SciFi and Fantasy Book Club discussion

Happy with the conclusion?
Planning on reading the rest of the series?
Thoughts on the overall book?

I read this back in December 2008 (here's my review). I liked the novel, but not the ending, since it left so much unresolved. I immediately went on to the sequel The Fall of Hyperion, which is written in a different style, but at least tied up some of the loose ends.

I read this a few months back too, and I definitely plan to pick up the rest of the series, but actually had no problem with the ending; the only sort of cliffhangers that bother me are the ones in the middle of climactic sequences. I thought Hyperion actually ended rather well, given that it was the first of a quadrilogy and clearly setting up the three other novels -- I read it more like seven (was it seven?) short stories with a framing story and since each short story had a nice arc that was resolved I was perfectly willing to wait for a resolution to the larger arc.

I don't think I'm explaining this the way I wanted.

Basically, I was emotionally invested enough to want a payoff in each person's individual tale, but the larger arc seemed so clearly something that wasn't going to get resolved in this one novel that I had no emotional investment in it. I have intellectual curiosity about the larger arc, but intellectual curiosity can wait, for me. :)

My review says it all. This is one of my favourite books, perhaps of all time. I loved it so much I tried to emulate the structure in my review. I sucked but it was terribly fun to do. I read it in late 2010 but didn't read the sequel for a couple of months even though it was on my shelf. I liked knowing that there was something waiting for me. The ending is fine because it really just glides into the next chapter. When the story itself packs such a punch there's no need to search for some artificial fireworks at the end. I have a lot of respect for Mr. Simmons. Excellent.

Phoenixfalls wrote: "Basically, I was emotionally invested enough to want a payoff in each person's individual tale, but the larger arc seemed so clearly something that wasn't going to get resolved in this one novel that I had no emotional investment in it. I have intellectual curiosity about the larger arc, but intellectual curiosity can wait, for me"

i hadn't thought of it that way, but you're absolutely right. the other thing for me that really worked about the structure is that it isn't until the final story, the Consul's Tale, that we actually find out what the novel is about thematically.

I loved the book and started the second one right away. It was not an easy read in the sense that this is the first science fiction book that I read and a lot of the futuristic terminology went over my head. For that reason, I started the second one right away, I was afraid I was going to forget my understanding of the worlds.

I find the second book as good as the first, I am 1/3 into it.

The first book in the series has always been my list favorite. The first time I read the series I almost didn't continue because I was put off. I felt like the book was so many disconnected thoughts I was lost. But the next books have a more cohesive feel and I love them :-)

I didn't like the opening and if the whole book was like that first part, I wouldn't have read the book. But once the Consul left to meet up with the others and we started to get the stories, I was hooked.

My issue with the beginning is simple, I like characters and seeing inside their heads and what makes them tick. I hate it when I feel like I'm on the outside viewing the characters through a pane of glass, which is what the opening on the other planet felt like to me. Maybe that was intentional, since the Consul was supposed to be a mystery. But I've read enough bad "masculine" novels that felt like someone was just describing scenes from action movies, that I was worried.

Even with that initial worry I gave it five stars. Each character felt real, and while I didn't necessarily like them all, I could understand them all: their motivations, their fears, their hopes.

I definitely plan on reading the rest of the books, but I'll space them out over the next year.

I read this one last year with my local sci-fi/fantasy book group. And I loved it.

That said, you really to have to commit to reading "Hyperion" and "Fall of Hyperion" in order to get the complete story. I can't imagine what it was like to read it back when the book was first published and then have to wait a year for the final half of the book.

At least with his success, Simmons is now allowed to publish huge novels that while they can be used as a tactical weapon if dropped on someone from a great height are complete with the beginning, middle and end of the story between two covers.

Just finished. Here's my review:

This would have gotten more stars if it had been a complete story. As it is, it's a set-up to a story that has huge potential. I'll read the next one and I bet it's great, but right now I'm a little put off because I was just getting into the saga and the characters when it ended.

