Pulp Fiction discussion

This months poll is a slight change on our standard rotating noir/neo-noir/hardboiled categories. You've probably noticed already that the theme is noir western and includes selections from the past 50 years or so.

Our goodly group creator, Michael of Knowledge Lost fame, has proposed a similar change for some of the future reads. I am assuming it is not just genre mashups he's after but other ideas such as WOMEN IN TROUBLE or CRAZED KID WITH GUN or even something simple such as DAUGHTER KIDNAPPED BY ARABS AND FATHER IS GOING TO KILL EVERYONE WITHOUT STOPPING FOR FOOD OR SLEEP FOR WEEKS AT A TIME.

For it to work we need some brainstorming between members because frankly it's 6am here and I can't even begin to think up an imaginative response for it.

So go wild, make suggestions.

Wrongly accused

If youve got any suggestions to go with it that would be even better but not essential yet.

As a group that originated in Australia i suggest Aussie noir and put forward wake in fright as the first title

I wouldn't mind some Wartime (or even alt history) noir, stuff like March Violets would work well with it

Good choice. Perhaps that Selfs punishment by schlink could be in that poll.

Alternate history examples?

The obvious answer would be The Yiddish Policemen's Union but we've done that so A Philosophical Investigation (since it's 2013 now) or Fatherland

fantasy noir?
I've read Steven Brust (Vlad Taltos), Glen Cook (Garrett P.I), Michael Scott (Thraxas), all about private investigators in an alternate world with magics. there are probably others.

Have a chick lit category for a giggle one month - see who can tough it out and see who cracks first and pours bleach in their eyes.

Female pi month Col? That could work. Paretsky has one, any others that aren't cosy?

We should do a female author month as well, there are so many good ones; Dorothy B. Hughes, Leigh Redhead, Patricia Highsmith & Megan Abbott

Ahhh there you go, Leigh Redhead has a strong female PI right? And Christa Faust too. Claire Dewiit is Sara Gran's PI I think.

Margaret Millar was a better noir writer than her husband Ross MacDonald in my opinion, she'd sit snugly alongside Abbott, Highsmith and Hughes in that writer category.

There was that time I suggested an all Mc/MacDonald month. John, Jim, Ross and I feel like there's another one.

Mormon detectives who are lousy drivers?

Melki wrote: "Mormon detectives who are lousy drivers?"

yeah but only if they are left handed and have an aunty in the Bulgarian navy

I just realised theres no jim MacDonald is there? Gregory MacDonald on the other hand

Are you suggesting we're getting too specific?

Tfitoby wrote: "Are you suggesting we're getting too specific?"

Me? I'm having a bit of banter,

I'll take on board the general consensus,

As long as you and M. can come up with books to meet the criteria, why not go for it?

Oh it was very funny Col. Banter is always welcome. Just wanted to clarify if it was a vote against the suggestion.

Ha! Brilliant Melki. Why is it always me? :p

Tfitoby wrote: "Oh it was very funny Col. Banter is always welcome. Just wanted to clarify if it was a vote against the suggestion."

That's ok then - I don't always appreciate that other people may not share my humour, I have been known to offend on the odd occasion

don't think I've read any Mormon or perhaps even Amish crime fiction - might be a bit dull though investigating who painted the buggy bright orange

Study in scarlet is mormon fiction isnt it?

ok - being serious for a minute,
depression era - Caldwell, Faulkner, Steinbeck, McCoy
location - Irish - Bruen, McKinty, Neville, plus 1

Well done on the serious front. I know Horses bu McCoy has been called noir at some point but would you classify any works from the others as noir? I always forget the Faulkner novel id be most interested in reading, that would probably be the noirest of the lot knowing me.

If we do irish we could also do scottish, black and guthrie spring to mind

How about some LGBT hard-boiled/noir? also I would love to read some more Southern Gothic/noir novels, we did The Devil All the Time which I thought was fantastic.

Southern gothic noir would be a tough poll i think. Could probably name 4 authors without trying. Lot of good stuff right now.

Hard case crime poll? Hard case crime originals poll? Police procedural poll?

Brit grit

Tfitoby wrote: "Well done on the serious front. I know Horses bu McCoy has been called noir at some point but would you classify any works from the others as noir? I always forget the Faulkner novel id be most int..."

Hmmmm....maybe yes, maybe no - Guthrie pulled together a list of his 200 best noirs a few years ago, Caldwell figured as did Faulkner - Sanctuary. Probably Steinbeck isn't noir, but I don't reckon all of his stuff ended happily, which may be my simplistic definition of noir,

Geographical theme - I'm liking

Perhaps extending the poll to 6 for these one off polls might be a good idea too.

Maybe i'll remember sanctuary this time

Col wrote: "don't think I've read any Mormon or perhaps even Amish crime fiction"

There was some exciting real-life Amish crime not long ago when a man running amok, attacking men and cutting their beards off.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10...

