If I Die discussion

in my oppinion I think that Tod and Kaylee`s relationship is absoloutely ridiculous... Nash was her first ever lover and if it wasn`t for him she may still not have known why she screams for a soul everytime... and she may still have been living at her uncles and not knowing about her past.... he was her shoulder to cry on whenever things got hard for her...and in this book Nash gets damaged because of her and I know it`s not fair because she caught Sabine and him together.... and what I don`t understand is why she can`t explain to Nash what happened to her and why she rejected him.. so if anyone out there who can at least explain to me what the HELL is wrong with Kaylee
please write back.......

I guess I can't explain because I am a Todd fan. Nash did some undesirable things with Balloon use, Sabine, and whatever that guy was that was using his body against. Which he knew and did not mention till a later time. She could not trust him. I don't remember her losing her V-card to anyone.

I think Kaylee explained to Nash her feelings pretty well. She told him she does love him and always will but the trust is broken. She tried to work on getting it back but it just was not happening. He was her first love so she desperately wanted it to work but didn't realize how much it was not working until she felt something that was working, Tod. She never fully understood Nash. He never shared his feelings with her like what he felt when his dad and Tod died, how he feels about the friends whose lives he destroyed with his frost addiction or even where he wants to go to college. Nash allowed Avari to use her body, lied about Frost and kept Sabine in his life even knowing she was after him. Nash then tells Kaylee she can't hang out with Tod cause Tod likes her? Well as she said Nash knows Sabine is after him but still hangs out with her. They are just a mess. Hopefully Kaylee and Tod can make each other happy. And with the events at the end of If I Die I think they are an even better match for each other.

Jennifer wrote: "I think Kaylee explained to Nash her feelings pretty well. She told him she does love him and always will but the trust is broken. She tried to work on getting it back but it just was not happening..."

Exactly. I couldn't think of the name Avari.

Jennifer wrote: "I think Kaylee explained to Nash her feelings pretty well. She told him she does love him and always will but the trust is broken. She tried to work on getting it back but it just was not happening..."

Couldnt have said it better myself!! :)

I have to say that I understand perfectly the connection between Kaylee and Tod. I LOVE Tod's personality, he's funny, even more mature than Nash and he's probably best for Kaylee. For some reason I just can't...accepted it. I think that if the author did this a different way, it would have been better or easier for me to take in.

Sarah wrote: "I have to say that I understand perfectly the connection between Kaylee and Tod. I LOVE Tod's personality, he's funny, even more mature than Nash and he's probably best for Kaylee. For some reason ..."

I could tell that he had feelings for her. He was there to save when she was in the world. The last was awesome, I just did not think she would be a reaper

Rita wrote: "I guess I can't explain because I am a Todd fan. Nash did some undesirable things with Balloon use, Sabine, and whatever that guy was that was using his body against. Which he knew and did not men..."

I totally agree with you!

TOD IS AMAZING. ♥

The reason kaylee and nash broke up in the first place is cause he lied to her about him using frost, and thhen be didnt even tell her about the deal he made with avari. He let avari use kaylees body any way he wanted and then on top of that he gave away the most sacred thing, the memories of him and kaylee. Nash doesnt even remember what their first kiss was like, he gave away his love for kaylee. Kaylee tried to work it out with nash but when sabine came in to the picture it was doomed from then. Cause didnt tell kaylee about sabine staying over late, and when kaylee asked him not hang out with sabine he said that they are just friends, but then nash comes backs and tells kaylee not to hang out with tod that right there was not fair of nash. If he was gonna continue to hang with sabine even after she admitted to waintin him back, then kaylee had all the right to hang with tod. I like tod from the beginning he is like a open book he says what he thinks and he would do anything to help kaylee, cause he loves her. At first i was rooting for nash but know i think kaylee and tod would be good together and nash and sabine we be good together too.

Tiffany wrote: "The reason kaylee and nash broke up in the first place is cause he lied to her about him using frost, and thhen be didnt even tell her about the deal he made with avari. He let avari use kaylees bo..."

Totally agree. But I could careless about Sabine. Never liked her.

