Outlander Series discussion
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Rachel Hunter
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My own opinion is that Rachel and Ian will be together and that William will find his "soul mate".Having said that, let's hope that DG doesn't make a liar or fool out of me.
LOL! I love that daily lines too. I'm guessing that 'infantry platoon' means William.I'm with Carren, I think that in the end Rachel belongs with Ian and William will find his own woman that he loves deeply.
When William and Rachel were first together I thought they were connecting and liked that idea but when Ian and Rachel connected that did it for me. Ian has had such a tragic life he needs a connection like that and Rachel seems to accept him for who he is where others would not. I am definitely on team Ian. William will find the person for him when he finishes growing up and can truely appreciate life and what he has.
I totally love Rachel with Ian. They compliment each other nicely. It was so cute when he left his dog with her. I'm rooting for Ian because he deserves to be really happy for once. I don't know why but Anne Hathaway has been "Rachel" in my head.
Anne would be a good Rachel.
Wendy F wrote: "Anne would be a good Rachel."Never thought of it but yes I think so also
Okay, here is a question that has been bugging me since I decided to do a re-read of 'Echo in the Bone'...Do you think Rachel knows about Emily 'works with her hands', Ian's Mohawk wife? If she doesn't know, how do you think she'll react to the knowledge?
I'm just curious, because we know that Rachel is aware of Ian's popularity in the military camp (with other men's wives, at least) but she has a lot to learn about his experience in brothels, and his Mohawk 'family'.... and with her being a friend, I am curious as to how she'll react to Ian's rather colourful previous love life.
I don't think she knows yet.
She also knew (and accepted) that he was violent and a killer. She still liked him.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure she'll be understanding and sympathetic. I hope so...
I can't help but think that, given half the opportunity, William will throw Ian's past in Rachel's face... I mean, William knows that Ian had a wife (they shared a stilted convo about this in 'Echo'). And I am worried that in the midst of their love triangle (I'm going off of DG's #DailyLines hints) that William will use Ian's past romances as any easy target? Whatever happens, there's definitely plenty of tension and complication in store for this trio. Just because Rachel & Ian got a good start to their romance in 'Echo' doesn't mean it's going to be a smooth ride ... and I'm kinda looking forward to reading how they overcome hurdles.
I love the idea that Rachel is with Ian and with the lines by DG Rachel has a tough side. I can't side. I can't wait. If movie with Rachel came out, I see Evanna Lynch(luna lovegood in Harry Potter). I'm not sure if William should be involved just yet. Maybe a time traveler is who he needs.
I'm so glad I found this thread. Ian and Rachel were one of the *few* highlights for me in Echo. I pretty much disliked 90% of that book. I was frustrated in the lack of time spent on them. We never even got to read about their first meeting because William was unconscious and it was in his POV. Someone who is an Outlander friend told me Rachel was from Fraser's Ridge. I've searched on my kindle, and the only Rachel I could find is the one married to Farquard Campbell. Does anyone remember the Hunter's living on the Ridge? I know there were a few mentions of Quakers in ABOSAA, but nothing about Rachel Hunter or anyone named Hunter.
I'm pretty positive she was not on the ridge. I've only read Echo once though, so I don't know exactly how they met. I thought it was a new relationship, that they met on the road.
gertt wrote: "I think Rachel belongs with Ian, not only have they bonded, they both enjoy relatively simple lives, whereas, William would be better suited with a proper English girl. Regarding Ian's past with..."
I agree gertt. I think Ian will be faithful once he is married. He is a man of his word. I got a more brother/sister vibe from William and Rachel towards the end of Echo. I may be naive though...I haven't been reading the MOBY spoilers.
Wendy- I need to go back and find their first scene. I don't remember them meeting on the road, but I did skim A LOT in this book. Tried not to do it with the Ian sections. The first thing I remember is Ian bringing the horse and money for William. (Once again, told in William's POV dang it! )
I think Rachel definitely felt more sisterly toward William... not sure William really felt the same way. But I agree... Rachel is definitely for Ian.
I was under the impression that William really liked her and Ian's feelings kind of sneaked up on him. Maybe even held them aloft in deference to William. But the heart usually has it's own mind in such matters and cannot be swayed.
When I first read Echo, I raced through it. The next time I took some time and really enjoyed it. I am almost through Breath of Snow and Ashes and will reread Echo again. Getting ready for the new book! It is amazing how the books are interesting no matter how many times I read them.
