Victorians! discussion

Which victorian authors do you love? Who do you recommend?

Please feel free to start a new thread about your faves.

Boof wrote: "Which victorian authors do you love? Who do you recommend?

Please feel free to start a new thread about your faves."

Probably

I haven't read any of his yet but I do have Vanity Fayre sitting looking at me from my shelf. What do you like about him Vikz?

I love his characters and humour.

I liked Vanity Fair but haven't read anything else by hime. Vikz, do you have other recommendations? I'd say so far Charles Dickens is probably my overall favorite. For me, his stories stay with me for a long time. His characters are really gargoyles in a way (exaggerated) but that makes them memorable examples of types we've all met.

I think that's what puts me off dickens. His characters always seem over the top and like comic book characters

Vikz wrote: "I think that's what puts me off dickens. His characters always seem over the top and like comic book characters"

But isn't that were the truth often lies? Peanuts. Pogo. Isn't there truth and wisdom in these cartoons?

Vikz wrote: "I think that's what puts me off dickens. His characters always seem over the top and like comic book characters"

I used to think that until I really started reading the books. In their contexts, the characters seem just right to me. It's only the ones who have been overdone in other media that I have to be really careful to see as the really are.

For me, it is Hardy. He wrote a ton of novels, and I definitely do not suggest some of his "lesser works." My father once told me, when I first started working through Hardy, that "when he's bad, he's terrible, but when he's good, he's really, really good." The opening chapter of The Return of the Native really shows why he ended up in poetry. Hardy is better known for Tess of the d'Urbervilles, or maybe even Jude the Obscure, but my favorites are Native, The Mayor of Casterbridge and The Woodlanders.

Everyman wrote: "Vikz wrote: "I think that's what puts me off dickens. His characters always seem over the top and like comic book characters"

But isn't that were the truth often lies? Peanuts. Pogo. Isn't ther..."

Laurele wrote: "Vikz wrote: "I think that's what puts me off dickens. His characters always seem over the top and like comic book characters"

I used to think that until I really started reading the books. In thei..."i

If I was to give dickens another chance. Which book to you suggest I start with.

Vikz wrote: If I was to give dickens another chance. Which book to you suggest I start with.

That's a hard one! Definitely not The Pickwick Papers. I would say David Copperfield, if you can get W.C. Fields out of your mind, and then A Tale of Two Cities.

Laurele wrote: "Vikz wrote: If I was to give dickens another chance. Which book to you suggest I start with.

That's a hard one! Definitely not The Pickwick Papers. I would say David Copperfield, if you can get W...."


Thanks for the recommendation. Thought you dickens fans might like to know that the Birmingham Rep http://www.birmingham-rep.co.uk/event... are doing Christmas Carol this year

The Brontes and Hardy are my favourites, but I have enjoyed many other Victorians. I first read Vanity Fair when I was about 15 - started it on a rainy day while staying at a friend's island cottage (which is what we Canadians call a summer home on a lake). The cottage had been built by her great-grandfather in 1879, and was (and still is) filled with treasures like old books and gramophone records in a very Victorian atmosphere!
I read Vanity Fair again in a university course called Victorian Literature, as well as 17 other books on the reading list, including Middlemarch, Silas Marner, The Mill on the Floss, Bleak House, David Copperfield, Great Expectations, several Hardy's, etc. That was an immense list to get through for a course that was just an interest one for me - not my major - but I loved them! Too bad I can't recall enough details to participate more in discussions.

Vikz wrote: Thought you dickens fans might like to know that the Birmingham Rep http://www.birmingham-rep.co.uk/event/a-... are doing Christmas Carol this year.

O to be in England!

Vikz wrote: "If I was to give dickens another chance. Which book to you suggest I start with."

If you were (sorry, but I'm an ex-English teacher!) to give Dickens another chance, I would love to suggest Bleak House. I think it's his best novel by far, but it's a challenging read. So I tend more often to recommend Great Expectations for its wonderful characters, or Little Dorrit for that lovely young woman.

Dombey and Son is also excellent, I think, and more approachable than the superb Bleak House.

