ACCESS SCHOLARSHIP Group - CDE discussion

Discuss the different ways that racism is depicted in the novel; don't forget to mention: Lula, Dolphus Raymond, the Ewells and ‘white trash’, and the typical Maycomb mentality concerning it. Don't forget to comment on your classmates' ideas!

well, in the novel we can appreciate the different ways how people discriminate others for ex, the skin color, we can see in the calphurnia church,the members have a strong reaction , when they saw the white children... because they received discrimination, in addition they try to return that, in other case in judgment about TOM ROBISON rape? the racism is present there because the typical Maycomb mentality don't matter about someone white man rape some black girl, but when someone who is black rape some white girl, they try to apply the justice with a lot of force, but in all of the case they have the obligation to do that, but they show us with the exception the opposite of it , Dolphus Raymond is specie who was include of the society , first because he's a drunk nobody considered him some less important, member, and put title to the people separe and try with them how and think so, they're white trash depicted how they treatment are presented the racism, with the diferent , when they don't accept nothing and considered their god lula is an object of the racism in my opinion, the clasificacion of that produced that and only accept the person who is a member of your own club, thinking discriminate, is follow the steps of racism.

Well, there are many ways of racism in the novel, some of them is the economic situation, they`re all divide in social classes depending of their economic situation, but the worst way of racism is their mentality about the black people, the white people (not all) see the black people as NOTHING, they aren`t nothing for them…
In the case of Lula, she act in that way (she didn`t want white people in their church) I think because she know that the white people would not let any black people come in their church, so she was acting the same, but I know that that is wrong, but in that time was like that, and what make me happy is to know that in the middle of all that there were people who doesn`t think like that and accept the other as they are, one of them was Atticus.

Raquel: in other case in judgment about TOM ROBISON rape? the racism is present there because the typical Maycomb mentality don't matter about someone white man rape some black girl, but when someone who is black rape some white girl, they try to apply the justice with a lot of force…
All what happened in the case of Tom was an injustice… and like you wrote they didn`t give importance to Tom because he is black, they see how is the situation, I think that they already know that TOM didn`t do nothing bad to Mayella, but they still want to accuse him and to see him in the jail just because he isn`t white…
I hope that Tom`s situation change for good.

Ok, this novel shows us the racism in many ways, not only the white people discriminate the black people also vice versa, Lula attitude demonstrate that, she doesn´t accept white people in the church, because they are white and for the religion. Dolphus Raymont is a man who lives like he wants and doesn´t care the opinions of the other, but the society discriminate him for that, they don´t think in help him only discriminate. The Ewells case, is really unjust for Tom, only because he is black he has less opportunity to win, but Atticus is a good man, I like his personality, he is different from the other, and did the best in the court . That happen until now especially with the persons who don´t have enough money, I always hear “ the justice is for the rich people,” that made me feel bad because all people have the same right , The mentality of Maycob is similar, people who have high economic condition, who are white, have more chances to be better, but like Atticus, he demonstrate us that we have to help the others and not think if the person is white, rich, only try to do the best for everybody.

Well, racism exist until today, not like the past, but until exist, it doesn't matter they have rights, if white persons discriminate them, we know that sometimes we hear news about it, like "a black person was not hired for work in a company because the possible cause was the racism" For me is like a joke; only cowards do that, because I would not have the heart to say someone who don't have my same skin color that I don't want to be with them, because it's possible that I'm a bad person, and they are good persons, and we don't know what could happen, we sometimes prejudice persons, and destroy their life, with a only word.
So, about the history, we can see so much the racism, and so much!, like Aunt Alexandra, She's a person who maybe doesn't tell them that She hate them or something like that, but She show it with his gestures, or indirects, that She doesn't like them, I think that She has to know more about before say something, because you don't know if a person who you ever prejudice, would help you someday, so, I understand Lula in part, because She's black and She wants to defend her territory of "white persons" so, Atticus always talks with his children about, so, they growing up, without the racism in their mind, even, they love Calpurnia!, and that's the reason of Aunt Alexandra doesn't like, that maybe they prefer a black person than a white person, and for her is bad, because what would say the neighbors, She only think about it.

