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Woodrow Wilson
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1. WOODROW WILSON: A BIOGRAPHY~ PROLOGUE and CHAPTER 1 (3 - 32) ~ MARCH 25 - MARCH 31st, No Spoilers, Please
Chapter Overviews and SummariesPrologue: "This Man's Mind and Spirit"
The book opens with a few facts: Woodrow Wilson is the only president buried in D.C. and in a sanctuary of a church, and he is the only president to hold a Ph.D. He also chose to go to war. The country was not directly attacked. The president did not feel it was God's will to enter the war. He was a Presbyterian who did not hold a personal relationship with God as some denominations do. He was confident, idealistic, and learned foreign affairs on the job like many presidents. Wilson never coined the term "self-determination" and was not looking to impose democracy. The peace after WWI was unstable due to the fact that the Allies did not win by a total victory. Shortening the war was Wilson's greatest triumph, but the peace was his biggest failure.
He moved up the political ladder fast and Cooper argues it was his boldness and thinking big that helped him rise to the top. He learned politics through the rough academic world. His academic background was also helpful because he studied power for decades.
Cooper argues he was not perfect. On race, he was not a "obsessed white supremacist" from the South, but delegated the issue to others and he had a deaf ear on the matter. He also had a mixed record on civil liberties with the Espionage Act, the Red Scare, and crackdown on radical unions.
Chapter One: Tommy
Tommy, as he was known, was born at Staunton, Virginia in a Presbyterian manse in December 1856. His family was Scot-Irish and his father, Joseph, was a Presbyterian minister. His wife, Janet Woodrow, had a brother, James, who helped them move to Augusta, Georgia in 1857 for a better job.
Wilson was a child of the South, but did not identify himself so much to it. He knew slaves and successful blacks, but his family never owned slaves. He had early memories of the Civil War, one was seeing the captured Jefferson Davis. Joseph came from Ohio, but supported the Confederacy. Wilson had a difficult time learning. It is unclear if he had a learning disorder, but he did not learn his letters until 9, and read until he was 12. His father took him under his wing, taught him debate, organization skills, and instill in him earthly goals. Wilson developed a early interest in politics.
Wilson studied at Davidson College for a short time, then came back home for a year to focus on getting into Princeton (College of New Jersey). Once there, he was not really challenged, but he got good grades, and read a lot outside of class. He discovered Walter Bagehot, who inspired him to study power. He published an essay looking at the power of Congressional committees and wanted to dig into how government really worked and how to improve it. Wilson also supported Hamiltonian federalism. He wanted to enter political office, but without wealth and connections, it would be difficult to do. So, he turned to studying law, although his passion was writing.
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What are your first impressions of the prologue? Does it confirm or break any stereotypes you have of Wilson?We will explore all these details in later chapters, of course, but I wanted to gauge what you think, generally speaking.
I'm sure this will be addressed in detail later but in the prologue it was mentioned that Wilson was severely disabled in the last 18 months of his presidency. How does this go unnoticed or allowed?
Jim wrote: "I'm sure this will be addressed in detail later but in the prologue it was mentioned that Wilson was severely disabled in the last 18 months of his presidency. How does this go unnoticed or allowed?"I'm sure they will cover this in detail, so you will find your answers near the end of the book. It was one of the worst periods of presidential disability in history.
Did you first learn about this in the prologue?
No, knew before but I wasn't aware of the 18 months. As to your first question about my image/opinion of WW, I'm trying to wait he book out. Maybe I'll adjust , let's see.
Good advice, Jim. I was impressed, I have to say, about Cooper's prologue. I get the sense he is trying to give Wilson a fair shake.
My parents told me about Wilson's disability; one of the reasons I'm joining in is to learn other things about him. The Prologue is starting that very well, as I didn't remember his having a Ph.D., and his overall pre-Presidential experience. I had even less knowledge about his parents and upbringing.
