You'll love this one...!! A book club & more discussion

Some of started with the first book in the "Cemetery of Forgotten Books", The Shadow of the Wind as a buddy read, and then continued with The Angel's Game. It will be great to finish the series as a group and read The Prisoner of Heaven.

No date has been set. Does anyone have any thoughts or ideas as to when we should start reading it? I'm eager to start it any time.

Woohoo! I am excited to start anytime!

I think most of us own the book or are waiting for it to arrive in the post so how about we set something up for week commencing 19th May?

I am waiting it for it arrive but it should get to me this week sometime so 19th May is fine with me.

How about we delay till May 25th? Or are you okay with people starting on the 19th and you catching up when the book arrives, Sarah?

Okay just reserved it from the library, so just have to wait *fingers crossed it arrives in time*

Sarah wrote: "Okay just reserved it from the library, so just have to wait *fingers crossed it arrives in time*"

Shall we go ahead then for the 19th? I think our messages may have crossed each other.

May 25th may be better, but only if others are okay with that.

Just put it on hold at the library. It's there so it should be soon. I'd love to join in!

Okay - May 25th it is. That will give Sarah and Ann's books a chance to arrive.

May 25th is good for me.

Happy to wait until 25th although I am away 23rd-26th at a music festival so won't have my book with me so if we go with that date then I won't start until 27th!

I picked the book up at the library today. It's not due back until Jun 2, and I can renew it if I need to. I was surprised to find a copy of a book I want to read actually residing at my library! Usually, I have to order the books I want through interlibrary loan.

I'm back from the music festival early as we had a couple huge rainstorms and our tent gave up the ghost and we'd had enough! So I started reading this - only about 5 pages so far.

That's a shame that the music festival was a bit of a washout Sarah. I am just making a start on this too.

I order my copy on May 11. It usually takes me 3weeks to get a book that is not in french... I am afraid that it will be a post toppler read for me.

I am up to the beginning of Part 2 (page 59).

I am already very intrigued by where this story is going and it is great to see Daniel, Bea, Fermín and other recognisable faces again!

Chapters 3-5(view spoiler)[Another book, another shadowy figure. This one sounds very unsettling. He has clearly been badly hurt in the past and I am curious to find out what his history is with Fermín and why he also goes by the name of Fermín Romero de Torres. Also, I have a feeling that 'The Count of Monte Cristo' is going to feature quite prominently in this story which makes me very happy because I am currently reading it (and loving it) for another buddy read with Sarah and for the chunkster challenge! :) (hide spoiler)]

Chapter 10- (view spoiler)[My blood boiled when Daniel found the letter to Bea from her former fiancé Pablo! What on earth does he think he is doing?! Also, why didn't Bea destroy the letter rather than hiding it in her coat pocket? I think she is trustworthy (at least I hope she is) and that she would never cheat on Daniel but I really hope that this doesn't come between them and put a strain on their marriage. (hide spoiler)]

(view spoiler)[It is sad to observe just how much Fermín seems to have changed since 'The Shadow of the Wind'. He has become something of a shadow of his former self (although there are still glimpses of the Fermin of old). I want the witty, cheeky Fermín back, not this troubled, tormented and bitter person that he seems to have become. Obviously his past is starting to catch-up with him and this is causing him great pain and suffering. Daniel is clearly very worried about him and wants to help so I only hope that Fermín accepts his help. Although I have a feeling that even if he does try and face it alone, Daniel will still get involved. (hide spoiler)]

I will start tonight. I will be away most of the day, then gophering when I get home. I'm so excited to meet up with Daniel and Fermin again!

Just finished a chunkster and am ready to start this one! Will be starting shortly!

I'm not getting very far as I am loving my chunkster read at the moment and finding it hard to put it down in favour of Prisoner. I may have to wait until I have finished the chunkster before I immerse myself fully in Barcelona!

I'm reading Part 2 now.

