Robert E. Howard Readers discussion

Not sure why the post on Howard's poetry was stopped but I wanted to pique everyone's interest in it in case you are not aware just how awesome his poetry is!
If you go to lulu.com, there is a great book of his poetry available for about $20. The editor is Frank Coffman who is a professor of English and Journalism. The book has 700 poems with commentary. At the REH Days in 2008, the Texas Poet Laureate, Larry Thomas and others led a great panel discussion on Howard's Poetry. This past REH Days 2011, the Texas Poet Laureate of 2005, Alan Birklebach spoke. He is working with Paul Herman, Frank Coffman, and others to bring Howard's Poetry more to the forefront and get him recognized as a great Texas Poet. One of the reasons he has not achieved some of the recognition he deserves is obviously because of the topics of his poems.....Battles, Supernatural Horror, etc don't necessarily rate with poems about Texas Bluebonnets LOL. But the folks at REHUPA, Robert E Howard Foundation and others are working to change that and to get Howard recognized as a great author and poet. Robert E Howard Foundation published a great book of all of the known poems of Howard. It sold out two printings at $65 each! It is easily the best selling book they have published. While not all of his poems are good a lot of them are. On Friday nights at the REH Days in Cross Plains there is a traditional poetry throw down with people taking turns reciting Howard's Poetry. It's been a tradition for many years although some just like to go and hang out and have a couple of beers with one another generally it's a fun time. This is what Jason Momoa wanted to do with the fans. This may still happen in Austin sometime before the movie's opening.

Michael wrote: "Not sure why the post on Howard's poetry was stopped but I wanted to pique everyone's interest in it in case you are not aware just how awesome his poetry is!
If you go to lulu.com, there is a grea..."

There must have been a system glitch as I definitely did not close down the poetry thread. Thanks for flagging the problem and (as you can see) I've reopened it.

Michael, how about you pick a poem (preferably one published on the internet) and we can discuss it as a Group.

His prose style is a very good fit for poetry. I like the poems of his i have read in the collections i have.

I will get his poetry collection, just have to save money for the expensive shipping to european countries REHF books have.

I think this poem is one that truly hits the nail on the head of with a theme that runs through much of Howard's prose and poetry. His belief that civilation is just a thin veneer and that after brief eras of civilation or empire man always ultimately falls back into the barbaric.
One his best stories, a Conan story, "Beyond the Black River" has a great quote. At the end of the story, the Picts have pushed the frontier of Aquilonia back. They have overrun the outpost or fort named Conojohara. A borderer speaking to Conan about their defeat states that "Barbarism is the natural state of mankind," the borderer said, still staring somberly at the Cimmerian. "Civilization is unnatural. It is a whim of circumstance. And barbarism must always ultimately triumph."
Bob Howard and H P Lovecraft go on and on about this very subject in much of their correspondence. It is extremely interesting and entertaining to read. Here is the poem. I don't know if it's on the internet so I typed it out below.
This is also the name of a small paperback book containing 100 of his poems published as a benefit for the Howard Museum.


"A Word from the Outer Dark"

My Ruthless hands still clutch at life-
Still like a shoreless sea
My soul beats on in rage and strife.
You may not shackle me.

My leopard eyes are still untamed,
they hold a darksome light-
A fierce and brooding gleam unnamed
that pierced the primeval night.

Rear mighty temples to your god-
I lurk where shadows sway,
Till, when your drowsy guards shall not,
To leap and rend and slay

For I would hurl your cities down
And I would break your shrines
And give the site of every town
To thistles and to vines.

Higher the walls of Nineveh
And prouder Babel's spires-
I bellowed from the desert way-
They crumbled in my fires.

For all the works of cultured man
Must fare and fade and fall
I am the Dark Barbarian
That towers over all.

BTW another person to check. Donald Sidney Fryer appeared as a guest speaker at REH Days 2008 when the theme was poetry. He had great insight into Howard's poetry and I believe is an expert on Clark Ashton Smith as well.
http://donaldsidneyfryer.free.fr/

http://www.youtube.com/user/warriorph...

Check out this link on you tube. There are several parts. It's film of the panel discussion at REH Days 2011 with Frank Coffman, Barbara Barrett, and Alan Birkleback talking about Howard's Poetry.

Probably my favorite REH poem is Recompense

My favorite REH poem is "Empire: A Song for All Exiles."

"Which Will Scarcely Be Understood" is a close second.

"At the Inn of the Gory Dagger" is probably my third favorite just because it makes me laugh.

"At the Inn of the Gory Dagger" is a great and funny poem! Sometimes I wonder if Eve or Nell Brent could be reincarnations of Belit...

That's a neat thought!

Vincent wrote: "That's a neat thought!"

