ONTD Book Club discussion

Discuss A Storm of Swords! Please hide any major spoilers under a spoiler cut :)

I'M STARTING THIS ONE. WISH ME LUCK.

GOOD LUCK BRENDEN.

GIRD YOUR LOINS AND STEEL YOUR HEART.

I am probably going to spam all of the ASoIaF boards with this, but I just found this link and it's saved my rear. I am working on the latest book now and I keep forgetting all of the secondary characters and what's happened to them, especially since I've been spacing out the reading of the books. Well, there's a website that I found, Tower of the Hand, and you can tell the site to give you information on characters/places only through the book you've read--so you don't get spoilers!

http://towerofthehand.com/ -->be sure to set your scope (books read)

I'm just about to read the RW and I need to be held by literally every person in the world right now. I don't want to read it noooooooooo

Oh my godddd I just finished the book and it was fucking crazy. I loved it but omg so many people died. So many people! I loved the end stuff though but I think now I finalllllly may? understand Mia's being upset with Tyrion...

So many people died, yes. It seemed as though GRRM was suddenly on a housekeeping spree.

Some of the deaths were unconvincing though..
(view spoiler)[Tyrion killing Tywin for instance. A character as shrewd and calculating as Tyrion, who has digested much insult and tragedies, doesnt seem likely to go on an impulsive killing fit. Shae maybe understandable.. but his own father? Also, For all the character building done for Tywin, putting him and Shae together in the end also seems far fetched. (hide spoiler)] Anyone agrees?

Yes I agree that chapter severely gave me heartache like crazy because I felt a bit betrayed. (view spoiler)[Tyrion killing Shae just like that totally hurt. I didn't think he would do something like that since he's usually such a mental, not physical person, but I guess after a week in an isolated cell he went crazy. He's been kicked around his whole life and suddenly he snaps. I don't understand why Tywin was bedding Shae though, that was odd to me.

Also, I'm sad that Tywin didn't have the chance to give the chain of golden hands to Jaime. That would have been like the most teasing insult ever. (hide spoiler)]

I really disliked him when he started Frank Millering in ADWD, but I think one big thing about Tyrion is that he's the only real POV we get of the whores of Westeros and even with all his difficulties, he's still a really rich, dude, so... he doesn't really get them at all and that interests me a lot about Shae, so I was uncomfortable with how that fallout was handled.

Plus those actions might have been different with another character, but with Tyrion, Jon, Dany, and Arya, you get the feeling they're the author's favs so it's less easy for me to judge nuance and I'm more nervous that he MEANS that Tyrion's actions were justified.

(view spoiler)[I'll give him Tywinn, that dude is the worst. But I doubt Shae had much of a choice in the matter, PLUS, did she have any evidence that Tyrion DIDN'T kill Joffery? I like what the show has done with Shae so far... haha and Tyrion. Like the way he talks about Tysha pre-finding out she wasn't a whore and then difference post that, is a big thing for me too. (hide spoiler)] If it's the deconstruction of a heroic figure, then yeah I think he's really interesting and woo Lannisters, but if it's leading up to him being the big hero on a dragon, Imma throw the books into the fire.

Haven't read ADWD yet but "Frank Millering" made me grin :) Chopping off hands really is FM trademark.. why dint I think of this before !! :D
(view spoiler)[
With that little peek into the past of Tywin given by Kevan, his hate for the prostitutes is kind of justified. Which makes his bedding Shae all the more odd.

Also, have we seen the last of the Hound? It was not explicitly stated but makes me wonder.
Looks like Bronn is gone for good too. That saddened me a little.
(hide spoiler)]

i love bronn so i agree i'd love for him to come back.

also, Martin said he was intrigued by SanSan shippers and he might play around a little with that later which makes me lol because i'd love that

i also watched the commentary on the GoT blurays and he said that the show is affecting what he's going to write later in the books, like how he loves the way the character Osha is played in the show and plans to write more stuff for her because he's inspired, etc

Do you subscribe to the popular on going theory regarding Jon Snow's parentage?

I was actually glad that there will be no more POV for Catelyne "never-met-a-situation-she-cant-make-worse" Stark till i read the epilogue :-/

Yes I am almost certain beyond a doubt about the Jon Snow theory

There is no other reason for Lyanna Stark going "promise me ned" the entire first book long.

I really don't understand how Cat made any situation worse. The (view spoiler)[arresting Tyrion thing was maybe not the best move, but Tywinn was set on starting shit anyway, plus if Ned had handled the situation in King's Landing better it might have blown over... plus Cat was in kind of a difficult situation when Tyrion noticed her, especially considering she believed that he had pushed her young son out of a window at the time (hide spoiler)]. But other than that, she made really great decisions and gave Robb excellent advice. I'd even say that (view spoiler)[releasing Jaime was not necissarily a bad decision fallout wise, though it was clearly not the greatest at the time... but Robb made a dumb one too with Jeyne, because well, STARKS bless 'em. And either way Frey was dying to start shit. Cat's insistance on fixing it SHOULD have worked, she even made sure they had bread and salt, except Frey is the worsssssssst even by Westeros standards (hide spoiler)].

Wigs, tho, I hope GRRM takes the show with a grain of salt, especially considering how they mutilated Robb & Cat's characters for no good reason. Also, dude, WRITE YO BOOKS forget the show.

I just. I like almost all of the characters. At the point of this book I pretty much love everyone except Gregor Clegane, Tywinn, and I wanna say that other Bastard, but I don't remember if he's really showed himself yet. Either way a house with a flayed man on it can't have good people.

If GRRM goes back on R+L=J just because a lot of people figured it out, I'd be pissed. But lbr, I'd be happy if he just wrote anything related to ASoIaF at this point. AFfC and ADwD were boring (to me, at least) and I really just want some new developments.

Arresting Tyrion based on simply circumstantial evidence was bad enough, then taking him to Lysa for justice was really poor judgment.
I think my issue with Cat has more to do with the fact that she abandoned her children. When the situation rapidly evolved into a full blown war, she had 2 young sons, alone at Winterfell and 2 daughters at the mercy of a vindictive queen regent. She should have gone to either of them. Used whatever power she had and done something. There were better things to do than go to your father's castle and assume yourself to be all helpless. Robb did not need her more than her other children.

And yes, I am bit skeptical about GRRM being involved with the show and letting it affect his writing. I hope he does not alter things too much in order to play for the galleries :-/