Tiffany wrote: "The reason kaylee and nash broke up in the first place is cause he lied to her about him using frost, and thhen be didnt even tell her about the deal he made with avari. He let avari use kaylees bo..."

Too true! :)

http://www.amazon.com/Before-I-Wake-H...

I'm already majorly loving Tod & Kaylee as a couple just from this excerpt.

Jennifer wrote: "http://www.amazon.com/Before-I-Wake-H...

I'm already majorly loving Tod & Kaylee as a couple just from this excerpt."

hgfaywqk. So cute!! ♥

"So don't. Come hang out with me at work." Tod dropped back into my desk chair and swiveled to face me while I knelt to grab my sneakers from beneath my bed. "We can play naughty dress up with the hospital gowns and rearrange the supply closets."

I actually want to wear a hospital gown! LOL To play naughty dress up with Tod I'm down hehe

Haha, who wouldn't be? ;D

Jennifer wrote: "I think Kaylee explained to Nash her feelings pretty well. She told him she does love him and always will but the trust is broken. She tried to work on getting it back but it just was not happening..."

I could not agree with you more. You're right,Kaylee doesn't understand Nash, but even more than that, I really don't think Nash understands Kaylee. I only realized that once I saw how well Tod understands her, going so far as to being able to voice her thoughts and insecurities. And she can do the same with him. Tod has been paying a lot of attention to Kaylee, really taking the time to get to know her and they're a lot alike. He's also completely honest with her, always has been, no matter how ugly the truth is. He has a lot more faith in how much she can handle than Nash. Nash thinks she's perfect and that he needs to be perfect to be with her or something and that when things go wrong he needs to keep acting like everything's fine. That's where he was wrong. Then there's the fact that Tod is only really himself when he's around Kaylee, that was already apparent in the earlier books, and she was paying more attention than both she and I thought :).

Because of all of this, I think a relationship between Tod and Kaylee has the potential to be great, (who am I kidding, it already is) because they'll be honest and real with each other. It'll probably mean they'll have lots of arguments because they're both stubborn and opinionated but it'll last. I also think that it'll make them passionate together :D.

If you really think about it, Tod and Kaylee have already shared a spark that Nash and Kaylee could never really have. Rachel Vincent beautifully wrote up her character Kaylee as an ordinary girl who can do things extra-ordinary but really, her and Nash are complete opposites and never had a chance in hell (Netherworld) he's on the football team and she was labelled a nutcase. I love all three main characters equally I just don't think that Kaylee and Nash are meant to be.

I don't think Kaylee should get Nash or Tod because they don't deserve her. And frankly, Sabine doesn't deserve anyone at all unless the dude is a cannibal. I mean, come on I can't be the only one who wants her to drop dead she is just fuming of arrogance and disrespect. But anyways, both Nash and Tod didn't care about her safety at one point. She needs to pick a guy who actually cares and respects her at all time.

tod is amazing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! i think that kaylee is lucky to have tod because he is sensitive and caring and he loves her for who she is not who other people think she is!!!

indivia wrote: "tod is amazing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! i think that kaylee is lucky to have tod because he is sensitive and caring and he loves her for who she is not who other people think she is!!!"

Yes! :)

Nisat wrote: "I don't think Kaylee should get Nash or Tod because they don't deserve her. And frankly, Sabine doesn't deserve anyone at all unless the dude is a cannibal. I mean, come on I can't be the only one..."

I agree with the Sabine issue all the way. But when did Tod never care about her safety? Maybe in the beginning, when she met him. But he was dealing with the whole being a Reaper thing. The were meant to be together, go read Reaper. :)

Rita wrote: "Nisat wrote: "I don't think Kaylee should get Nash or Tod because they don't deserve her. And frankly, Sabine doesn't deserve anyone at all unless the dude is a cannibal. I mean, come on I can't b..."

Haha, totally agree with you. :)

as my name indicates i hate sabine!!! lol! i kinda think that she and kaylee could have been friends if, and i say if, she hadn't gone and done all that crap to her just to get nash back. i mean, come on who haunts someone's nightmare just for a guy, and a cheater/liar/jerk! tod is amazing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

indivia wrote: "as my name indicates i hate sabine!!! lol! i kinda think that she and kaylee could have been friends if, and i say if, she hadn't gone and done all that crap to her just to get nash back. i mean, c..."