Thanks, Vincent! I'm thinking of bringing this idea to the forum Swords of Robert E. Howard...

Well, The Collected Poetry of Robert E. Howard - Volume 1 has been released and I got my copy. I'm going to start reading it ASAP.

Back in the day, I remember when I first read Conan the Barbarian #5, "Zukala's Daughter." I saw it was based on REH's "Zukala's Hour." OMG, I spent forever trying to find that story (this was pre-internet days, btw). Eventually, when the internet was a thing, I searched for it that way but couldn't find a copy to read. Eventually, I got Robert E. Howard: Selected Poems and it was in it! I even wrote a spell for the Conan RPG based on the Zukala poems for Hyboria's Finest: Nobles, Scholars & Soldiers.

Anyway, I have a fondness for this poem because of that years long search, so it makes me happy that the new volume of REH poetry, The Collected Poetry of Robert E. Howard: Volume 1. begins with this very poem.

I like this poem. A lot. It grabs me from the start, with a tower and some kind of sorcerer or god or demon or something. Anyway, I love that the book started with this.

I am not as familiar with REH's poetry as I am his prose, largely because I am pretty ambivalent about poetry in general. However, I just read "Rebel" and wow! I really liked this one. Probably because it told a story and wasn't a vague word-picture about a feeling.

"Rebel" is about a man who gambles with the Devil for control of Hell, loses, and goes on the run. It's quoted also on the back cover of the dust jacket.

I finished the first collection, "Singers in the Shadows," which covers the first 37 pages of The Collected Poetry of Robert E. Howard: Volume 1. I really delighted in "The Fear that Follows," and relished the horror of "Destination." This really his REH's poetry at his best, right up front in the volume.

I updated my Excel spreadsheet with the titles of the poems for the three volumes, and there are two poems I can't find listed in "The Collected Poetry of Robert E. Howard: Volumes 1 - 3":

The Tale of Glory (printed in Pictures in the Fire)
Untitled "Her hands and feet" (printed in The Collected Letters of Robert E. Howard - Index and Addenda.

I wonder if they were forgotten, renamed, or determined not to be REH's?

"Candles" has apparently been cut, given that Glenn Lord didn't think it was actually an REH poem.

Untitled ("Now the stars are all gleaming") was also cut, but it sounds like REH was just quoting a song he got from someone else and isn't actually by him, so that makes sense.

Every other poem I know of is accounted for in the three volumes.

Finished the second collection, "Images Out of the Sky," a collection put together in REH's younger years with Tevis Clyde Smith and Lenore Preece. This only includes REH's portion, presented in the order he intended. It was interesting reading the collection as a collection, in the order he wanted. Usually I only see these poems by themselves in various volumes.

"Man, The Master" (AKA "Song at Midnight") was my favorite of this section of the book. It's a very macabre look at the circle of life, starting with a gibbet. I have to admit, I kind of like the traditional title (Song at Midnight) that it was published with better than the REH title.

You can read this poem here:
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Song_a...

Very interesting Vincent. I'm enjoying your examination of REH's poetry. So you intend to inquire of the Foundation or John Bullard regarding those 2 absent works?

I sent a message to the Foundation. I'll report any answer given here.

Finished a set of REH's cycles, "Sonnets Out of Bedlam." Most of the poems in this cycle were sold to Weird Tales individually. I particularly enjoyed "The Dream and the Shadow" and "The Soul-Eater."

These poems in this cycle were all basically horror stories, which I liked.

Finished REH's second cycle, "The Voices of the Night, aka The Iron Harp." Only a few poems to this cycle. I liked "Moon Shame" and "A Crown for a King" the best, probably because they told stories instead of just described a scene or feeling.

Vincent wrote: "I updated my Excel spreadsheet with the titles of the poems for the three volumes, and there are two poems I can't find listed in "The Collected Poetry of Robert E. Howard: Volumes 1 - 3":

The Tal..."

Hi Vincent,

Bobby Derie asked me if I could answer your questions on these two missing poems.

"The Tale of Glory" in Pictures in the Fire comes from a play Howard wrote in one of his letters to Clyde Smith. The play is "Bastards All", and it is included in complete form in Collected Letters Vol. 1, and the forthcoming Collected Poetry, Vol. 3.

"Her Hands and Her Feet" is a bit of verse that Howard wrote on one of his postal address lists, and is included in the forthcoming Collected Letters Vol. 3, but not in any of the Poetry books. I'm assuming Paul either forgot about it, or didn't consider it important enough in its own right to include in any of the Poetry books. I'll check with him to see if he remembers.

I hope that answers your questions.

Thank you, John!