I love all the literary references- something that is often lacking in sci-fi. The format is straight from the Canturbury Tales, references to John Keats and Beowulf, and I'm sure more that I didn't catch. Plus some very creative elements- I love the ocean of grasses and the "Sea Folk", not to mention the idea of a house on many different planets. The Shrike anti-hero is mysterious, with just enough information given about it to make it absolutely terrifying. All very clever and imaginative.

The tales of personal tragedy were impactfully written, thought provoking, and emotional. I can only hope that as the series continues that there is resolution to the story.

Oddly it reminded me off the series finale of Angel. They are going into battle, you have no idea who will survive, who will die, and hey there are impossible odds, but we're drawing the curtain now on their heroic facing into the darkness.

I also love the creative elements! I kept imagining what it would be like to have a house with a room in each continent all through the book.

I read a student of the author created statue of the shrike and it is now at the author's cabin in Colorado.

Terrific review, Jonathan. I now have to read The Fall to complete the book.

What do you think of the world building here? I think there is a bit of world building, but built into the events. There is also a complex political structure of the Hegemony and the TechnoCore, along with the rebellious Ousters, and the mysterious semi-religious presence of the Shrike. I have to read The Fall of Hyperion to find out what each of the individual wishes are and how the wishes affect the events. I'd also like to know how each of them relates to the Time Tombs. I guess I better read the second book right away. My curiosity will kill me.

The first book sets the stage for a lot of possible interesting things to happen. There is a lot of world building in the first book that is not obvious to me until I thought about it. My involvement with the individual stories made me not notice the world building.

Would anybody mind if I tie book 2 into the discussion? Or would that spoil it for people?

I'd say start a book 2 discussion thread. So as not to spoil it for those of us who haven't gotten to it yet.

Thanks, Ala.

I guess I'll just throw my review up as well. Instead of pasting it in here for my final thoughts on this book.

Like you, I wish the first book would give me a sense of closure without having to go to the second book. Maybe in the future, they can combine the two books, but then that would be about 1,000 pages. If people were scared of SciFi before...LOL

I do feel that the war and the Armageddon is critical to the overall story, if not in the telling of the individual tales. I think the overall story is about the Hegemony's harmful colonization of other life forms, as depicted in the last tale, which describes about the colonization of the Maui-Covenant. So...the second book is going to have to resolve my questions regarding the Time Tombs, the Hegemony's involvement in harming the colonists, the mysterious religious (?) figure of the Shrike, and the war or Armageddon. I think the Hegemony and its ability to "farcast" figures strongly in the war and against other species.

The second book will have to answer questions about:
Time Tombs
Shrike
Cult/Church of the Shrike
The tunnels/labyrinths
Why these 6 people were given the final pilgrimage
Who/What the Templar is
What the Core is doing creating cybrids and why they have a recreation of old earth to enable/assist with the cyrbids

And, of course, the ending to each of the tales told. What happens to our happy little band of wish seekers and whatnot.

And that's just off the top of my head without going back to the book. I'm sure there's more I've missed.

That's just an awful lot to put off for the next book(s)...

I agree! LOL

But I can understand the publisher's dilemna, scare people off with 1,000 pages of SciFi or leave them grumbling until the next book comes out.

I'd rather go the route of getting a thousand page book that is complete rather than two five-hundred page books that aren't.

Also, are we certain this was a publisher splitting the book into two here? Or did the author write it this way purposefully?

It's only through Will of Horror Aficionados that I heard it was the publisher. I'll have to pop in to ask him. But I did hear that Dan Simmons denied that it was written in a way of 1 book that split into two, whatever that means. I do hope Simmons pops in to answer our questions.

So as not to derail the question thread, I'll answer you here.

Ala is my full first name. It's Samoan. :)

Oops, it didn't process my response for some reason.

Ala is a very nice name. Thank you for answering. :o)

One of the meaning for Ala is: a female demon in the Serbian and Bulgarian mythology. According to Wikipedia. :o)

Aloha wrote: "Terrific review, Jonathan. I now have to read The Fall to complete the book."

Thanks! I wish I could read it over for the first time.

Here is Will's answer to my question regarding the book being split by the publisher, Post #6328:

http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/7...

Well, damn. There goes that question :P

Also: it means "The Way" in my language.