Part 1: (view spoiler)[I can't believe it about the letter, surely if you have nothing to hide she could have shown in to Daniel or just destroyed it and forgot about it. So I can't help but think something may come between them, eeep. I really hope not =[

When Daneil attended to the baby and then Bea came back to the bedroom she said something along the lines of; 'How little I know you', it's making me wonder whether she is truely happy with him. At the end of the day she did run away from her family and their fortune to live in a little book shop. And I think her ex-fiance is playing off that.

Yes, I understand what you mean about Fermin Lisa, it's sad =[ I'm wondering too who this fellow is, I have a feeling is may be a character from the 2nd book as I've just read Chapter 2 in Part 2 and come across someone =D (hide spoiler)]

I read Part One - A Christmas Story.

I was roaring with laughter at Fermin's proposal to bring customers into the story! I'm sad to see that he resembles a cockroach in a raincoat. I mused on that analogy quite a bit. (view spoiler)[ Cochroaches are hard to kill and Fermin is reputed to come back from the dead (or something like that). A raincoat could be that he's hiding something. It's interesting that at the end of the section, he tells Daniel he can't state his name at the wedding, because Fermin is an assumed name. The stranger has also used that name when he checked into the hotel. Very intriguing. (hide spoiler)]

Re: The letter: (view spoiler)[ I was quite angry that Pablo would try to win Bea back like that. I have a bad feeling about this! (hide spoiler)]

Sarah, I had the same thought as you with regards to (view spoiler)[Bea. She doesn't seem to me to be entirely happy with Daniel. I really hope we are wrong. (hide spoiler)]

I am now at the beginning of Part 3 (page 145).

Chapters 1 & 2- (view spoiler)[Montjuic Prison reminds me so much of the Chateau d'If in 'The Count of Monte Cristo'. It is certainly as foreboding and unforgiving as the Chateau and it sounds like its prisoners suffer just as much. (hide spoiler)]

Chapters 5-7- (view spoiler)[It was interesting to see David Martín was also in Montjuic and to find out what happened to him after 'The Angel's Game'. It appears, beyond reasonable doubt, that he is completely mad (possibly suffering from schizophrenia) and that most of what happened in 'The Angel's Game' was all in his head. Certainly Corelli appears to have been an alter-ego because it is mentioned a couple of times here that David likes eating sugar lumps, which 'Corelli'' always seemed to be doing in TAG. Does this mean that he is a murderer? I think he is (he himself even appears to think he is) but I still don't think he was responsible for all the murders that he was accused of committing.

One thing I am finding slightly strange is that David appears to be in love with Isabella yet there didn't seem to be any hint of that in TAG. Maybe he didn't actually realise he was in love with her but I just thought that he was madly in love with Cristina and that he and Isabella were just friends. Unless I missed something? (hide spoiler)]

Chapter 8- (view spoiler)[So, the mysterious man that came into Sempere & Sons asking after Fermín appears to be his former cellmate Salgado. He reminds me somewhat of Abbe Faria in 'The Count of Monte Cristo' in that he has a lot of money hidden somewhere, a bit like the treasure of Monte Cristo itself. (hide spoiler)]

(view spoiler)[I really cannot stand Govenor Valls! What a horrible person! I hate the way he is bullying David into rewriting his work so that he becomes famous! As Isabella said, he is exploiting and using a mentally ill man for his own gain.

Talking of Isabella, what on earth did Valls do to her in Chapter 18? Did he poison her? I have a nasty feeling that he did and this is what actually killed her. If so, how awful is that going to be for Daniel, to learn that his mother was murdered! (hide spoiler)]

Chapters 19-24- (view spoiler)[I loved how Fermín escaped from Montjuic and how it mirrored Edmond Dantes' escape in TCOMC. Carlos Ruiz Zafón must be a big fan of Alexandre Dumas because he was referenced several times in TAG and now certain aspects of this story seem to be heavily inspired by his work. (hide spoiler)]

I am really enjoying this so far (though maybe not quite as much as the other two) and I am looking forward to seeing where it goes from here.