RaquelGonzalez wrote: "because the typical Maycomb mentality don't matter about someone white man rape some black girl, but when someone who is black rape some white girl, they try to apply the justice with a lot of force".

Yes, Raquel, is a typical mentality, and is sad to said that we have the same color of blood, but they don't want to hear about it, they think about the exterior, but it doesn't matter that they're a really good persons, kind of persons, who work a lot; they look at their skin like they do something too bad, and then prejudice them, persons only want to talk about others, but they never look at themselves, to know what kind of person they're, maybe they're worse than black persons, but they guess that they're like perfect because they're white, no, the trouble is not there.

Racism is a form of discrimination against people using racial, skin tone or other physical characteristics of individuals, so that some are considered higher to others maybe
It is a very sensitive issue as there is even today, in the novel we learn more about racism especially with the history of tom robison ,by their skin color "black" suffer discrimination and accusations on the part of white ",thought not only that time
through this rejection appear "Lula" which have the same behavior they receive from the whites
There are also people Dolphus Raymond, and the Ewells the first case is about the alcoholic people, and on the other dirty people who do not want to work and study, ignored society who believe they are unable to do something and succeed, or even get a second chance
we must be aware, that we are surrounded in a world where we continue to discrimination (other) either in physical appearance (fat or thin), also at work, women often don't get jobs because they are women,and the deaf mute or disabled, who feels excluded from the society they live
we must try to change this thinking, only a disservice to others because we are all equal and deserve the same opportunities and together to fight for a better world

camila wrote:
Well, there are many forms of racism in the novel, some of them is the economic situation, that 'everyone division into social classes
I agree, rich people are usually the preferred and enjoying their rights, and often mistreat the poor, which is wrong they should help and be better
there have to treat people as you would like to be treate, and practice the values ​​above all

Rosana wrote: " The Ewells case, is really unjust for Tom"

How do the other members of Maycomb feel about the Ewells? Do you think there's racism or prejudice there? How?

Kathia wrote: "Racism is a form of discrimination against people using racial, skin tone or other physical characteristics of individuals, so that some are considered higher to others"

When you write these types of definitions, you should put the source (where you got it from) because it's not your own idea.

Kathia wrote: "Racism is a form of discrimination against people using racial, skin tone or other physical characteristics of individuals, so that some are considered higher to others maybe
It is a very sensitive..."

Kathia, please use PUNCTUATION when you write... Periods (.), Commas (,), Capital letters, etc.

Raquelgonzalez wrote: "Dolphus Raymond is specie who was include of the society , first because he's a drunk nobody considered him some less important, member, and put title to the people separe and try with them how and think so,"

Raquel, I'm trying to understand this, but it's a bit confusing because you don't use PERIODS (.) to stop an idea.
It seems as you're contradicting what you said: first you state Raymond's included in society; he's a drunk, but still important, but then they put a title? To what? What title? Please separate your ideas with periods, and if possible in paragraphs so it is simpler to comprehend what you are trying to explain.

"RACISM" the little word that affected and still affects to the society in all the world!
The racism was practice for many people in the past, but I considered that is until now..
The book show us differents attitudes, contrasts about people that react of differents ways because "think differently" like Lula and Dolphus Raymond.

-Raymond a man who has honorable descendants, but he decided live with people differents than him, create her family with a women of different skin, and what's the problem? In his might maybe not exist a wall of segregation!

-Lula; the black man that is able even of discriminate to "KIDS",(Jem and Scout) until where leads us the racism? but for him, he was correct because that is her thinking (her bad way of thinking).

The main or big root of the racism is THE IGNORANCE that still alive in our minds.

