J.R.R. Tolkien discussion

The poll winner for our April-June 2013 Group Read is

The Legend of Sigurd & Gudrún

There was a close runner-up in:
Roverandom
so I've scheduled that, too, as an alternative (or additional!) read for those who would prefer something a bit lighter.

I will set up discussion folders for the Group Reads nearer the start time.

Great choice, both of them. I haven't read either yet but I'm going to try and read both. I'll be in Vietnam when the challenge starts so I'll try my hardest to get hold of a copy!

Super! I own both those books and will look forward to re-reading them with the group.

Think I'll join in as well. Not read Sigurd yet and I think I have Roverandom as a part of Perilous Realms.

Cool! I haven't read Roverandom so I will definitely read that, and I'll reread Sigurd and Gudrun if I have time.

I've been looking forward to these. I've put the audiobook I was listening to on hold for Roverandom, which I'll start in the next few days. I probably won't get to The Legend of Sigurd & Gudrún for another week or so.

I've been making my way through this. I've been wondering if I should have just skipped the introduction sections and got straight to the poems. There's a foreword, an introduction by Christopher Tolkien, then another introduction that's a lecture by J.R.R. Tolkien, then many introductory notes. I think he should have combined the foreword and his introduction and left the J.R.R. Tolkien's lecture and notes as the introduction instead (although it might have been better as appendices).

In my version, you don't get to the first Lay until page 57 (of 377), so that means that there's 56 pages of introductory material. Thankfully, I'm almost to the first Lay. Don't get me wrong, I think the material is interesting, but I don't know how useful it is until one has read the Lays.

Tim wrote: "I've been making my way through this. I've been wondering if I should have just skipped the introduction sections and got straight to the poems. There's a foreword, an introduction by Christopher T..."

Tim, if you've read the material before then go ahead and skip the introductions. I have read the lays many times from other sources and found Tolkien's set up interesting but not necessary to reading and understanding. DO keep a marker for the afternotes though as they may help in understanding his interpretations.

Thanks. I haven't read the material before, but I'm nearly done the introductions anyway (I only have a half dozen pages before the first Lay). Thanks for the note about keeping a marker, I'm sure it will come in handy.

While the intro may not be necessary, it does seem to be essential in understanding what Tolkien is attempting to do in his retelling of Volsunga Saga. Particularly the explanation he gives in his letter to W.H. Auden: he desired to learn Norse alliterative poetry and attempted to unify the lays concerning Sigurd.

But Tolkien’s desire to retell the story of Sigurd stems also from the mystery surrounding The Codex Regius--one of the most important manuscripts of Northern literature. This manuscript contains a version of the story of Sigurd and Gudrun--however, eight pages of it seems to have gone missing. Leaving, for Tolkien, a gap to be filled. This gap had a major creative appeal to Tolkien, as Tom Shippey remarks,

“One . . . attraction which Icelandic literature had for Tolkien was the fact that so much of it is lost. All his life, Tolkien enjoyed filling gaps in what survives. There is, for instance, a well-known gap in the Codex Regius manuscript of the Poetic Edda, where some eight pages of the Sigurðr cycle are missing. But Tolkien wrote two poems to fill this gap, in Old Norse, in the appropriate meter . . .” (Tolkien and Iceland: The Philology of Envy pg.2)

This gap, or “The Great Lacuna” (as it is called), is important in understanding Tolkien’s creative liberties in The Legend of Sigurd and Gudrun. By viewing the story of Sigurd and Gudrun as incomplete, Tolkien is able to exercise his chief modes of creativity: retelling and expansion.

This comes to light in Tolkien's striking appropriation of Sigurd as a Christ-like figure (if you will)--this is not found in the manuscripts and im not sure what to make of it. Sigurd takes the place of Thor and actually rescues and redeems the gods. Tolkien may be asking the same question he asked in “The Monsters and the Critics”: “shall we or shall we not consign the heathen ancestors to perdition?”

Tolkien also takes liberties with Odin--placing emphasis on his role within the story and giving us more of the robust Odin we love from Norse myth (Christopher actually argues in the opposite direction in the first few pages of his first commentary on the lays. Claiming his father has misrepresented Odin. Christopher seems to have a shallow understanding of Odin. InMy(humble and limited)Opinion.)

Christopher's introduction is very convoluted and a bit difficult. I would also question his reliability as a source of medieval information and its influence in the commentary he provides after the lays (though his commentary is riddled with helpful insights into his Father's work--Christopher is, of course, absolutely unparalleled).

JRR Tolkien gets the Norse meter right in TLOS&G and his poetry is staggering in it's beauty. You may also note his limited use of non-germanic words throughout the book.