I'm up to Chapter 8 Part 2 now.

RE Chapters 1-7: (view spoiler)[I had that exact same imagine Lisa, on Montjuic of Chateau d'If, I'm wondering whether that is how Fermin makes his escape, similar to Dantes.

I was shocked to see David Martin in the book so soon, I thought he might be, it's very interesting, I can't help but think that because Isabella was sort of the first person to really love him and now he's all alone in prison and lost Cristina, I think he has sort of a kind of love for her, but maybe not in that way, but perhaps a bit more than a friend.

It does seem to be the case with the schizophrenia, so the man in part 1 is that actuall David Martin OR the governer? Possibly someone intirely new. But I just have a feeling, as there are references whilst in prison to TCOMC and that was the book given to Fermin in the start =D (hide spoiler)]

Enjoying this so far.

I am up to Chapter 8, Part 4 (page 228) now.

Chapters 5-6, Part 3- (view spoiler)[I liked how Fermín was taken in and looked after by Father Valera for that one night. It reminded me a bit of Les Miserables when Jean Valjean stays with the bishop after he is released on parole. Father Valera even tried to give Fermín his silverware as a present just like the bishop did with Valjean (except Fermín hadn't tried to steal it beforehand!) (hide spoiler)]

Chapters 8-12- (view spoiler)[It was horrible hearing about what happened to Isabella and David Martín! It sounds like Isabella suffered terribly before the poison took her life! I thought it was awful how the doctors at the hospital refused to treat her because some other patient falsely accused Sempere of being a Communist! They may have been able to save her if it wasn't for that. The whole thing is really tragic and I still cannot believe that Valls did that to her!

As for poor David, it sounds like losing Isabella finally tipped him over the edge for good. I found it quite upsetting and harrowing to read about what he did to himself in his grief. Valls really is the lowest of the low, hitting him and upsetting him like that! Also, what on earth did Valls do to David after he had him dragged out of his solitary confinement? Did he really have him killed? It sounds like he did, seeing as David was never seen again after that but it looks like something strange happened when they took him to the old house. Who was the other person who was meant to have been in there with them? Does this mean that David is still alive? I hope so. Also, I really like how Fermín kept his promise to David by looking out for Daniel. He is a friend in every sense of the word :) (hide spoiler)]

Chapter 13- (view spoiler)[You could really see how much Isabella meant to Sempere when he broke down and cried in Daniel's arms. It was a very touching moment. There is little wonder as to why Daniel wants to get some sort of revenge on Valls after he wrecked both his and his father's lives. Valls certainly deserves to pay in some capacity for what he has done. (hide spoiler)]

Chapter 3, Part 4- (view spoiler)[So, it looks like Valls is also responsible for tricking Salgado into thinking his 'treasure' was still there waiting for him. I actually felt a bit sorry for him in the end. He may not have been a particularly nice person but he suffered inside Montjuic and it wasn't nice to see him manipulated right up until the end. (hide spoiler)]

Chapter 5- (view spoiler)[I really hope that this plan that Daniel has come up with to help Fermín 'regain' his identity works. I just want Fermín to marry Bernada and have some happiness in his life. He has been through a lot and deserves to have something good happen to him for once. Plus, we might then get the 'old' Fermín back, the one we all seem to be so fond of ;) (hide spoiler)]

Chapter 7- (view spoiler)[I am curious as to what has happened to Valls and why he hasn't been seen in public for the past 2 years. Also, who were the two individuals standing behind him in a photo, both dressed in black? I guess that they played a part in his disappearance and I am looking forward to finding out exactly what. (hide spoiler)]

WOAH!! Lisa your speedy gonzalas again =D

I've completed Chapter 5, Part 2

(view spoiler)[ I'm assuming that "our" Fermin assumed that name before he was imprisoned because the Governor destroyed the forged document from the artist (can't remember his name).

