best defense is a good offense" approach.

Very good point Mary. I really mean absolutely no disrespect toward Davina. I think perhaps that audio books are just not for me. They are somewhat similar to movies based on books--nothing that I see or hear can compare with what I have imagined. I'm happy to have listened to Outlander since it allowed me to share it with my husband (who is decidedly not a reader), but I just won't be continuing with the audio versions of the books. I haven't even run across anyone that shares my sentiments about the audio book, so I know I stand alone on this one :)

Kimberly, I am one of the few who can't listen to audio books of any genre. I can listen to Wayne Dyer on audio without a problem, or Ram Dass, etc... but to listen to an actual story being read. Well. I just prefer to flip the pages and read myself. Even on a long drive or flight. I just can't get into the audio. It's distracting for me.

I am so glad to see that I am not alone when it comes to the audio books. I tried and just couldn't get into it. First I made the mistake of looking at the picture of Davina and from that point on as soon as I heard her voice, I pictured Davina not Claire. Second, I thought the same about the way she read Claire. Just alittle more uppity than I think of Claire being. I also hear Davina's voice and think of someone much older than Claire is in Outlander. THe other problem I have is when listening to the audio book I tend to get sidetracked. My mind wanderes easier than when holding and reading a book. But I do have to give Davina credit, she does read well and does do the accents justice!

I do see your points. I don't think I could listen to a book I haven't read, though. I do enjoy reading, too; but, enjoy the freedom of movement I have with listening to MP3 player softly reading in my ear. I know it's not for everyone, though and I can appreciate the fact you gave it a try.

Dorothy wrote: "I am so glad to see that I am not alone when it comes to the audio books. I tried and just couldn't get into it. First I made the mistake of looking at the picture of Davina and from that point o..."

Those are my sentiments exactly! I made mention on another thread somewhere that Davina sounds too old to read Claire and boy did that not go over well. Claire is 27/28 in Outlander and I'm sorry but Davina's voice doesn't come close to sounding that age. I was re-reading Outlander at about the same time that I was listening to it on audio and all I could "hear" was Davina's voice. The audio books just aren't for me.

Davina Porter is amazing doing any voice but Clair's, however it does grow on you, I listened to the first 2 books and now I am on chapter 2 of Voyager. I think at the end you will come to enjoy Clair's voice too because she is smarter and more mature then anyone else in the book. I love the other voices so much that it doesnt bother me that clair sounds off.

I am so into this book, I didnt enjoy Dragonfly as much as the first one and this one is better as well so far but I didnt like the fact Jamie is being a good lover to other women and siring other children when Clair had a though time with Frank, that rubbed on me, I hope he makes it up to her:D

In the 20 years they where apart Jamie's life was tougher than Claire's by far! Claire has a healthy child, a nice home, human company, and went to medical school. Jamie spent most of his time in prison or a cave. I easily forgave him for having a child with someone else. It was the only thing that gave him any kind of happiness.

Dorothy wrote: "In the 20 years they where apart Jamie's life was tougher than Claire's by far! Claire has a healthy child, a nice home, human company, and went to medical school. Jamie spent most of his time i..."

I completely agree with you--my sentiments exactly!

Kimberly wrote: "JenC. wrote: "How is the audiobook? I've heard mixed reviews."

I know I am in the tiny minority, but I'm not a big fan of the audiobook(s). I've only listened to Outlander for full disclosure. W..."

I agree that I don't much like Davina's voice. It is adequate, but don't like the voice for the men. I like the British accent, but expected a lot better voice. It is not the beautiful tone I expected.

Lynda wrote: "Kimberly wrote: "JenC. wrote: "How is the audiobook? I've heard mixed reviews."

I know I am in the tiny minority, but I'm not a big fan of the audiobook(s). I've only listened to Outlander for fu..."

I think I was more disappointed because I had read so many comments gushing about Davina. My expectations were understandably high going into it, which made me even more disappointed.