Discriminate isn't just look the color of skin and despise, but is also "THE PREJUDGEMENT" that we do every day with the persons that we still don't hear talk! Maybe it can be a UNWITTING way of act every day that we don't realize.
Racism is practiced until now, for each one of us, unconsciously or worst, when is consciously.

Karen wrote: "Atticus always talks with his children about, so they growing up, without the racism in their mind, even, they love Calpurnia!, and that's the reason of Aunt Alexandra doesn't like, that maybe they prefer a black person than a white person, ...

Great point Karen! Is really exact your deduction, about the attitude of Aunt Alexandra, maybe her also practiced the racism unwittingly.. Why the children (Jem and scout) can't maybe love more a black-women (Calpurnia), being that she wasn't member "REAL" of "the great family Finch" but they loved her, and Aunt Alexandra really disapprove completely that !

Well, nowadays there still exists a lot of racism around the world, but in that time (the 30's) the problem was that the racist people seemed like they didn't even suspect that they were wrong, they hated different races but they didn't know why, they only hated and that's all. That's the question the children and Mr. Dolphus Raymond do. They know that the color doesn't matter about the morality of somebody. The white trash is a very good example of this prejudice.
Maybe this has something to do about the association often people give (this coming from childhood) to appearance: black is a ugly color, so the blacks are ugly, if they're ugly, they're bad, then blacks are bad.
Lula's attitude is easy to explain: as black, she received discrimination, so when the white children went to the black church, she wanted to make feel them what she must stand every day. I'm not saying that was right to have done that, but it was interesting to know that were black people that weren't going to bear the racism anymore.
The typical Maycomb mentality, personified by Aunt Alexandra, is that "all black fellows are bad" and "there are whites that are superior to other whites for several reasons, but all whites are superior to blacks" despite if there are blacks that are better human beings than many white people, like the Ewells.
What I like about this story that the main characters, the Finches, know that this is bad, and they try to change the opinion of their town.

Rosana wrote: "Ok, this novel shows us the racism in many ways, not only the white people discriminate the black people also vice versa, Lula attitude demonstrate that, she doesn´t accept white people in the chur..."

"people who have high economic condition, who are white, have more chances to be better"

Better than the blacks? Of course yes! If they have the power, the control of the government and the justice, the money... but the worst part of this is that in that time, the black people didn't have ANY chances to be better. How could have they been able to defend themselves if they didn't know how to? Of course, there were good-hearted people that helped them but it wasn't enough...

Romina wrote: "Rosana wrote: " The Ewells case, is really unjust for Tom"

How do the other members of Maycomb feel about the Ewells? Do you think there's racism or prejudice there? How?"


I think the majority of them(white people, rich people)feel good, but is not for the Ewills victory in the trial, the reason is that in that time the black people were discriminate for their skins, and are included for that, not matter if they´re good persons, only for the race.
I think there are both, racism because the jury are composed for white people and don´t like black people, and prejudice because I think Atticus showed true enough to believe Tom´s innocence, but they judged bad him and sentenced an innocence person only because he is black.

What I like about this story that the main characters, the Finches, know that this is bad, and they try to change the opinion of their town.
Yes Rebecca-! What they did, especially what Atticus did was very important, he always teach Scout and Jem about good things, and say to them that everybody is the same…in Tom`s case, I think that the people in the court or in the town already now the truth, they already now that Tom isn`t guilt but they don`t want to accept it because he`s black. Atticus did what he had to; now, we only can wait to know what will happen.

“Discriminate isn't just look the color of skin and despise, but is also "THE PREJUDGEMENT" that we do every day with the persons that we still don't hear talk! Maybe it can be a UNWITTING way of act every day that we don't realize”.
You have the reason Nathali, we sometimes discriminate not only the skin, but in other ways like you said, also the opinions, the abilities of the persons, but not all the people think the same, other realize well what they do, and discriminate consciously

Is there discrimination against a particular group in our society? Which one? How?