Susanna wrote: "Dombey and Son is also excellent, I think, and more approachable than the superb Bleak House."

And for a briefer beginning, there's Hard Times.

Vikz wrote: "If I was to give dickens another chance. Which book to you suggest I start with."

Lots of folks have said it, but I'll reiterate. First, please, please give Dickens another chance; his novels are just beyond compare, and any superlatives we can write about the novels can hardly do them justice.

I think Dickens' novels reached a higher plane in the second half of his career (the so-called 'Dark Period'). My top-four, most favorite, novels all come from this period; and in the order written, include: "Dombey and Son", "Bleak House", "Little Dorrit", and "Our Mutual Friend".

I made a point over the past eighteen months, or so, to go back and re-read all of his novels in the order written, and with just a few exceptions (i.e., I loved "Nicholas Nickleby", "David Copperfield", and "Martin Chuzzlewit" from his earlier period) I find that I really like his later stuff.

While Dickens' characters can be sometimes considered 'comic' they portray regular people in regular lives with feelings and emotions that we can all relate to; even in today's time. In each of his novels there is always an overarching theme, moral, or social lesson that Dickens is trying to make us aware of; and he always has some of his secondary characters that serve as 'angels'. To me, it seems that these 'angels' solely exist to to promote good and justice, particularly as it affects the novel's main protagonists. It is fun to watch out for and identify them as they come along. A great example, is 'Cap'n Cuttle' in "Dombey and Son", or 'Mark Tapley' and 'Tom Pinch' of "Martin Chuzzlewit".

Anyway, Vikz, give Master Dickens a try, and you'll soon find yourself in the most marvelous world that he's created. Cheers! Chris

I second the suggestion of Bleak House - my favourite novel. I also love Little Dorrit - both of these were marvellously dramatised by the BBC recently if you want to watch the DVD. I also like Our Mutual Friend which I've read three times since I was 17.... maybe a little more complex than Bleak House but great characters and themes. Oh and there's Nicholas Nickleby too.... quite long but easy to read.

I think it depends, Vikz, on what type of book you like. If you don't like Dickens's comedic characters, then I definitely wouldn't recommend any of the earlier novels (pretty much everything from The Pickwick Papers through Martin Chuzzlewit). If you tend to like more serious, dramatic novels, I'd go with either Bleak House or Our Mutual Friend. If you are interested in a tightly plotted novel, with some mix of comedy and seriousness, then definitely David Copperfield or Great Expectations. Since it sounds like the caricature in Dickens originally turned you off, I'd suggest Bleak House (or maybe Hard Times? I'm not sure about that one, since I've never read it).

I have to admit, Vikz, that I was anti-Dickens for quite some time. But, having read Tale of Two Cities and Great Expectations this year, I am finding myself picking up more and more of his books to read when I am at the bookstore. I have Oliver Twist and Bleak House on my shelf, just patiently waiting for me.

As many have said, the characters (to me) make the story and his portrayal of the every day person is quite impressive.

Well, that is my two cents. :)

I almost started Oliver Twist last night but swapped it for P&P instead. I really want to read Oliver but I have heard that it isn't one of his better works - is that true?

Boof wrote: "I almost started Oliver Twist last night but swapped it for P&P instead. I really want to read Oliver but I have heard that it isn't one of his better works - is that true?"

"Oliver Twist" is a good read; but not, IMHO, one his very best (his second novel, as I recall). Like "A Christmas Carol" though, while everyone knows the gist of the tale, it is worth reading, or re-reading, "Oliver Twist" to experience it afresh. Of course, your choice of P&P last night was a good one, for that surely brought smiles and laughter! Cheers! Chris

Boof wrote: "I almost started Oliver Twist last night but swapped it for P&P instead. I really want to read Oliver but I have heard that it isn't one of his better works - is that true?"

I read Oliver Twist every few years just for the pleasure of meeting Mr. Brownlow and his head-eating friend again.

Hard Times might indeed be a good choice - it's good and fairly short.

I have changed the title of this thread to Charles Dickens as there is a really good conversation going on about his books and lots of great recommendations. Separating this conversations means that we can start other threads about other authors.