I love the audiobooks, because it's rare to get a female who can make jamie come to life AND switch back and forth between british and scottish accents as she can. My only beef is that Claire sounds too old when she's 27 in Davina speak.... but, small sacrifice to make for the overall effect - it is beautifully done and no-one could have done it better. I listen to it over and over again. As well as re-read the books (yes, I am obsessed).

Carolyn wrote: "I love the audiobooks, because it's rare to get a female who can make jamie come to life AND switch back and forth between british and scottish accents as she can. My only beef is that Claire soun..."

I agree. It would be impossible to find someone who could read the books to everyone's satisfacton. Davina Porter does really well with even the male voices; I was blown away. I just think she does an amazing job. I'm right there with you listening continually and re-reading(also obcessed).

I am a newbie. I just found the series and am enthralled with it.I am a huge fan of audio books and I em enjoying hearing the different voices and imagining faces to go with the voices. I like the narrator; she does a great job with the many characters that are brought in. Does anyone know how the glossary reads in the Outlandish Companion. It's not alphabetical.

I need a spoiler cant wait to find out and it doesnt look like I will in the next chapters, does Clair tell Jamie that Laoghaire was the one who wanted to kill her in Outlander? I was sure Clair would mention it when Laoghaire brother came with the lawyer to make demands but it didnt happen, she told only Colum before he died in Dragonfly, I so wanted Laoghaire's evil conduct be revealed, will it (hopeful smile)?

Slavena all will be revealed in time, DG time and not necessarily in this book. Stay tuned.

not in this book aww, i will be disapointed I hope it is revealed by book 4 because audible doesnt have 5+6 avilable and I so enjoy listening to them.

Btw I think that if you have not read the books first you will enjoy listening to them more, I never like the naration in one way or another of books I have already read because I already have an idea in my head how their voices will sound.

Slavena, I am listening to Voyager but am reading A Breath of Snow and Ashes. I love davina Porter as narrator. I am completely captivated by her. Just because you cannot find Davina Porter narrating books 5 & 6 on audible don't quit looking elsewhere. It does exist and I have found them. Happy web shopping !

I have them on CD and might be convinced to loan to someone...to upload onto a computer and then you can listen...the CD's are really expensive to buy

I know there are audio versions of 5+6 but abridged and not narrated by Davina or am I wrong?

there are two versions, adbridged and narrated by geraldine something and unabridged by Davina - you can get unabridged via CD, but audible doesn't have them available currently due to rights-holder issues...DG last post on her website about it was that hopefully the unabridged might be available sometime this year on audible

Welcome, Carla. The glossary in Outlandish Companion works alittle differently. The terms are listed as they are introduced in the books; I guess it would be chronological order.
I'm listening to Voyager, too, and just spent the afternoon giggling thru the wedding and turtle soup scenes. Love them!
Enjoy reading. It's fun.

I agree it's better to read the books and then listen to them on audio. The one I didn't do that with was EITB. I started reading the book but kept putting it down when it go to the details of battles and Willie etc. So I got the audio on aubible and listened to the entire book from the beginning.

I'm about to listen to the last section on Voyager to remind me how it ended then I'm listening to DOA.

Mary wrote: "I'm listening to Voyager, too, and just spent the afternoon giggling thru the wedding and turtle soup scenes. Love them!"

I'm rereading Voyager right now (my second time around with the series) and just went through those two scenes a couple of nights ago. You're so right - how fun is that turtle soup scene, and how hilarious is that wedding scene! :D

I know. I just keep thinking of the look on Laoghaire's face, if she ever knew the details. It's sort of a start on s fitting payback to my way of thinkin'.
I was thinking about the seaman Young Ian thinks he killed; did Claire or Jamie ever tell him that he didn't kill him after all? I don't remember ever seeing it anywhere. I do remember Ian recalling what Jamie had told him about living with it in a later book. I just got the impression they never told him.