I have read a daily line sometime that was Ian telling Rachel about Emily.
I always thought that Rachel liked both Young Ian and William... but being a Quaker, she couldn't reconcile her feelings with either one. I think she's definitely grateful to both of them for the things that they did to help her and her brother.But I do think that Rachel's affections turned towards Ian. And yes, I do think they belong together; it's just the question of her being a Quaker and Ian being anything but.
Daily lines do seem to indicate serious talk between Ian and Rachel. She seems to be his Claire, if you know what I mean. Ian was able to talk to Bree before, but since she's gone, he seems to be able to talk more and more to Rachel.
I think William will find another romance in MOBY... likely a bad match for him, because of his title and all. That always seems to be the way it is, isn't it? And his uncle Hal is already having fits with his cousin Dotty's decision to go after Rachel's brother, not to mention her own brother being in love with a black woman!
Rachel is *not* from Frasier's Ridge. She & Ian met somewhere on the road, where she was traveling with her brother, Denny. They seemed to be traveling with the war - to help with the wounded. And both are on the "outs" with their Quaker Friends, because Denny's choice to doctor the wounded is not a pacifistic attitude. It seems to be taking sides.
So, truthfully, while she's raised a Quaker and seems to have an unshakeable faith, Rachel is no longer a part of the Friends Society... it's just will that work for her and Ian? Because she still believes the Quaker way...
I will be the one dissenting voice in the Ian and Rachel scenario. I am not a big fan of Ian. He never clicked for me. If you could be "in love" with a character, it is William for me. I expect to see big changes in him and growth and maturity as he gets older. After all he is Jamies biological son. would very much like him to end up with Rachel. I just feel like Ian is unstable and could go back to the natives. Does anyone remember is Emily actually dead? It is clear the Ian loves/loved her deepily. If she is still alive this is certainly an issue.
Emily is still alive. I believe he loved her deeply, but he knows she's not for him anymore. At this point, I don't think he could return to the natives. At least not his tribe. And I don't think he'd choose to either. He was only there to fill a debt (well, and he loved and married Emily), and once he was more or less asked to leave, why would he go back? Emily is not his anymore. He doesn't really have anything to go back for.
Heather in FL wrote: "Emily is still alive. I believe he loved her deeply, but he knows she's not for him anymore. At this point, I don't think he could return to the natives. At least not his tribe. And I don't think h..."So then he cant technically marry Rachel Hunter. That will make him a bigamist. I dont think she would go for that given her background. Hmmm.. Must ponder this.
I don't think he's technically still married to Emily. I could be wrong, though. If he's still married to Emily, wouldn't SHE be a bigamist since she took a new husband?
Heather in FL wrote: "I don't think he's technically still married to Emily. I could be wrong, though. If he's still married to Emily, wouldn't SHE be a bigamist since she took a new husband?"Well I guess it would. Did emily get a new husband? I need to brush up on this bit of history. Maybe the native americans would consider her and Ian divorced? Would Rachel be comfortable with marrying someone who is divorced?
You see I am grasping at straws to get her to William. :)
Heather in FL wrote: "I don't think he's technically still married to Emily. I could be wrong, though. If he's still married to Emily, wouldn't SHE be a bigamist since she took a new husband?"Well I guess it would. Did emily get a new husband? I need to brush up on this bit of history. Maybe the native americans would consider her and Ian divorced? Would Rachel be comfortable with marrying someone who is divorced?
You see I am grasping at straws to get her to William. :)
Christa wrote: "Well I guess it would. Did emily get a new husband? I need to brush up on this bit of history. Maybe the native americans would consider her and Ian divorced? Would Rachel be comfortable with marrying someone who is divorced? "I'm going to put this in spoiler tags since this thread isn't marked as a spoiler thread. Oops.
(view spoiler)
I'm sure William will get someone great for himself. I just don't think it will be Rachel.
I wonder what made a marriage "legal" in the US those days? There certainly wasn't much government. I don't think an Indian marriage would be recognized by any of the Christian religions anyway. I would think a Quaker would not recognize the marriage as official. Just my thoughts...I want William with someone great too, but first I want him to figure out who he is as a person. I think he needs some alone time with Jamie to figure that out.
I was wondering the same thing -- about both the governmental "oversight" as well as a Christian recognizing an Indian marriage.