@Boof: thanks for making a special thread for Dickens!

I am currently reading Old Curiosity Shop. I enjoy it. Dickens succeeded in building the atmosphere.

My fav from Dickens so far is Great Expectations.

The only Dickens I have read is Great Expectations and I just loved his writing style, little bits of humour in here and there. Shall have to read some more soon.

Mandy wrote: "The only Dickens I have read is Great Expectations and I just loved his writing style, little bits of humour in here and there. Shall have to read some more soon."

I just finished Great Expectations, my twelfth Dickens novel this year. Here's something of a general nature that I included in my review:

I've been seeing a recurring theme in several of Dickens' novels--a degrading reliance on hopes of the future to the detriment of the duties and joys of the present. Whether they are waiting for something to turn up (Mr. Micawber), for the settling of a lawsuit (Richard Carstone), for a son to join the family business (Paul Dombey), for the dignities that come with freedom (William Dorrit), or for the unfolding of the plans of a benefactor (Pip), certain key characters are addicted to gambling just as surely as is Little Nell's grandfather.

Ayu wrote: "I am currently reading Old Curiosity Shop. I enjoy it. Dickens succeeded in building the atmosphere."

Speaking of Old Curiosity Shop, if you love the book don't get the recent BBC video of it. They compressed the book so much that many of one's favorite people and scenes have been left out (such as Quilp's boy, the puppet show, the schoolmaster), to the point that it's far more frustrating than enjoyable.

Now, of course, I've probably raised more interest in it among people who didn't even know it existed, but if you decide to see what it is that Everyman finds so offensive, at least you've been warned. [g:]

Everyman wrote: "Ayu wrote: "I am currently reading Old Curiosity Shop. I enjoy it. Dickens succeeded in building the atmosphere."

Speaking of Old Curiosity Shop, if you love the book don't get the recent BBC vide..."

Everyman, I couldn't agree with you more! I thought that the film adaptation of The Old Curiosity Shop was awful; almost a cliff-notes version - Yikes! Especially weird after the masterful job done on the nearly 8-hour Little Dorrit adaptation. Cheers! Chris

Laurele wrote: "I've been seeing a recurring theme in several of Dickens' novels--a degrading reliance on hopes of the future to the detriment of the duties and joys of the present."

This was, of course, the prevailing doctrine of the church, particularly the Protestant church, at the time. Life was lived primarily not for its own benefit but for the benefit of life everlasting. Sorrows on this earth were to be expected; the rewards of life didn't come on earth now, but came eventually in Heaven.

It is the exact opposite of the life principle of the "now" generation, for which delayed gratification is has gone the way of celluloid collars and whalebone corsets.

Everyman wrote: "Ayu wrote: "I am currently reading Old Curiosity Shop. I enjoy it. Dickens succeeded in building the atmosphere."

Speaking of Old Curiosity Shop, if you love the book don't get the recent BBC vide..."

The film version I would recommend is the one with Trevor Peacock as Quilp:
http://www.amazon.com/Old-Curiosity-S...

There are no Dickens films as good as the books, though.

Everyman wrote: This was, of course, the prevailing doctrine of the church, particularly the Protestant church, at the time. Life was lived primarily not for its own benefit but for the benefit of life everlasting. Sorrows on this earth were to be expected; the rewards of life didn't come on earth now, but came eventually in Heaven.

It is the exact opposite of the life principle of the "now" generation, for which delayed gratification is has gone the way of celluloid collars and whalebone corsets.

No, it's not delayed gratification that Dickens is talking about. It's delaying doing any good to those around you now and failing to work now because you expect to be in better circumstances later--more like delayed responsibility, I would say.

Laurele wrote: There are no Dickens films as good as the books, though.

Boy you are so correct! Bleak House and Little Dorrit came close though. Cheers! Chris

Christopher wrote: "Laurele wrote: There are no Dickens films as good as the books, though.

Boy you are so correct! Bleak House and Little Dorrit came close though. Cheers! Chris
"

I agree with you on both of those films.

I'm just getting ready to read Our Mutual Friend for the first time. Does anyone have any ideas for what I should look for?