Mary wrote: "I know. I just keep thinking of the look on Laoghaire's face, if she ever knew the details. It's sort of a start on s fitting payback to my way of thinkin'.
I was thinking about the seaman Young..."

Yeah, as if Laoghaire wasn't already pissed beyond belief at Claire and Jamie, that wedding would've surely done it :)

I can't remember if C or J ever told young Ian that he didn't actually kill that man; I'm still making my way through Voyager (and they haven't found Ian yet) but if it shows up I'll come back and post!

Thank you!

I have a question. this is probably the 3rd time or so I have read Voyager, and never noticed this before, so perhaps my brain is fuzzy these days, but...
on page 437 in paperback, Jamie asks what Fergus did to the body, Fergus says that they put the body of the "intruder" in a casket of creme de menthe, and is at MacAlpines Tavern. Then on page 451, Claire realizes that Jamie didn't want Ian with him and Mr. Harding the insurer looking over the print shop premises in case they found the body of a one eyed seaman , hence, the intruder. My question is, she knows already as does Jamie, that the body isn't there. Am I missing something here?

Spoiler alert:
Two different men. One was caught at the brothel, the other was snooping around Jamie's shop - the guy Ian thought he inadvertently killed in the fire - the second guy shows up again in Voyager on board the Porpoise - name is Harry Tomkins (Tompkins?).

oh yeah. ok, that's right. So the guy in the barrel of creme de menthe is the guy at the brothel. duh. Thanks!

I finished Voyager, and I have questions!

My initial feeling is that I did not like this book as much as OL and DIA, and I think there are a couple of reasons. In the first two books, we are "right there" with Claire as she experiences such a range of potent emotion: fear, love, anger, etc., but in this book, I (as a reader) felt a little removed from the action. Because of the way the story is told (from Claire's first person to Jamie's third person accounts, etc.) and because of how much information is not included over the 20 years. We get bits and pieces as the story unfolds, but not a true picture of how things actually were for them. I understand that DG can't possibly fit 20 years of daily experience into a book, but it did make me feel like we had to get to know the characters again. In thinking about that, I realized it was literary genius. DG made us as readers have to follow along with Claire as she gets to know Jamie again. (How terrifying to throw yourself back through time in the hopes of re-establishing a connection with someone that you USED to know!) Ok, but having said that, I wasn't overly impressed with Jamie's change of character. I'm tempted to keep on babbling, but I'm going to skip to my questions so that maybe someone (please?) can help me to understand!

Here are my questions:

1) WHY does it never occur to Jamie or Claire, for that matter, to tell Jenny and Ian the truth about Claire's disappearance? Jenny was obviously angry with Claire for abandoning Jamie (and his family) after Culloden, and from Jenny's perspective, I don't think there is redemption for Claire, whether or not Jamie loves her. I don't condone what Jenny did or the way she went about it, but it seems to me that Claire and Jenny would never be able to have a relationship given what Jenny *thinks* she knows about Claire.

2) WHY does Jamie not go after Claire (following the whole Laoghaire drama)? Claire leaves and rightly so - in my angry opinion, but she obviously wants Jamie to follow her and explain himself. She has admitted to herself that she would likely not survive another trip through the stones. I can't imagine why he would forbid young Ian to go find her, and then ADMIT that he didn't want Ian to go and get her. That seemed out of character to me. I was under the impression that he'd do whatever he had to do to keep Claire, so why would he not try to prevent her from leaving?

And some questions not related to Jamie:

3) What in the hell is up with the Father Fogden scene? Was that supposed to be comic relief?

4) What exactly was going on when Jamie pretended to be a French soldier? This scene was really vague and confusing to me. First, he's hell-bent on rescuing Claire from The Porpoise, and then he's in a tavern with whores on his lap, pretending to be a French soldier? Huh?

5) Why did Geillie kidnap Scottish boys? What exactly was she doing to them? She wanted them to be virgins, ok, but did they need to be Scottish? I had the vague notion that she was trying to create the next ruler of Scotland by pinpointing a boy from the Fraser line (young Ian) BUT the fact remains that she is too old to be a mother and Ishmael said that Geillie had all ready stopped bleeding...