This section really takes me back to The Angel's Game and just how much of David's story was delusion. Wasn't there a part where, shortly after the fire where the 2 publishers died, that David appeared with bandaged arms that he didn't recall injuring? Yet in Prisoner, it explains how he injured his arms. So did the fire happen? Or was that all a delusion while he was sitting in prison?

When I was reading about the corpse wrapped in canvas, I wondered if Fermin will escape in the same way the escape was carried out in Count of Monte Cristo. Maybe that's why he was given that book at the beginning of the story. I suspect the old man is David Martin. We shall see. (hide spoiler)]

Zafon says that you may read the 3 books as standalones and in any order, and that the reader's experience will be different according to what order they're read in. I think that idea is fascinating and very unique. It makes me think that I may have to reread them all some day... and in a different order. It would be interesting to pick up the different nuances that may have been missed when we first read them.

Sarah wrote: "WOAH!! Lisa your speedy gonzalas again =D"

Lol! :D

I am getting kind of a late start on this as I was finishing my other book, but I am starting this tonight!

I have finished. I enjoyed it but it is definitely my least favourite of the three. I have rated it 4 stars.

(view spoiler)[For me personally, this lacked quite a bit of the mystery and suspense of the previous books. I like how it linked 'The Shadow of the Wind' and 'The Angel's Game' together and it was great to see Daniel, Fermín and Co again and also to get a bit more of an insight into David Martín but there was definitely something missing for me and I didn't find myself as immersed in the story as I was with the other two. I think the fact that it was a short book didn't really help because things seemed to happen a bit too quickly. On a positive note, it was beautifully written as always, Valls was a despicable character and the ending sets things up nicely for the next book in the series. (hide spoiler)]

Chapters 8-10, Part 4- (view spoiler)[I was shocked when it transpired that Cascos worked for Mauricio Valls' publishing house and that he had been told to write the letter to Bea (even though he told Daniel that he still loved her). It was interesting too that he has also never seen Valls, despite working for him for a few years. At least Bea had ignored the letter which proves beyond doubt that she does love Daniel and isn't going to cheat on him. (hide spoiler)]

Chapter 11- (view spoiler)[Phew, was I glad that Fermín turned up in Cascos's hotel room and got Daniel out of there! I really thought Daniel was going to kill him or at least injure him a lot more badly than he did. (hide spoiler)]

Chapters 2-3, Part 5- (view spoiler)[I found the scene where Fermín had one final dance with Rociíto on his stag night to be quite touching. They obviously cared about one another very deeply but they were just not right together. Hopefully Rociíto will find some happiness with her new man and Fermín likewise with Bernada.

Talking of the stag night, I couldn't help but chuckle when Sempere got himself really drunk! Poor guy! I bet he had a right hangover the next day! (hide spoiler)]

Chapters 7-9- (view spoiler)[The Cemetery of Forgotten Books made an appearance! Yay! I always smile whenever someone goes there. It is just the stuff of dreams for book lovers. It was great that Daniel finally took Fermín there and that the book he chose to adopt was an episode of David Martin's 'The City of the Damned'. Also, it seems to be being hinted that Isaac is going to retire from the Cemetery and that Fermín will take over. I really hope this turns out to be the case, it would be in very safe hands with him.

Talking of David Martín, it sounds like he is alive after all, thank goodness! I wonder who got him out of Montjuic? My guess would be Bebo, seeing as he seemed to quite like David and he saved the book that David wrote whilst in prison. Also, was David there at the wedding of Fermín and Bernada? I would like to think he was and that it was him who Daniel briefly caught a glimpse of. (hide spoiler)]

The Ending- (view spoiler)[I really liked the cliffhanger-esque ending. It is clearly setting things up for the fourth book in the cycle which Carlos Ruiz Zafón is currently working on. I am assuming too that it will continue on with the plot strands involving Valls and David that were left unresolved here. I am looking forward to seeing where Zafón will go next with this series. (hide spoiler)]

I hope the rest of you enjoy this and I am looking forward to hearing all of your thoughts :)

I've read a few more chapters, still in Part 2. Looking back at my spoiler in msg 27, I see I was wrong about a couple of things.