I have a feeling I will be the person who fusses and grumbles throughout the reading of this book. I read a tiny summary of Wilson by H.W. Brands from which I developed a rather negative opinion of Wilson.Bryan encouraged me to read the prologue of this book (which I have done, along with chapter one). Now I can honestly say that through these first two chapters, I find nothing intellectually stimulating about the man. But as the author said on page 11 of my edition, ..."do his sins of omission and commission outweigh the good he did, or do his great words and deeds overshadow his transgressions?" I am looking forward to finding out. (but his personality just grates!)
by
H.W. Brands
Welcome, Virginia. We will all be learning together.Another thing that interests me is decision making. I thought it was interesting he would read a lot, get advice, and decide alone. I didn't know that.
Well, G, I hope you stick with it and keep an open mind.One of the goals for Cooper, I think, is to make him more approachable. I can see why some people said Wilson was cold. His hero was Walter Bagehot and he wrote essays on Congressional committee power. This might bore people. You wonder if less educated, party politicians felt the same way when they met Wilson.
G wrote: ..."do his sins of omission and commission outweigh the good he did,..." I am looking forward to finding out. Me, too.
Bryan wrote: ...he would read a lot, get advice, and decide alone. I didn't know that.
Neither did I.
Looks like a lot of educating will take place from this read.
I can't really say that I have a lot of pre-conceptions about him . . . other than knowing about the League of Nations . . . I really know little about the man. That's the reason I bought the book . . . to learn more. I'm more fascinated by discovering why someone chooses this job . . . what makes presidents run?
Tomerobber wrote: "I can't really say that I have a lot of pre-conceptions about him . . . other than knowing about the League of Nations . . . I really know little about the man. That's the reason I bought the book ..."Me, too, I hope Cooper will give us some insight.
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But it was fitting because he was such a religious man according to the Prologue and the other tidbit that was interesting was that were only two flags in the alcove - one of the US and the orange and black shielded ensign of Princeton University - he was the 13th president of Princeton and 28th president of the United States.
The author made the comment that the church setting is fitting because - Wilson was recognized as a man of faith and the honor guard is fitting because Wilson brought the country through World War I.
Another thing that surprised me was that Wilson had been the only academic president (President of Princeton before) and the only PhD to become President. And the inscriptions on the wall come from his speeches.
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Do you know from what speeches some of the inscriptions are from?
The fact that he was the next to last President to write his own speeches is amazing.
I wonder whether he was too cerebral at times and the average person just did not understand the man.
He seemed to take things literally: the quote - "War is not declared in the name of God - it is a human affair entirely" seems so much how he would think - every word had its own meaning to him alone and together.
Bentley wrote: "I think what surprised me in the Prologue among other things is that Wilson is buried in a church (the Washington Cathedral) and is the only president to be buried in a church. There is also a ce..."I recently finished a book on Geroge Kennan* who some would suggest was one of the foremost foreign relations minds in American history. George remarked that lawyers are a poor choice for diplomatic missions and insisted that historians and humanists where the best. (Better to understand than to dictate terms.)
I wonder how he would evaluate a PhD in political science as president / designer of our foreign policy? I suspect Wilson will want to implement his education versus manage a meaningful outcome.
*
George F. Kennan: An American Life
Because of WW2, I have had a tendency to think of Wilson as a 20th century person, but in fact he had more 19th in his demeanor and way of thinking. 'Tommy' comes across as a very earnest young man and I was impressed with the way his father tried to discipline Wilson's mind. First by taking him to see the sights, then by asking him to write an essay on what he saw, then to give an oral presentation and finally to rewrite the essay based on his verbal presentation. If only all politicians had that rigor of thought.
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G, I was thinking the same thing. Can you imagine teachers in schools asking their students to do the same thing - the parents these days would be up in arms (smile). But I do think it was a wonderful and useful exercise and would help if our politicians had even a bit of that rigor.
Jim, I am not sure that Kennan would have an adverse opinion about an educator - they always ask a lot of questions.
But Bentley . . . the author mentions that he had possibly some kind of learning disorder when young that he seemed to overcome with coaching and input from his father . . . and it seems that learning the meaning of words then being asked to combine them and put them into his own thoughts was part of that challenge. But I liked that quote about war . . .
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Were you questioning his father's approach or did you agree with it? And do you agree that students in general might benefit from that approach or not?
Yes, that quote was interesting.
I totally agree with you about the way our children are educated today. I am constantly amazed and concerned at the number of people I come in contact with that can't communicate effectively and don't know the meaning of simple words.
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We will explore all these details in later chapters, of course, but I wanted to gauge..."