6) The voo-doo scene. Please explain to me what was going on here. How did anyone decide that Margaret was an oracle, and how was she channeling Brianna? Are we supposed to understand this part or is it simply willing suspension of disbelief?

7) Why was Geillie trying to get to the future? To do harm to Brianna? I thought that she WANTED Scotland to have a new ruler and be freed from English rule. Am I wrong about that? And if that were the case, why would that necessitate harming Brianna?

8) And one more Jamie question: Is it really believable that Jamie (after suffering at the hands of BJR) would actually offer up his body again to LJ? Or is this simply a passage to indicate how desperate he was at that moment to protect his son?

I'm probably over-thinking quite a lot of a FICTIONAL book, but I can't help it!!!

Mary, all excellent questions ! Some answers will unfold alittle more as the series continues and some will not. I think Jamie didnt think Claire would forgive him that's why he didn't want Ian to go after her. Jenny not knowing the full story about her timetravelling SIL was purposeful..people believed in witches then and Jenny would have been suspicios no matter what they tried to share with her. Jenny''s relationship with Claire will be reexamined again later but I know what you mean with these questions....I felt the same way with the appearance of the Loch Ness monster in outlander! All I can say is read on my DG GR friend. There is yet sooo much to the story and I am jealous you are reading them all for the first time! I am going to ponder your other questions.....

I was going to give my theory from Q8 because I too did ponder that one. Not having the fill in stories now being written, including the Scottish Prisoner and purely going on what we knew at the point you are reading, I do not think Jamie has any intention of supplicating to LJG but wanted to test his mettle to see if his son was safe with such a man and if John was truly honourable. I think he would have wrung his neck if he had accepted Jamie's proposal.

Now that DG is filling in the gaps in the story with the LGJ series and may be even Outlanders new books will illuminate more I hope inconsistencies do not occur.

Caroline wrote: "I was going to give my theory from Q8 because I too did ponder that one. Not having the fill in stories now being written, including the Scottish Prisoner and purely going on what we knew at the p..."

Ohhhhh, the thought did not even occur to me that he might be concerned that LJ might use his son in a pervy way. That is an interesting theory and makes more sense to me as to why Jamie would even propose his offer - a test. Hmmmm. I have not read any of the LJ books yet, so I do not have so much background on LJ other than what is offered in DIA and Voyager. I think I'm interested in reading the LJ series but haven't decided if I should read them now (after Voyager) or wait until I have read the Outlander series in entirety.

Mary wrote: "I finished Voyager, and I have questions!

My initial feeling is that I did not like this book as much as OL and DIA, and I think there are a couple of reasons. In the first two books, we are "righ..."

I'm going to number my answers, so that you knwo what questions I'm answering, lol!

1. Well, I think its for the same reason that Claire didn't want to tell people in the beginning. It's impossible to believe. Even now in our times you'd be thought of as crazy, and back then it could have been worse. They both probably thought that Jenny would never believe them.

2. Jamie loved Claire a whole lot. But he was never one to try to force her to stay with him. Remember, when he found out about where she came from and Frank the first thing he did was take her back to the stones. And when they got in the fight their first night married back at Leoch he told her that they could have a marriage in name only. He wanted her, but he never said he would force her to stay. I think that's what it boiled down to. He's a prideful stubborn man. He was not going to have someone to and coerce her into coming back if she didn't want to. It was dumb, because sometimes you just have to let your pride go. But Jamie is not a perfect man, he makes mistakes. Plus, she'd been gone for 20 years, this relationship is not solid anymore, they barely know each other anymore. He even asked her at one point if she could accept the man he was now, and if not they should split up.