What I like about this story that the main characters, the Finches, know that this is bad, and they try to change the opinion of their town.
I agree with you Rebbeca, the novel shows that not everybody think and act the same, and the Finches are good examples for us, Atticus is realize about the situation, he is exposed for many criticizes but he continue doing good actions

Racism... It is showed by many ways in this novel, first of all in the social discrimination, they have a level for each kind of people but the racism is so big that the black people don't have a place in the society even. I feel sorry for those who had to live that century but I wonder if it has become better or not nowadays.

Somehow what Lula did in the Church was a bit contradictory because in fact, she was at a Church and supposedly God doesn't promote the racism, so she was committing a sin. Another thing, as a member of the Church she should invite and open the church's doors to anyone who wants to come in; does this demonstrate that is very difficult to take out of ourselves our bad feelings even going to the church often? I'm just wondering. Then it means the racism is contagious, the black people were extremely discriminated and it carried a strong discrimination from the black fellow to two innocent children who didn't have the fault of the day-to-day racism in the town. Didn't Lula think that if the children knew their reality they could talk about it in school or somewhere in the attempt of changing the mind of the others children, telling them the way in which they live and survive? Well, the hearts fill of hatefulness don't allow thinking about positive ideas...

Dolphus Raymond is an interesting man, his ideology surprised me. But it doesn't have much sense for me, why do we have to reject our lifestyle just to please the community in their thoughts? I mean, we must be as we do believe we should, following our ideals not just creating a facet to make the community feel they're right with their prejudices; is it a way to discriminate ourselves? The racism is always there, made by people to hurt people, it's other of humans indirect weapons. Or maybe, it's Mr. Raymond has Maycomb's mentality too and what he does is a way of showing how much he hates himself for having broken his fellows ways; I mean, he felt in love with a black woman -maybe not on purpose- it is something that just happens inevitably; then after the events of his life he perhaps thought he had already lost his place among Maycomb citizens and just began to act as they like to see him.

Oh, the Ewells, they're the special ones in the story, I think there are many Ewells in our society, astute and opportunistic people who don't lose any change to get what they want immorally, without working for it or taking what isn't theirs (e.g. the carperos, deputies and senators). What is the most practical way of stopping them? Killing them as quick as they born? That's horrible, I really don't know.
Even being the thrash of society the Ewells received too much privileges, now I don't think it is just for feeding their children it is only an issue of racism; for them it doesn't matter how much the black ones work to get food for surviving, the ones who deserve to be fed are the thrash, because the thrash has a nice skin color, that's the unfairest thing I've ever heard. The worst is that with this book we only begin to know one town of that huge country, what about the other sites?

Tom Robinson trial is the best sample of Maycomb mentality concerning to Racism (I wonder why the black character who has to suffer is called Tom, LOL). But this was the most ridiculous thing of all because they rejected the whole human codes of justice and behavior just because of the skin color and the real guilt didn't receive what he should. So the integrity was under the skin pigments and until now we show that the integrity is under even other less important things like the sexuality or religion. I'd like to say it is changing for better but I'm not sure.
There's a long way to cross till we get in the completely acceptation...

Racism... Something that we can still look in the society. All this time we've been reading the book, there was a lot of racism present. Like in economic, the "level" in the society and racism with black people and maybe also with whites, in the case of Lula. But I don't really think that the racism she shows is as strong as the white people's, because it's a way to deal with society, I think.
Dolphus Raymond is very criticized because of the choices he made for his life, because he spends his time with black people, he's "married" to a black woman and have mixed children, he's such a bad person for them. He doesn't really like it (who would?) so he like "stays" with that bad reputation, so people would think that his behavior is bacause of the alcohol.
The racism in Maycomb is not going to change quickly, because of the mentality they have. They prefer, for example the Ewells instead of Tom's family. The Ewells are lazy, don't usually or almost never work, but Tom's family work, they have a good life, they do everything good but what's the mistake in them? Their skin color.
People just judged Tom because of his color, and not of his personality.