Also, also: female demon? sheesh. Sure, I could get behind the demon part just not a female.

The meaning is terrific, as long as it's not "my way or the highway." :o)

I knew you wouldn't like the part about being female. Gets a hetero guy every time, unless he likes to cross dress.

It's just that everyone assumes I'm female online due to my name. Been getting that ever since I first logged on oh those many years ago...

Get used to it after a while.

I never thought you were female. You have the male vibe. The icon doesn't matter. A lot of my PNR women friends have icons of gorgeous male models. For some reason, your name makes me think of Allah, the supreme being.

I get that alot.

And, for some reason, "A la Peanut Butter Sandwiches".

I'd blame it on kids being kids, but this was months ago and it was a 30 year old woman.

Or my favorite, Xena's war cry, "Ahhhhleleleleleleleleeeeya!"

OMG, a lot of answers in the 2nd book. There's a part in the beginning where a lot of questions about the war, the politic and the tombs were answered via an interrogation. That's all I can say without spoiling it for people. Definitely start on the 2nd book right away when you're done with the first book. Think of them as one book.

I loved the way Simmons hid the world building in the pilgrim's individual stories rather than beating us over the head with it. I'd say more but I'm hoping to make some headway into Fall of Hyperion before bedtime.

LOTR had a huge section where he was describing the landscape. I wanted to fly by that section as quickly as I can. I really appreciate it when the author incorporates the world building into the action instead of having a section where we're forced to stay with it in the hope that it would be something important.

I'm 25% into The Fall of Hyperion. Lots of important details about the politics and why events were taking place. If you want questions answered, I highly recommend reading the 2nd book. I think the first book is to draw you into the human side of the story, the "space opera." The second explains the structure of the whys.

I am disappointed by the ending ... it left so much open and unfinished, that I am unsatisfied, nearly to the point of anger ... well, that may have been prompted by my own visualization of all these strong characters linking arms and skipping off into the darkness singing "We're Off to See the Wizard," which has got to be the goofiest ending of any well-regarded science fiction novel that I've read.

Yes, I know there are more books to read, and perhaps eventually I'll get around to them. But not right away.

So glad I'm not alone

I'm on Part 3 of Fall of Hyperion. Things are getting pretty tense.

Hyperion is really only the first half of a book, with Fall of Hyperion being the second book. Your reading is not really complete until you finish the second book. The second book explains a lot. It goes into detail about the politics, the fate of mankind, what happens to the pilgrims, and what the Shrike is about. It's still too early in my reading to figure out whether the Shrike is a bad guy or a good guy, some sort of a mysterious war deity. Yes, Stormhawk, they do link arms and skip to their salvation or doom.

Wow! Definitely read the second book. You are doing the first book an injustice by not completing it with the second book. I am almost halfway through the book, and things are heating up, politics and war, the pilgrims' destinies, and more info. on the Shrike.

Nice try, person who works for Dan Simmons.

LMAO! I'm actually Dan Simmons using somebody else's pictures.

Dan Simmons here. I just read the part that explained what the Shrike is. If you don't read the Fall of Hyperion, then you'll never get what the whole story is about. The 2nd book is an essential read to the series.

I finished Fall of Hyperion this morning. All I can say is "Wow!" Fall of Hyperion shows the full depth of the story and answers a lot of questions raised in Hyperion. The story is incomplete without it and the wait between the publication of Hyperion and Fall of Hyperion must have been agony back when they were first released.

I have about 30 more pages to go, and it is "Wow!" Ala is sick of me mentioning it, but definitely a must read in order to complete the book.

Sorry, folks, but you aren't there yet. You don't get the whole story until the end of "The Rise of Endymion". These four books are among my all-time favorites. Each time I reread them I discover some subtlety I had missed.
As a writer, I find Simmons scary good. The same guy who wrote these wrote "Darwin's Blade" which is so different (also good in it's own way)it seems impossible it's the same author

Aw, Paul! I want to get to Carrion Comfort and piles, piles of other great books!

Aloha wrote: "Aw, Paul! I want to get to Carrion Comfort and piles, piles of other great books!"

Well, if mine is one of them it won't hurt to take a break.