3. I don't remember this scene, so I can't answer this.

4. If I remember correctly he was trying to get information out of them.

5. For some reason I didn't remember tht it was just scottish boys. I thought it was JUST virgin boys. And I didn't think it was so she could get pregnant. She needed them to be virgins so that the juju or whatever she was doing would work. She knew that the future king of scotland would come from the Fraser line. So she wasn't trying to make a new king. I think Ian didn't even tell her who he was, right? This is all fuzzy to me, it's been a while since I read it.

6. The rebel slaves discovered Margaret was a medium, or an 'oracle' somehow. They never went into how, just that it was. And she channeled Bree through Bree's dream. Remember, Bree said she dreamed of Jamie sitting on the other side of a fire. I'm not sure why yet. Speculation says that Jamie has a bit of a seer in him, but we don't know yet.

7. The way I read it is that she wanted to get back to the future because she found out Jamie has a daughter and that she could use and control Bree to try to start another rebellion. Not to hurt her, but to manipulate or force her. To control her.

8. This is actually addressed very clearly in one of the later books. So instead of waiting I'm going to just say keep reading! Actually, they get into a lot of this later.

All these are just my thoughts and how I interpreted the story.

Wendy F wrote: "Mary wrote: "I finished Voyager, and I have questions!

My initial feeling is that I did not like this book as much as OL and DIA, and I think there are a couple of reasons. In the first two book..."

Thank you for your opinions. I appreciate your insight.

1. I wish they would have tried to tell Jenny. I completely get that she might not believe Claire, but I thought she would trust Jamie with her life, and so she would believe him if HE told her about Claire. Also, she believed that Claire had some capacity to see the future (the whole planting potatoes thing), so perhaps she would have been more accepting of the truth? I guess we won't know...unless of course, that possibility happens later.

2. I'm still mad at Jamie for not even trying to chase her down. If he was willing to withhold secrets to keep her, it wouldn't be so far-fetched to believe that the stubborn ass might chase her down and prevent her from leaving. Grrrr! But yes, I see exactly what you are saying - I'm just mad at him.

3. Father Fogden - the sheep - the sangria - the evil old battleax Mamacita....

5. I think all the boys the she captured were Scottish boys - that's part of why I was confused - if it was just virgin boys, well, didn't she have a whole crew of slaves to pick and choose from? That whole section was very creepy, which I think was the point. I didn't realize until I looked up Rose Hall on-line that it is a real place and that part of the story is based on a real woman. *skin crawling*

6. I don't remember a dream of Bree's...I will have to look for that in the book...

7. Hmmmm, ok, I interpreted a threatening tone from Geillie, based on what she said to Claire about taking the girl, but leaving the man for Claire.

8. Ok, I'll try to be patient.

Thanks again for responding to my questions! I'm dying to discuss all my questions - I'm feeling a little obsessive-compulsive about these books. :)

1. I don't know why they didn't at the beginning. Maybe they thought she wouldn't believe them, so it was easier to say Claire was psychic, which was a lot closer to them. As to later when it was just Jamie... I believe he didn't want to discuss the whole thing. He had let Claire go, and lost her, but he didn't want to talk about it. Wasn't it said somewhere that the first time he said her name to Jenny after the initial explanation was years after?

2. I think he did plan to go after her, but he was shot. That's how I saw it, anyway. It's been a while, but I remember it that was(subconscious desire?)

3. I didn't get that one either. I was bored, and I kept waiting for it to end. I thought at first, it's because he'll be important in some of the next books, but it's not so.

5. I took the boys in stride(I don't remember whether they were all Scottish, but I don't think so). Geilli was evil and insane and she thought she was doing some kind of a spell. Plus I thought it was partly because she was a pervert and liked to molest boys. Just my opinion. I don't think it had anything to do with the prophecy.

6. The dream may have been mentioned in the later books.

7. I'm not sure what she wanted with Bree, but I don't think it was good.

8. An explanation will be given, but since there was already a post saying it: Jamie was doing it mostly to see if LJ would be a suiting father. There's more, but keep reading...