Definitely! Though I did like her a teensy bit more in "BIW", 'cause she really hates Sophie. x)

EVERYONE HATES SOPHIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Helaina wrote: "indivia wrote: "EVERYONE HATES SOPHIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

I think Sophies in general seem to have a bad rep but thats just me talking...!

Nisat wrote: "I don't think Kaylee should get Nash or Tod because they don't deserve her. And frankly, Sabine doesn't deserve anyone at all unless the dude is a cannibal. I mean, come on I can't be the only one..."

I have to agree with you on that. Tod totally ignored Kaylee's safety when he was trying to save his ex's soul (an ex that by the way he seemed to still be in love with). I dont know why people keep forgetting that detail when they put Tod in a pedestal.
And lets be frank that Nash was a great boyfriend in the first two books. If things werent great in the relationship was Thanks to Kaylee's insecurities. I didnt like how Rachel changed his character completely and turned him into an asshole.
But guys, the worst man in her life is her father. The guy abandoned her and let her believe she was crazy. What a jerk!

Michelle wrote: "Nisat wrote: "I don't think Kaylee should get Nash or Tod because they don't deserve her. And frankly, Sabine doesn't deserve anyone at all unless the dude is a cannibal. I mean, come on I can't b..."

I don't think anyone has forgotten what Tod did in book 2. I sure haven't and I hated him for it for a while. But the truth is, I don't blame him. Kaylee went into helping Tod, a total stranger back then, with open eyes, because she's just that good. She knew it would be dangerous but it was her choice. And yes, Tod shouldn't have done what he did, way to thank someone who's helping you. But at the same time I understand. When Tod had to choose between saving someone he was in love with and someone he barely knew, the choice was pretty obvious. If he hadn't tried to save Addy, he would've kept wondering if he could have tried and he wouldn't have been able to move on. Kaylee and Tod would never have happened. Because I think it's that moment when Tod let go of Addy. It's also in that moment when he realized how strong Kaylee can be, even in a dangerous situation and when he started to admire her for it.

Plus, Tod's a reaper, they have their own moral code. I don't know if you've noticed, but he isn't the "doing the right thing" kind of guy, he's more "a means to an end" kind of guy. His goal was to save Addy and Kaylee was a means to an end. If she had to die for that to happen, he would've let her die, if it was her or Addy. It was only because he couldn't save Addy, that he decided to save Kaylee. As a reaper who had been losing his humanity bit by bit for 2 years, he was practical, not too in touch with his emotions. So I don't really blame him.

Kalee changed that a little.

And Rachel didn't change Nash's character. Nash i the same person he always was, it's just that Kaylee grew and Nash couldn't deal with that. Kalee kind of outgrew their (superficial) relationship. Looking back, I think Nash never really loved Kaylee. He was attracted to her vulnerability, because she needed someone him. He's the kind of guy who needs people to need him, who takes broken people and tries to fix them. That's the only time he taks control of a situation. Sabine is also sort of broken. She needs Nash in a way Kaylee doesn't (anymore), that's why their relationship "works". Kaylee reached a point where she didn't need Nash as much in that way and Nash couldn't deal with that. He tried to fit Kaylee into a certain mold, painting her as fragile and pure and in need of protection, shielding her from his thoughts, his feelings and the world around her. But Kaylee is very capable of dealing with things. Tod realized that. Nash also couldn't deal with Kaylee's "heroic" escapades, which is very much a part of Kaylee's character. In that and a lot of other things, she is a lot like Tod. The difference between Nash and Tod is that Tod knows her, simply because he is like her. He doesn't shield her from anything, he's honest with her, because he knows she can handle it and he understands her completely. He also challenges her constantly. She does the same for him.

Nash blames his life and everything that goes wrong in it on everything and everyone but himself. He doesn't take responsibility for anything. On the night Tod died, Nash had the nerve to blame Tod for him being at that party (also because his mother enabled him. Nash being the youngest, Tod was always the one who was supposed to keep him out of trouble), at one point he blamed Kaylee for him taking more frost, because "she had hurt his feelings" (I mean what are you, a 5 year old girl?) I think Nash is a good guy, but unless he starts taking responsibility for his actions, I'm afraid for him. Because other people did screw him over (and they'll continue to do so), but he could have (re)acted differently. That's why we have free will.