I wonder why it was in Pictures in the Fire as a separate poem. It is in there as part of the play (pages 395-396), and then a few pages later as a stand-alone poem (page 442). Looks like Collected Poetry handled it correctly! I'm a little embarrassed I didn't notice when I read the book that it was in there twice! (but perhaps I can be excused as even Howardworks.com lists it as a title unique to Pictures in the Fire, and doesn't note that it is also part of Collected Letters or any other place the play was printed - http://howardworks.com/verset.html#TH...).

But anyway, one more has been accounted for! Definitely agree that Her Hands and Her Feet is hardly worth mentioning as a poem.

Read REH's next cycle, "Black Dawn." I found these poems a little less accessible for me, meaning I found them a little hard to follow. The story-telling wasn't there so much as in the previous poems. Shadows (1) was probably my favorite of this particular cycle, but mostly because I thought the end had an interesting and thoughtful twist that I didn't expect.

I think it is interesting that the cycle known as the Iron Harp doesn't have a poem by that name, but this cycle (Black Dawn) has a poem named the Iron Harp.

Finished reading the "Poetry Journals, etc" section, which contains poems REH sold or sent into various poetry journals around the country. I liked "Tides" and "Flaming Marble (1)" the best. Some were really hard for me to follow (like Shadow of Dreams). I guess I really like poems that tell stories or are about some event. Some of the others I struggle to really understand what they are even about. That has always kind of been my struggle with poetry in general.

Hi Vincent,

I try to read poetry slowly, one poem a day or something. I find that if I binge read them, they loose their individuality and I don’t enjoy them as much. Same thing happens with the Steve Costigan or Breck stories. I have been reading the old 60s or 70s Howard poetry books bit by bit.

I really like the way they seem to have organized the poems in the new collection. When I get it, I will come back here and write my comments as you did and compare our impressions. So far, I have taken notes of my favorite poems but I read them from different books so it’s hard to keep track. I think the best way to read Howard’s poetry is as companion pieces to his stories, much like they are used in the Del Rey Best Of or in Horror Stories.

Hi Vincent! I wanted to let you know I have the new collection also. I purchased it a few weeks ago but haven't into it far yet. I wanted to compare it to the previous "Complete Poems of Robert E Howard" but frankly haven't gotten too far yet.
Glad you're enjoying

Mathieu wrote: "Hi Vincent,

I try to read poetry slowly, one poem a day or something. I find that if I binge read them, they loose their individuality and I don’t enjoy them as much. Same thing happens with the S..."

Mathieu, I read poetry very slowly too otherwise I miss the point. Of course most of Howard's is more accessible but T.S. Eliot can't be understood without googling it to find out what it's about. Same with the romantic poets like Wordsworth, Shelly and Keats

I have to read it slowly too. I've been trying to read a section a day or so, but I read a poem, do other things, read another, do other things, and so on. Some longer sections just take me longer to do. Luckily, as was said, REH is more accessible. I often have to do a lot of research for most other poets to really get their poems.

I'm glad you guys are getting or have gotten the book! I am so excited this is becoming available. I missed on on the limited edition book, and so this has been a long wait for me.

Finished reading the "Poetry in the Pulps" section, which were mostly poems sold to Weird Tales (and one to The Ring). Most of these have been reprinted time and again, and I've read them all before, but I feel like I gave them a more "real" read this time around (instead of just quickly glossing them over, which is my tendency with poetry).

I really liked "Dead Man's Hate." I just like poems that tell a story, as I have said before, and this one fits that bill. "The Moor Ghost" as well.

One that surprised me was "Sang the King of Midian" (which I know better as "A Song Out of Midian" from most prior publications)... I've read it before, but this time it struck a chord with me. It's basically about "If you love someone, let them go." It also kind of talks about the King realizing his love is trapped in a gilded cage. It just struck me as a more powerful poem than I ever gave it credit for in the the past.

Finished "Poetry in Pulp Stories," which is mostly chapter headings and the like. It is interesting seeing the poems divorced from their stories, and allows them to be seen as the poems they are. While I've read them before (as I've read the stories), this presentation gives them a difference reading, which I enjoyed.

Does anyone know when the other two volumes will be released?

Vincent,

They're in the waiting line at the publishers for our books to be published. I believe we are trying to get the corrected version of Letters Vol. 3 out next, then I believe Poetry Vol. 2 is next in line, with either the Ultimate Editions of Adventures in Science Fantasy or Tales of Weird Menace, then the third volume of Poetry, but the third Poetry book could leapfrog the other 2 books. We're hoping to get a new book of photos of Howard, his family, friends, and places in his life out before Howard Days, which may leap ahead of everything other than Letters Vol. 3 and possibly Poetry vol. 2.

OK. Thank you! I am very excited. I've been waiting for the poetry for SO LONG!

I'll definitely look to buy the photos book.