As to your general thoughts, I found the new Jamie interesting and I thought it was realistic. All those things that happened to him, as well as a twenty year period had to have changed him. He was almost killed, been in a cave for years, then in a jail for years, had a kid so he toughed up. Plus, he finally learned what complete loneliness was, since there was no Claire.

I didn't really mind the shifting POVs, I like reading Jamie's thoughts. It was the later books and Bree's and Roger's POVs which I didn't like so much.

Hi Mary, as far as reading the LJG books it is not really necessary to the plot line. I did not get around to reading them until I had read the Outlander series a couple of times and knowing the 4th LJG contained a lof of Jamie I decided to read them. They are of a very different tone and style to the Cross Stitch/Outlander series. My other book group read them and there were very mixed feelings about them, some liked the character more and others less. So it really is up to you and how drawn you feel to that character.It does, however, expand the verse and give more insight into the times..

As for being obsessed... I think nearly everyone on here is. These books really get under your skin and considering she wrote book one for her own personal task and as a stand alone book she did verra well :) Keep going you have lots more treats in store for you.

First off I, too, liked the "new" Jamie. I found him to much more mature than when she left him 20 years earlier. I liked that.

In answer to your #7 question, Geillie wanted Bree in order to eradicate the Fraser line. She being the last Fraser born. Something about her and perhaps she was the real leader of the Scottish people?

I liked the parts with Fr. Ogden. I thought it added a levity that was needed in this book. The whole Mr. Stern was set up to lead both Jamie and Claire to the cave where Geillie was holding young Ian. So I thought that was pretty important.

Am still a little unsure about the French soldier, bit, but will accept it as it was.

Voyager was one of my favorite books of the series.

She was threatening. But not to do damage or kill her, but to take her, control her. I think what it boiled down to was that Claire didnt want Geillis anywhere near Bree because she was unstable.

I struggle with what happened to Geillis character from Outlander to Voyager. In Outlander she was radical for sure, but Dougal loved her (or felt strong emotion for her), and Claire was left feeling like in the end Geillis was her friend. She saved Claires life. She was like a totally different person in Voyager, completey unhinged.

She was always insane, she burned her husband in order to o into the past! I honk Clair was greatful that she helped save her from being burned but she never felt she was her friend after she learned of her instability. I think She freaked Clair out. At the end she was consumed by her insanity and obsession of going through the stones. That whole business was definitely creepy but I am curious now that I know it is based on a real person. I'll have to look that one up.

I suppose... it's just that you didn't see it as blatently in Outlander. Even the burning of her husband wasn't discovered until Voyager.

Burning her abusive husband, killing Arthur with poison... the things she did back then, I can put down as being a radical patriot. Sort of like how there are radical patriots these days, or how there are those who are SO against something that they blow up buildings despite who's in it. It's TERRIBLE, awful, and definitely on a level of insanity.

But it felt different then where Geillis was in Voyager. It was like her mind finally snapped completely. Claire even mentions it when she finally sees her at Rose Hall. That her face looked... haggard and her eyes looked completely insane.

It makes me wonder about DG's style of writing. She said she doesnt really do outlines. She writes scenes, then she pieces them together like a puzzle.

Carren wrote: "First off I, too, liked the "new" Jamie. I found him to much more mature than when she left him 20 years earlier. I liked that.
"

I think my wording was wrong when I said that I wasn't impressed with his change of character. More what I meant is that I'm sad that they lost twenty years together, and I'm (for lack of a better word) mourning the loss of the idealistic, young Jamie. It wasn't so much a shock - how could he NOT change after everything? - it was just hard to accept. But I agree, altogether realistic. I re-read the reunion scene, and I was really struck by how realistic and emotional it was, and I tried to see everything from Jamie's perspective. Very bittersweet - can you imagine all the things running through his mind: overwhelming joy and relief and shock at seeing Claire (and learning about Brianna), fear and dread about telling her his life for the past 20 years, sadness about not being Brianna's father....