Laurele - excellent point, and I have to agree with it.

Laurele wrote: "I'm just getting ready to read Our Mutual Friend for the first time. Does anyone have any ideas for what I should look for?"

OMG, you're going to love this book! Dickens' last completed novel, Our Mutual Friend is rich in satire and allegory. It is loaded with truly incredible characters, some heroic, some thoroughly villainous. It is interesting too, that these characters are not as comic as in his earlier novels, but seem even more life-like. The River Thames plays a great role in this novel, as does London itself.

I am a bit more than halfway through my re-read of OMF (it has been years since I last read it), and am loving it more than ever. I can't wait to talk with you about it! Cheers! Chris

Christopher wrote: "Laurele wrote: "I'm just getting ready to read Our Mutual Friend for the first time. Does anyone have any ideas for what I should look for?"

OMG, you're going to love this book! Dickens' last com..."

I listened to the first two and a half chapters while on a bus ride this afternoon. What a great and varied cast of characters already. Gaffer brought to my mind Jerry the resurrection man in A Tale of Two Cities, and his river made me think of the beautiful, sad dissertation about the river in David Copperfield (when they speak with Martha).

Christopher wrote: "Laurele wrote: "I'm just getting ready to read Our Mutual Friend for the first time. Does anyone have any ideas for what I should look for?"

OMG, you're going to love this book! Dickens' last com..."

I also really love Our Mutual Friend! Especially the conflict between Eugene and Bradley. It's really different from Dickens' earlier works, but I love it.

Everyman wrote: "Ayu wrote: "I am currently reading Old Curiosity Shop. I enjoy it. Dickens succeeded in building the atmosphere."

Speaking of Old Curiosity Shop, if you love the book don't get the recent BBC vide..."

Thanks for the advice, but now you make me curious even more! I like the adaptation of BBC's Bleak House and Great Expectations though.

Our Mutual Friend is tied for my favorite along with Bleak House.

I'm re-reading Barnaby Rudge and am surprised how well I'm enjoying it after 20-odd years. It wasn't among my favorite Dickens when I read it the first time.

We named one of our basset hounds "Barnaby Rudge."

We tend to give our pets literary names. The current cat is Belinda from Rape of the Lock (beautiful and vain but incredibly stupid).

Susanna wrote: "We named one of our basset hounds "Barnaby Rudge."

We tend to give our pets literary names. The current cat is Belinda from Rape of the Lock (beautiful and vain but incredibly stupid)."

What a perfect basset name! Our cairn terrier is named after James Boswell, and one of our late cats was named after Charlotte Bronte.

My favorite Dickens novels are:

1. Bleak House
2. David Copperfield
3. Dombey and Son
4. Great Expectations
5. Our Mutual Friend

I have not read all of Dickens's novels or anything, but personally I wouldn't start with A Tale of Two Cities, as I felt (with all respect to those who like it) that it lacks the complexity and feeling of his other work. I would probably recommend starting with Great Expectations, because it's a more manageable length than the others in my top 5 but it's still probably the best of his most famous work (ie better than Two Cities, Oliver Twist, etc). But "better" is obviously relative!

A Tale of Two Cities is easily my least favorite Dickens.

I think I might start somebody on either Great Expectations or Hard Times.

Susanna wrote: "A Tale of Two Cities is easily my least favorite Dickens.

I think I might start somebody on either Great Expectations or Hard Times."

I agree with you and Kristina (just above your comment, Susanna) with your assessment of ATOTC. My only addition to Kristina's list would be Little Dorrit. The latter half of Dickens' oeuvre (i.e., the so-called 'Dark Period') contains, in my humble opinion, his finest creations! Cheers! Chris

Susanna wrote: "A Tale of Two Cities is easily my least favorite Dickens.

I think I might start somebody on either Great Expectations or Hard Times."

ATOTC was my first Dickens and I didn't like it at all. I'm going to read either GE or Bleak House for my next Dickens.

I've been thiking about reading Bleak House or Our Mutual Friend soon. I loved GE, Sandybanks, that's a great one to go for (the humour is fantastic).