What happened with Volume 3 of letters that it needed correcting?

Hi John,

Great to know about the photos book. I will buy it for sure! Do you know if the Ultimate Editions of Science Fantasy and Weird Menace have significant changes from the first editions?

Thanks

Re: Letters Vol.3--due to a snafu, most of the new photos in it came out corrupted in the first batch. We figured out what happened, and we're waiting to see that the fix worked. Having to redo it also allowed me to add in 2 new letters from Howard that surfaced in November.

Re: Science Fantasy and Weird Menace, we added the earliest draft of Howard's portion of "The Challenge From Beyond" round-Robin story.

For both SF and WM, we checked some of the stories against new drafts of the stories that were in Glenn Lord's collection. Originally, we only had the stories in the form they were published in the pulps where the story may have been edited by the publisher. Where the drafts had different or missing words/sentences from the published version, we restored them to match Howard's draft. In other words, not too much of a difference in the ultimate editions as opposed to the Foundation 1st editions they're replacing other than book size and new cover art.

Vincent wrote: "I have to read it slowly too. I've been trying to read a section a day or so, but I read a poem, do other things, read another, do other things, and so on. Some longer sections just take me longer ..."
Just a side note...It starts with the section "Singers in the Shadows" which was a small poetry book published by Donald M Grant in 1970 of 500 copies. It sold out quickly and for a long time was one of the most sought after of Grant's books. I have a second printing by Science Fiction Graphics, NYC of different type setting and includes artwork by Marcus Boaz. It also includes the introduction from the Grant book by Glenn Lord. There are 20 poems and it was limited to 1500 copies. It is almost identical to the poems in the first section of "Collected Poetry Vol 1" that the "Singers in the Shadows" had (including starting with "Zukala's Hour".
Some of the poems were in a slightly different order.
I also have some color artwork of "The Sea Woman." Can't remember who did the artwork. I'll dig it out at some point. I've been in my new house for almost 18 months and still have some things still boxed up!

Michael wrote: "Just a side note...It starts with the section "Singers in the Shadows" which was a small poetry book published by Donald M Grant in 1970 of 500 copies. I also have some color artwork of "The Sea Woman." Can't remember who did the artwork. I'll dig it out at some point. .

Yes, I would love to have that Donald M. Grant book. Would love to see the artwork for "The Sea Woman"!

John wrote: "Having to redo it also allowed me to add in 2 new letters from Howard that surfaced in November."

Neat! Any chance those letters will appear in the REH Foundation newsletter?

Finished the "Ready to Send Drafts" section of the book. Many great poems that I liked in here, and a few that didn't work for me. "The King and the Oak" of course, with King Kull, I have read before, but it's still great. And more of the Zukala poems which I like (The Tower of Zukala, an alternate version of that one, and Zukala's Jest). I really like these. "Buccaneer Treasure" (also in Pirate Adventures) is excellent, with a fun story.

Vincent,

The photocopy of the letter to Emil Petaja appeared in the current newsletter

John wrote: "Vincent,

The photocopy of the letter to Emil Petaja appeared in the current newsletter"

Oh! That one! Wonderful!

Not sure if anyone’s interested, but the guys at The Cromcast just wrapped up a mini-season on the poetry of REH. It’s definitely worth a listen id you feel inclined.

Thanks Dustin I’ll check it out

Finished the next section - Ready to Send Poetry in Pulp Stories - which were poems included in short stories that failed to sell. I've read most of these before when I read the stories in various collections. A lot of these were from "Men of the Shadows" (Bran Mak Morn).

I was surprised to see a story heading from "The Hour of the Dragon" in this section. It was serialized in Weird Tales, so I don't see how this counts as a story that failed to sell.

Finished the next section, which is Titled Drafts, with a smaller subsection called "Introductory Sampling." "Flight" was my favorite of this section, but I also have loved "Musings (1)" and "A Word from the Outer Dark" for a long time. "The Tempter" was particularly haunting, and I'd love to know when it was written as it foreshadows REH's suicide rather poignantly.

Read the next section of "Titled Drafts," which are poems about "Seeking Adventure and Freedom." I liked "Men Build Them Houses" the best, although "To the Old Men" struck me as particularly wonderful too.

I usually wait until I finish a section to comment, but I just read "The Rhyme of Three Slavers" and WOW! I liked that one. Haunting and just. It's also in Robert E. Howard: Selected Poems (page 317) if you don't have the Collected Poetry. It was also in the Robert E. Howard Foundation Newsletter V14N4 for those of you with access to that.

Does anyone have a favorite REH poem they'd like to mention and/or discuss?

I liked "The Coming of Bast" when I read it - but I REALLY liked the earlier untitled draft of that poem. A rare instance where I liked the draft better than final version.