I think the question you ask is a terrific one Bryan - the prologue seems to neither confirm nor break any stereotypes - it seems to me to present another more interpretative view of Wilson which might explain the man. I often wonder how lonely being President must be even when you have all of those folks around you.
And Wilson was already a solitary soul even during his youth. And I have to agree that I think Cooper is "trying to give Wilson a fair shake".
Bentley wrote: "I was actually indicating Tomerobber that this kind of exercise would be good for the US students in our schools today. It certainly would contribute to their taking notice of what they saw, what t..."Actually, I was thinking more along the lines that if it was some kind of disability . . . that the teaching method provided by his father apparently helped him overcome that issue . . .
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On page 10 in the prologue, the author states: his study of politics always revolved around...how does power really work and how, in a democratic system, can power be made to work more efficiently, with more accountability to the people? (If only...)Assuming this as one theme of the book, I will be interested to see how Wilson tried to actualize it. In terms of power, running a major University is not unlike running a country, except on an infinitely smaller scale and obviously without the global component. Lets see how he manages that.
I imagine homeschoolers are doing such activity at home. Woodrow was lucky to have such a father.I have not visited the tomb. I will see if I can dig up the inscriptions.
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Thanks for looking into it.
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He really did have a good record regarding legislative achievements: Child Labor Law, Income Tax, Federal Reserve, Federal Trade Commission, Federal Aide to Farmers, 8 hour work day, Louis Brandeis appointment, war time leader, etc.
I think one forgets the achievements versus the other. There is a lot here to digest.
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Why do you think there was such a difference between what he professed to be versus the external perception? Do you think it was just his formal upbringing and well mannered habits which made him appear to be a cold fish in observed gatherings. Because it does appear that he was ardent and passionate about many things.
I thought the following was an interesting question that Wilson pondered - how does power really work and work best for the people? I think it is a great question but his adherence to the party and party government and delegation could have been part of the price he paid for how some view his legacy. And Cooper could not explain away nor did he try to his credit - Wilson's record on race and civil liberties. Cooper did point out that Wilson was a mirror of what many White Northerners were like at the time - wishing that the whole problem would just go away. Of course it did not.
Very interesting prologue. I thought of the comparisons that were made to Jefferson, Lincoln and FDR. And I wondered if Wilson had died from the stroke and was not able to continue in office would his legacy have been vastly different. I think it might have been.
I was distracted early on a minor statement in the prologue that President Wilson was the only president who is buried in a church. A few years ago I went to Quincy, MA and stopped at the church where President John Adams and President John Quincy Adams are buried. I had an opportunity to email Professor Cooper. Professor Cooper responded to my inquiry very promptly and said that I had been the third person to ask about this and that he has requested the publisher to corrcct the statement to read that President Wilson is the only President to be buried in the santuary of a church. Still working on finishing the reading for this week
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It was good of Professor Cooper to try to change this. I guess that is technically a correction since the Adams are in a crypt in the basement.
I remember this letter which was found in the basement in 2010 - here was the article:
QUINCY, Mass.-- A previously unknown letter penned by the nation's sixth president, John Quincy Adams, has been found in a dusty box in the basement of Quincy City Hall.
The letter, dated Sept. 8, 1826, outlines the burial wishes of Adams' father, John Adams, the nation's second president.
The letter was recently discovered by a city attorney who was combing through some old city records.
John Quincy Adams wrote that his father, who had died two months earlier, and his mother, Abigail Adams, wished to be buried in the First Parish Church, and that a "plain and modest monument" be built in their memory.
John and Abigail Adams are buried in the basement of the church, as are John Quincy Adams and his wife, Louisa Catherine.
Quincy Mayor Thomas Koch plans to have the letter preserved and put on public display.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/04/21/...
Interesting Mike. The paperback version now has it corrected.
I rarely read biographies, but I'd thought I try this one (because of the company). Like many of us, I really don't know much about Wilson, except that he is always regarded as a failure as president. I was surprised to hear about his many lasting domestic accomplishments (income tax!). I think he'll turn out to be a bit like a negative image of Nixon, great in domestic policy, not so great in getting the US involved abroad, and also with some major ethical blind spots.I think maybe he came across as cold because he was compared to Teddy Roosevelt. plus an academic career emphasizes the appearance of reason over emotion.