And I completely agree about Kaylee's dad. And I blame her aunt and uncle too. What kind of family makes their kid think she's crazy?!

Helaina wrote: "Michelle wrote: "Nisat wrote: "I don't think Kaylee should get Nash or Tod because they don't deserve her. And frankly, Sabine doesn't deserve anyone at all unless the dude is a cannibal. I mean, c..."

Sunnykimmy wrote: "Michelle wrote: "Nisat wrote: "I don't think Kaylee should get Nash or Tod because they don't deserve her. And frankly, Sabine doesn't deserve anyone at all unless the dude is a cannibal. I mean, c..."

I agree with both of you! Sunnykimmy on the whole Tod/Nash thing, and Helaina on Kaylee's dad. :)

Yeah, he left Kaylee, but it was also to protect her so that Thane wouldn't try to go after her again. And, c'mon! You gotta feel bad for the guy after both his wife AND his daughter die. :'(

Helaina wrote: "Michelle wrote: "Nisat wrote: "I don't think Kaylee should get Nash or Tod because they don't deserve her. And frankly, Sabine doesn't deserve anyone at all unless the dude is a cannibal. I mean, c..."

Uh, did we read the same book? Because I'm pretty sure Kaylee's dad abandoned her because he couldn't deal looking at her because she reminded him too much of her mother, not because he needed to make money and support her. He could have stayed in the US and worked, he could have taken her to Ireland. There is really no excuse for a parent to abandon his kid for most of her life and worst, let her be sent to a freaking asylum because he couldn't deal and tell her the truth.
And uncle and aunt is not a replacement for real parents. It was bad enough that Kaylee had lost her mother but at least her mother was dead. The knowledge that her dad was alive but chose not to be in her life was much more damaging.
I just can't bring myself to feel an ounce of sorrow for him. Yes, I'm that harsh.

i don't think he actually knew the extent of the premonition that landed her in lakeside, strapped to a bed. but it was still inexcusable for him to do that to her! i think that because he came back he almost deserves another chance, but that's not the point. he left her for his brother to raise, and she shouldn't have forgive that so quickly.
i think if her dad had died and her mum had lived that things would have been significanty different and she wouldn't have been raised not knowing what she really was, and she wouldn't have had to find out her whole life had been a facade to hide the truth from her because she was 'fragile'!!!

You guys do have good points. :)

brendan did know!!!! but he wasn't allowed, by his brother, to tell kaylee anything which is why she was sent to lakeside in the first place!!

Mika wrote: "Helaina wrote: "Michelle wrote: "Nisat wrote: "I don't think Kaylee should get Nash or Tod because they don't deserve her. And frankly, Sabine doesn't deserve anyone at all unless the dude is a can..."
no your not harsh because it`s the absolute truth

Tiffany wrote: "The reason kaylee and nash broke up in the first place is cause he lied to her about him using frost, and thhen be didnt even tell her about the deal he made with avari. He let avari use kaylees bo..."

I completely agree!

Rita wrote: "I guess I can't explain because I am a Todd fan. Nash did some undesirable things with Balloon use, Sabine, and whatever that guy was that was using his body against. Which he knew and did not ment..."
1) It's one 'd' on Tod - look at the books and 2) I COMPLETELY AGREE!!!!! Nash let Avari possess her body, lied to her, sneaked around and went behind her back, deliberately making her out to seem crazy in front of both of their families - I would do a hell of a lot more than what Kaylee did if I were in her place. And then Tod worked so hard to keep her from being stalked by Thane and always put HER first!!! He was willing to die - properly this time - rather than to reap her soul. Their souls bonded - literally. They are the most AMAZING COUPLE EVER!!! And she lost her virginity in 'Before I Wake'. And I never can stand the first guy she meets being her soul mate - it's too cliché, and - honestly - makes for a pretty bad storyline in my opinion because it is just a little bit common.