Inkshares Community discussion

Hi, I'm trying to not be bitter, but can anyone answer me the following?

You publish your first book with an imprint owned by a major publisher. You make 100,00 sales between e-book and paperback. You write sequel, they agree to publish it. Meanwhile the imprint closes, but the overseeing publisher agrees to publish it still. ( btw sales for both books now nearing 200,000)

You discover that they have spent nothing on promotion, as evidenced by your royalty statement. But I already knew this, as I had none of the promotional stuff my first book did eg newspaper columns, working with a publicist.

You make a fraction of sales compared to your first book.

Can anyone explain why they would not promote it? Is 100,000 sales too small for a big publisher? With as little as 3000 pounds, they could have quadrupled the sales. Why would they not do it?

The publisher will not look at any further work, and told me to get an agent.

So, they own the rights to my 2nd book, didn't promote it, and won't give me the time of day.

What the fuck can I do?

Damn it, they've won, I'm getting really bitter again.

Oh, and they never pushed in the USA, which I cannot understand either. None of it makes sense. What I wrote about is as relevant to the US as the UK.

Simply don't know where to turn.

Can you tell us the name of this publisher, that we might know to avoid it?

You can't avoid as its that big . Plus the other branches in other countries might be ok. But I have also heard that when an person leaves a company this sort of thing is not uncommon

The trick is Michael, that without knowing what company you're talking about we can't give any advice. This forum deals with publishing through Inkshares mainly, so we have experience with this company and it's practices. In the case of Inkshares, they are a hybrid crowdfunding publisher, so if you get 750 preorders on a book they will fully publish that book, including marketing and promotion. It sounds like Inkshares would be a better fit for you, since you have a proven track record of sales.

From what I understand with traditional publishers, some people are saying that they promote only a handful of their top stable of books. Maybe this is what you're encountering. Again, without you telling us what company you're talking about, we won't be able to talk specifics. I do know it's pretty easy to avoid a publisher by not publishing with them -- especially in today's oversaturated publishing market, so we certainly would appreciate the heads up on what company you're talking about.

I'm really sorry you got screwed over. It does seem to be the trend these days; a lot of people are getting burned. It really sucks.

The answer I have for what you can do is: probably not much. You can't force a publisher to market your book. I'm really sorry they own the rights to your second book, and I think a lawyer would be better suited to giving you advice on how to get those rights back.

I've never seen anyone go through this transition before, so I'm just theorizing, but I think if you sold that many books your first time around there might be a lot of people out there who would check out your next book, and you just need to find a way to connect with those people yourself so you can tell them about your new works. Do you have an email list of followers already started? If not, you should start one.

Inkshares isn't going to give you a huge marketing budget, even with heavy publishing (750+ orders), so if that's what you're looking for I think you might be disappointed. They do marketing for heavy-pub books, of course, but it's not going to be at the level that you got with your first trad pub book. No Inkshares book has sold 100,000 copies yet, as far as I know.

What you will get with Inkshares, though, is a built-in connection to your readers and the ability to communicate with them, PLUS freedom to take the initiative and try whatever marketing you want to do. If you can direct your current fans to Inkshares and encourage them to follow you there, I bet you'll be able to build a following and successfully fund a campaign pretty easily.

Then you still need to do the same sort of marketing you'd have to do with a traditional publisher - i.e. most of it - but you'll have the full support of a respecftul and responsive staff.

But the best of all - you get to hang out with a bunch of awesome authors as we all figure this stuff out together!

Cara wrote: "I'm really sorry you got screwed over. It does seem to be the trend these days; a lot of people are getting burned. It really sucks.

The answer I have for what you can do is: probably not much. Yo..."

It just doesn't make sense to me. With 3000 pound spend on promotion for the first book, we got great access to newspaper columns (The Times UK) plus lots of other stuff, even made the front page of the Daily Mail. And we got a great return for it. Logically, if they at least made the effort, they could make at least the same decent return, as I have a base already. There is absolutely no logic to it.
As for inkshares, I am enjoying it, although I'm getting to read some great stuff.
Oh, one problem with my first books is that I wrote under a pseudonym, so I can't tell them about my new work, unless I continue with the pen name. But the PR people I worked with said using my real name would have made their job so much easier, which is why I'm choosing to do that with my future work.

Amanda wrote: "The trick is Michael, that without knowing what company you're talking about we can't give any advice. This forum deals with publishing through Inkshares mainly, so we have experience with this com..."

Let's just say, somewhere in the top 3 biggest in the world.

Oooh, relevant - I just listened to this podcast episode about marketing, and it really sheds light on what has changed over the last decade or so:

http://storywonk.com/the-journeyman-w...

Basically, the number of impressions an ad has to make before a person even remembers seeing a thing, let alone decides to buy it, has jumped massively because of the increase in the number of advertisements we see per day and how our brains have become resistant to marketing. Where it was once 3 impressions, a person now has to see an ad anywhere from 7 to, well, dozens of times before they decide to buy the thing.

That's why a marketing budget that would have done wonders a decade ago won't even generate a blip in 2016. That's why trad publishers aren't even trying with their lower-level authors - the cost is too great these days.

I don't know how long ago your first book was published, Michael, but things are changing so fast that I bet the consolidation of the companies, combined with the increasingly difficult advertising reality, caused your publisher to just give up.

The positive side is that Inkshares is particularly suited to the sort of new marketing landscape, where we need to connect deeply with fewer readers and then depend on them for word of mouth. We can do this! It'll just be slower and go deeper, instead of, er, a marketing quickie. Um. Anyway.

Michael wrote: "Hi, I'm trying to not be bitter, but can anyone answer me the following?

You publish your first book with an imprint owned by a major publisher. You make 100,00 sales between e-book and paperback...."
Ach, I am so sorry! I'm also sorry to say, this is very, very common, even with the Big 5. Maybe worse with them. It's all a numbers game, and anything can throw it off. I have a long sob story I could tell you, which I won't (unless you really want to hear it, in which case get in touch through my website at www.sarahbryant.net), which is why I'm on Inkshares (but about to get off - another long story.) I wouldn't discount Inkshares, it worked well for a friend of mine, but it is a hard slog, esp. if you're in the UK, b/c the sales mechanism is funky and it's in dollars and my UK friend and family have been leery of it. And if you aren't writing SF/fantasy I would also be wary...

My advice? Get that agent. With 100,000 book sales (I never got close to that for a single book but was considered to be doing well in the UK!) you should be able to find one easily, and then they deal with this kind of thing for you. But don't just take any - I've had one so-so agent, one dismal one and now a great one. She is invaluable, and if I'd had her years ago I wouldn't be out in the cold now. If I knew what you wrote I might be able to recommend some, but honestly, you can find them as well as I can. Look in books similar to yours and see if the author mentions their agent. Invest in one of those 'Every Agent in the Known Universe' tomes. I wish you all the luck in the world, and if you decide on Inkshares, just market market MARKET!

BTW, this is me with a connection to my books Sarah Bryant

Sarah wrote: "BTW, this is me with a connection to my books Sarah Bryant"

Actually, I thought it would be easy to get an agent at least with that track record, plus with the 2nd book out generating modest sales with no promotion. But no one is interested, and nearly 30 or 40 rejections. It's like I'm back at square one.