The first chapter is interesting because I knew nothing about this. I have a young relative who has a learning disorder, not dyslexia. There is a whole spectrum of these things and it is only recently with standardized tests that it is coming out. There are people who say that these aren't necessarily disabilities, they just learn differently than the system expects them to. In the past they would have been dealt with individually, like Wilson.
He does seem to be a rather ordinary young man, especially before he goes to college. (I know, no spoilers!)
Several have noted the fact that Wilson was next to last to write his own speeches. Who was the last?I know FDR wrote at least some of his speeches, or parts of them ("Day of Infamy" was his phrase, not his speechmaker's). I have heard that Obama writes some of his speeches himself. Interesting that Obama, while not a PhD, is a former professor.
Lori wroteI have a young relative who has a learning disorder, not dyslexia. There is a whole spectrum of these things and it is only recently with standardized tests that it is coming out. There are people who say that these aren't necessarily disabilities, they just learn differently than the system expects them to. In the past they would have been dealt with individually, like Wilson.
As a LD person, this is only slightly true. Mostly, these disorders were ignored or punished. People with LDs were often not educated at all. Wilson got lucky with his choice of father :-). He also was lucky to be a child of relative privilege.
Peter wrote: "Lori wroteI have a young relative who has a learning disorder, not dyslexia. There is a whole spectrum of these things and it is only recently with standardized tests that it is coming out. Ther..."
As a teacher for many years, I, too, was interested in reading about Wilson's reading difficulties. His home was a literate culture where he was read to frequently, exposing him to literature, vocabulary and ideas. His father provided meaningful personal experiences for his son, then had him focus his thoughts by describing his experiences orally and in writing. This "Language-Experience Approach" was used by teachers some years ago with young students, especially those having difficulty learning to read by more traditional methods - an approach that Wilson's father seemed to have developed intuitively. I quite agree, Lori, that Wilson was fortunate to be in that home.
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Lori, thank you for joining us on the read and I do not disagree with the allusion that Wilson was a polarizing figure but I just want to point out that many disagree with the assessment that he was a failure as a president. Many feel otherwise aside from his race and civil rights records where he turned a blind eye; yet had to be aware of the decisions at least prior to his stroke while president.
Here are some ratings where the other side of the coin is rated:
http://americanhistory.about.com/od/u...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historic...
The important thing is that with every president there seem to be things that are great and not so great. Some things are overlooked in one president and not in another and the variables go on and on. What is nice about this forum is that we can discuss all of the splendor and the warts about any individual with respect and candor. I am not sure I would compare Wilson with Nixon - they were very different men.
Your analysis that maybe he was considered cold because of his outward displays of reason and analysis versus emotion seem to be right on. That could very well be true about the man especially when he was viewed against others who were bombastic, overly demonstrative like TR and William Jennings Bryan who served as Wilson's Secretary of State for a time or even a personality like FDR who served Wilson as his Assistant Secretary of the Navy.
Lori, since the prologue was an overview - you do not have to be worried about spoilers related to events discussed there. Wilson did learn differently as a young boy and I wonder whether the isolation he experienced at that point in time plus his disability that he overcame with his father's tutelage did not also shape his "outward personality" and may have contributed to his reticence to emote publicly.
I have to agree that he appears to have had a fairly normal childhood. It is surprising sometimes to learn how many great or well known individuals come from a very simple or normal background. Some even like Lincoln came from quite an austere one.
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I know FDR wrote at least some of his speeches, or parts of them ("Day of Infamy" was his phra..."
Some say it was Calvin Coolidge - Peter. FDR relied a lot on Archibald MacLeish, the playwright Robert Sherwood, Judge Samuel I. Rosenman, and Harry Hopkins. Although many agree that he wrote the Day of Infamy speech but I think the classification probably deals with not having speech writers around at all or even involved with the drafts. Wilson I think was one of the last few who actually wrote his alone with his typewriter. I think a lot of presidents read every single word of what is handed to them and have a great deal to do with the final wording including George W and Obama.
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I have a young relative who has a learning disorder, not dyslexia. There is a whole spectrum of these things and it is only recently with standardized tests that it is co..."