Rebecca wrote: "Well, nowadays there still exists a lot of racism around the world, but in that time (the 30's) the problem was that the racist people seemed like they didn't even suspect that they were wrong, the..."

"The white trash is a very good example of this prejudice.
Maybe this has something to do about the association often people give (this coming from childhood) to appearance: black is a ugly color, so the blacks are ugly, if they're ugly, they're bad, then blacks are bad." This is so true, I mean, people just judge them because of their skin, but they don't look inside, they heart, that they're just the same, we are all the same, it doesn't matter what.
Because of some white people like want to show off, they underestimate them.

Raquelgonzález wrote: "the members have a strong reaction, when they saw the white children... because they received discrimination, in addition they try to return that..."

Yes, I agree with it. We unconsciously return what we received, because we like to make feel the others as we felt before, and we do it without knowing, how many times did we already do it? It's hard to change because it's harder to realize when we're doing it. Practicing is the only solution that I could find, practice what? Thinking and analyzing before acting and speaking.

Rosana wrote: "...I always hear “ the justice is for the rich people,” that made me feel bad because all people have the same right..."

Actually, that is true. But the word 'rich' should mean: people with rich spiritual strength, rich morality, rich integrity, rich dignity, rich philosophy, rich principles... Not a lot of money to waste. Yes, all of us have the same rights but not all of us do our obligations equally. Does a person who doesn't do his/her obligations deserve to receive the same rights than the hard-working person?
Everything isn't fair because we don't make it to be so. The problem isn't in the system, the problem is the people who choose the easiest way, jumping over their obligations avoiding them...

In these chapters We read many ways that the people are racist..
One of them is How in Maycomb The back people are like slaves but they don't have any master, but they are treated with the same character by the bad white people. Also exist white people who doesn't care about the skin as Dolphus Raymond. He is a white man who had a black wife and also He always lives with the black people.. Maybe he is drunk but He knows very well that He wants and He doesn't forget that he is white... just he doesn't care because he has another mentality.. He believes that the black people must to have a reason to continue their lives. I think He is rigth because He want to be equal all the time and maybe He thinks if he act as them, He could be like them.
Lula is the black woman who don't like white people in the church and maybe in the world,too. I think this woman show us how the bad black people think about white people. I mean.. Always the racism is about white people hate black people, but this isn't the case, here the black people try to be separate of the white people. I think this is because she has a mentality where the black people are lower than the white ones.
The Ewells are the ‘white trash’ they are white but they don't care much about education and good-looking. So .. I think they don't care about others people and less if these people are inferior. We can see how The Ewells try to carry Tom to the jail. I think the Ewells just want to be considerate by the others white people then, they started to invent stories about crimes of black people and the people of Maycomb who are in a little town where one of the most important man is Mr. Finch because He is a lawyer.. He is smart and also He has a good heart to defend black people with everything possible, for me he didn't show any racism, yet but I think he has honor and doesn't believe that one people can be inferior of other people. But even if this man defend a black people, The Maycomb people don't change their thinking about the equality. They believe that Mr Finch are doing is a mistake. Even if this man is good they think he is in the bad way or crazy. I don't think so.

The teacher asked : "Is there discrimination against a particular group in our society? Which one? How?"

I think in this country there are a lot of discrimination as the urban tribes. Between them there are discrimination, disrespect and also a mentality of superiority. And how is this? They have their group and when they meeting, they began to say bad thing about others people and others group of people.
The good thing is that We don't listen very much about them, or about their fights because they aren't many people and also they aren't violent people.. just discriminate and excluding them of their gruop of friends.

Rosana wrote: "we sometimes discriminate not only the skin, but in other ways like you said, also the opinions, the abilities of the persons, but not all the people think the same, other realize well what they do, and discriminate consciously"

I agree with your opinion, You said other people can think different and can say thing that hurt someone only using words very strong and this occurs with people who don't have the perfect physical and because of this other people feel supiriority.