In the Indian way of thinking, Emily & Ian are no longer married. That's as good as a divorce. And since the "government" (is there one at this point?) didn't sanction Ian & Emily's marriage, there never was one, legally (as in the British government or "home rule") sense.So Ian is free to marry as he chooses. I think even Rachel would recognize that.
As for William, I have high hopes for him. He just needs to toughen up a bit; most of his "sufferings" were as a child - not knowing his mother and then losing his mother-Isabella (LJ's 1st wife). William might be an officer, but he's still mostly untried. In EITB, he had to toughen up somewhat, but in terms of emotional maturity, William's just now getting his "medicine". Because LJ has always been a good father to him, and because he *is* Jamie's biological son (and obviously inherited some of Jamie's traits), I believe William can become a good man; maybe never quite the man his true father, Jamie is, but a man to be proud of.
I agree with Lori - William needs to figure out who he is... what his titles and lands mean to him (he's still the legal heir to his titles and lands)... what "father" is and means... and what he really wants. In William reaching for Rachel, I saw him doing what Jamie's described - men reaching for a woman's softness - that forgiveness, that drowning everything else out. But I don't think William loves Rachel; he thinks he does, but I think he's in love with the idea of love and a good woman. I only hope that he's not too impetuous to open his eyes before he blindly reaches for the next one. (view spoiler)
I know this is a Rachel thread, and we have gotten off track, but I would like to say, if William and Jamie can have some type of father/son relationship, it might end up being my favorite love story in the books (besides J&C of course). I see great potential there. I just hope that's the direction she wants to go in. DG and I don't always see eye to eye with characters, lol. I also wonder if William will ever find out that LJ is gay....
*ok, back to Rachel*
I love the girl, but I hope she drops some of the "thee" and "thou's" :P
I had the insensible thought that Denny and Rachel are also time travelers and that's why they are so forward-thinking in their behaviors. Too easy, I know, but I would like to see Rachel and Claire talking about airplanes. haha!I also think Ian and Rachel would be good for one another. William needs to grow up a bit, in my opinion.
As for the legality of Ian's marriage to Emily, the wife has the final say in a marriage in the Indian culture Emily is part of so if he is sent away, they are not married. The British government would not recognize it as a marriage, either way. Ian and Rachel could marry, but not in the Quaker church. I suspect Jamie would work out a way to get them married by a priest!
I want to start a discussion all about Rachel... and, more importantly, Rachel's relationship with Young Ian & William.
I have loved Rachel ever since she, straight-faced, accepted some grease from Ian for a parient's 'itchy arsehole'. Lol, not the most romantic of first encounters... but Gabaldon made up for it with Rachel's "Thee is my wolf" speech at the very end.
So, I know that lots of people thought Rachel & Ian were very rushed in 'Echo' (a few have mentioned that she was a quickly conceived target for Arch Bug's revenge). Regardless, I am a HUGE Ian/Rachel shipper. But that doesn't mean I don't LOVE all of DG's 'Daily Lines' and the hints of a love triangle between William/Rachel/Ian.
So. Discuss. What do you think of Rachel Hunter? Do you want her with Ian or William? Speculate on her role in 'Written in my Own Heart's Blood'.
Here's my favourite 'Daily Lines' so far, from DG:
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“You’ll what?” he asked, half-breathless. “You’re a Quaker. You don’t believe in violence. Ergo, you can’t—or at least won’t—“ he corrected himself, seeing the dangerous look in her eye, “—shoot me. You probably won’t even strike me. So what did you have in mind?”
She did strike him. Her hand whipped out like a snake and slapped him across the face hard enough to make him stagger.
“So now thee has [done something reprehensible], repudiated thy father, and caused me to betray my principles. What next?!”
“Oh, bloody hell,” he said, and grabbed her arms, pulled her roughly to him and kissed her. He let go and stepped back, quickly, leaving her bug-eyed and gasping. She glared at him, spat on the ground at his feet, then wiped her lips on her sleeve, and turning away, marched off.
“Is spitting on people a part of your bloody principles?” he shouted after her.
She swung round, fists clenched at her sides.
“Is assaulting women part of yours?” she bellowed back, to the amusement of the infantry platoon who had been standing still, leaning on their weapons and gaping at the side-show provided.
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Copyright 2011 Diana Gabaldon