Very informative post Donna R about the "Language-Experience Approach".
I too was struck by the idea that Wilson was the only U.S. President with a doctorate. When you think about why a post-graduate university background might, as least on paper, be desirable in an American President, this seems remarkable. Per Lori and Bentley's thread, I'm wondering if the reason the nation doen't nominate or elect academics and scholars for POTUS plays some small role in how Wilson was evaluated historically and is ranked today. I go far enough back to remember how Adlai Stevenson was castigated as an 'egghead' -- as much for his intellectual airs as for his lack of scalp hair (though I believe Stevenson was actually a failed academic). The biography so far seems well-written and I'm looking forward to continued discussion.
Bentley wrote: "Yes, I thought so too - I thought they were both buried at the United First Parish Church, Quincy, Massachusetts. I then started second guessing myself. This is the church.It was good of Profe..."
It makes sense that there is the difference. Some are buried in basements, while Wilson's tomb is in the hall where they have services.
Lori wrote: "I rarely read biographies, but I'd thought I try this one (because of the company). Like many of us, I really don't know much about Wilson, except that he is always regarded as a failure as presid..."Some great points, Lori. Thank you. Wilson is consistently high on the list of greatness due to his leadership through WWI and his domestic agenda. It is impressive, no doubt.
I agree with your assessment; I think for some reason Wilson comes off cold to people. Yeah, maybe it is the academic reasoning. But he is passionate about family and politics. It is just hard to grasp.
Peter wrote: "Several have noted the fact that Wilson was next to last to write his own speeches. Who was the last?I know FDR wrote at least some of his speeches, or parts of them ("Day of Infamy" was his phra..."
Peter, I think it was Calvin Coolidge.
Peter wrote: "Lori wroteI have a young relative who has a learning disorder, not dyslexia. There is a whole spectrum of these things and it is only recently with standardized tests that it is coming out. Ther..."
So right, Peter. If Wilson had another father, I think he would have been punished for being "slow."
DonnaR wrote: "Peter wrote: "Lori wroteI have a young relative who has a learning disorder, not dyslexia. There is a whole spectrum of these things and it is only recently with standardized tests that it is co..."
Thanks so much, Donna. It is good to get a theoretical name to it.
Mod
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenue_...
FrankH wrote: "I too was struck by the idea that Wilson was the only U.S. President with a doctorate. When you think about why a post-graduate university background might, as least on paper, be desirable in an A..."Absolutely, Frank. I tell people that a number of presidents have honorary degrees, but Wilson is still the only one with an earned Ph.D.
I think of good ole Andrew Jackson who made a case against JQ Adams about being educated. I think there are some remnants of that.
This leads me to something interesting about Wilson. He loves practical politics and ideas. Cooper writes, "He was a man of this world, who practiced the art of the possible and went in for practical, down-to-earth ideas." (p. 8)
Does this quote fit a stereotypical academic?
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George F. Kennan: An American Life (other topics)
Woodrow Wilson: The American Presidents Series: The 28th President, 1913-1921 (other topics)
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Authors mentioned in this topic
David McCullough (other topics)H.W. Brands (other topics)
John Milton Cooper Jr. (other topics)
For the week of March 25, 2013 - March 31, 2013, we are reading the Prologue and Chapter One of Woodrow Wilson: A Biography.
The first week's reading assignment is:
WEEK ONE: March 25, 2013 - March 31, 2013 (p 3 - 32)
Prologue: "This Man's Mind and Spirit"and 1. "Tommy"
We will open up a thread for each week's reading. Please make sure to post in the particular thread dedicated to those specific chapters and page numbers to avoid spoilers. We will also open up supplemental threads as we did for other spotlighted books.
This book is being kicked off on March 25th. We look forward to your participation. Amazon, Barnes and Noble, Borders and other noted on line booksellers do have copies of the book and shipment can be expedited. The book can also be obtained easily at your local library, or on your Kindle. This weekly thread will be opened up tomorrow March 25, 2013
There is no rush and we are thrilled to have you join us. It is never too late to get started and/or to post.
Bryan Craig will be moderating this discussion.
Welcome,
~Bentley
TO ALWAYS SEE ALL WEEKS' THREADS SELECT VIEW ALL
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