Melki wrote: "Col wrote: "don't think I've read any Mormon or perhaps even Amish crime fiction"

There was some exciting real-life Amish crime not long ago when a man running amok, attacking men and cutting thei..."

I notice in the report one of the guys was called Mullet - did he have hair to suit? I'm surprised he wasn't the one attacked as a mullet hair-style is listed by the UN as a crime against humanity.

Would Bukowski, Dan Fante, Mark SaFranko, Hubert Selby type stuff qualify as I dunno a Loser/loner/alcy theme?

Michael wrote: "How about some LGBT hard-boiled/noir? also I would love to read some more Southern Gothic/noir novels, we did The Devil All the Time which I thought was fantastic."

LGBT?
Joseph Hansen's David Brandstetter leaps to mind - a superb private detective series.

And then there's George Baxt's lavender private dick, "Pharoah Love".

And what about Truman Capote?
Besides IN COLD BLOOD he wrote some real edgy stuff. From MUSIC FOR CHAMELEONS alone there are at least four hardboiled stories included: "Handcarved Coffins","Mojave", "Mr. Jones", "Dazzle", and maybe even more. All these are also available in A CAPOTE READER.

Southern/Gothic is a rich vein.
Truman rings both bells: LGBT & Southern Gothic as does Tennessee Williams with his short stories ..some originally appearing in the classic pulp magazine WEIRD TALES.

When it comes to Southern/Gothic I immediately think of Daniel Woodrell. He has the market cornered on that genre. I have a tendency to want to file Flannery O'Connor under hardboiled as well as Carson McCullers.

Col (of course) is right on, Josephine with his Hubert Selby.
That guy was a dead-end street poet with a heart full of hopelessness.
Speaking of hopelessness ...Bukowksi isn't tough enough?

And about Steinbeck -hasn't anyone else here read IN DUBIOUS BATTLE? Commie symp organizers vs "The Man"? Happens to be my favorite John Steinbeck book. Love it more than GRAPES.

Southern Gothic—would Pete Dexter fit? His book, THE PAPERBOY, seems to fit in that category, also PARIS TROUT. read THE PAPERBOY—fantastic.

Some current noir would be good.

Tfitoby wrote: "If youve got any suggestions to go with it that would be even better but not essential yet.

As a group that originated in Australia i suggest Aussie noir and put forward wake in fright as the fir..."

you know a million years ago when they used to
have serial readings on ABC radio (during the 70s
and 80s, not the 40s haha) they serialized "Wake
in Fright" and I can still remember the sheer terror
of listening to it every night. Especially the part
when he drunkenly hitched a ride in that truck and
come the dawn....
Even reading it and seeing the movie didn't have the
same impact.

We should have a poll based on books that have been made into classic movies.
In a Lonely Place
Build My Gallows High
The Big Clock
Cape Fear

Interesting idea. Might even be fun to have a follow up to it, read the book then at some later point come back and discuss the movie. How well it captured the essence of the book. I believe there are several Chandler and Hammett books that have multiple movie versions.

Tom wrote: "We should have a poll based on books that have been made into classic movies.
In a Lonely Place
Build My Gallows High
The Big Clock
Cape Fear"

Good idea. The group read In a Lonely Place in March of 2013, but I'm sure we can come up with another title.

Gresham's Nightmare Alley would be a good choice.

Also - The Night of the Hunter, by Davis Grubb
Phantom Lady, by Cornell Woolrich

Sorry -- I can't help myself here. Another title that made for a hell of a strange movie: No Orchids For Miss Blandish, by James Hadley Chase.

I love this idea. Build My Gallows High and Nightmare Alley have been on my TBR list.

I'm tempted to throw in a couple Raymond Chandler Marlowe titles but that would make up a good poll all by itself.

We've also already read The Night of the Hunter and No Orchids For Miss Blandish. Maybe we should do a rerun poll someday for the book we'd most like to reread.

Melki wrote: "We've also already read The Night of the Hunter and No Orchids For Miss Blandish. Maybe we should do a rerun poll someday for the book we'd most like to reread."

The Night of the Hunter, great read. I never had time to read No Orchids for Miss Blandish when it was selected, so I would love if there was a reread.

I've never read The Night of the Hunter, I had actually forgotten the film was based on a book. I'll be adding that one to my list!

Mike wrote: "I've never read The Night of the Hunter, I had actually forgotten the film was based on a book. I'll be adding that one to my list!"

Agreed

Another book I'll be reading after the new year starts: Black Wings Has My Angel by Elliot Chaze. I'm doing a little reading project this year on crime novels that became movies.

Mike wrote: "I've never read The Night of the Hunter, I had actually forgotten the film was based on a book. I'll be adding that one to my list!"

That movie was so creepy!