(view spoiler)[ Daniel was imprisoned after the events of The Angel's Game, so my idea that he was already in prison and all the events in TAG were delusion, is gone. But whatever happened to the child Cristine that Corelli brought to him?

Also, it's clear that the old man at the beginning of the book is not David Martin but Fermin's cellmate... can't think of the name right at the moment. This is one of my downfalls in reading - names of characters don't stick with me. And I'm curled up on the couch, under a quilt, and too snuggled in to go get the book. Some people call that lazy. (hide spoiler)]

Janice, (view spoiler)[I thought that the young Cristina was all in David's head. I think he went on the run or went into hiding after the climax of the TAG but was still getting visions and delusions. (hide spoiler)]

Lisa wrote: "Janice, [spoilers removed]"

LOL! I take things so literal! :)

Just finished Part 2, Chapter 5: (view spoiler)[ So it looks like David Martin is crazy after all? How many of the events in The Angel's Game were in his mind and how many were real? Janice, I agree about the bandaged arms, that rings a bell with me too.

Like all of you, I am also enjoying the similarities to the Count of Monte Cristo. (hide spoiler)]

I finished this earlier tonight on my lunch break from work and I was surprised at how emotional that I was at the ending.

(view spoiler)[ When Fermin had that dance with Rociito, I was so sad for her and I felt that Zafon portrayed that so well.

I especially loved when she spoke with Daniel right before it and he told her that there would always be another train. (p. 251)The feels!

For the first half of the book I agreed with others that have said that it was not as good as the other two. However, the ending was so good and I got so caught up in the characters that I ended up loving it just as much. I do wish that it was longer, it was over way too soon! (hide spoiler)]

I'm somewhere in the middle of Part 4, and confused again. (view spoiler)[ So now Daniel Martin is writing The Angel's Game. It makes sense in a way because in TAG, Martin was being coerced into writing a book for Corelli which mirrors the fact that he's being forced to write for Valls. So if he wrote TAG, then the events were a mix of autobiography and delusion. Once again, I'm back to the injury where his arm was bandaged in prison and the injury he sustained in TAG where his arm was bandaged and he had no idea how it had been injured. Were they the same injury?

While I really enjoy the ride that Zafon has taken us on in the whole series, I take things so literal and this idea of reader deciding what has or hasn't happened drives me crazy. (hide spoiler)]

Janice, my view on (view spoiler)[David Martin's injuries were that they were both different. In prison, it appears that he often tried to self-harm so I think the bandage was because he had hurt himself again and they covered it up. I think his injury in TAG (if indeed he did really hurt himself) was completely separate. That is how I interpreted it anyway. But as you say, it is left up to the reader, at least as far as TAG goes, to decide what happens so we will probably all come to different conclusions. (hide spoiler)]

I've just finished, I agree with AmyCynthia, in that the first half of the book wasn't as good as the others and it took me a little while to get into. But Part 3 onwards I was hooked, and really enjoyed the ending (view spoiler)[ I'm looking forward to finding out what Carlos has in mind for Valls and what truely did happen to David. (hide spoiler)]

(view spoiler)[It does really sound like David lost his mind, especially when he was at the Cemetery of Forgotten Books and said he was being picked up in a Mercedez with the boss, yet when Isaac looked there was nobody outside. So it makes me wonder even more so what was real and what so is his mind in TAG. Interesting though. I did think that when David was taken to the masion near Guell Park that 'the boss' helped him out and that's why he wasn't killed.

I was quite touched at the stag night also when Rociito had a last dance and Fermin kissed her =[ so sad, I hope she'll be happy in her new life.

I'm so glad that Bea didn't go and meant Carlos *phew* but I still wondered why she dressed up so much to do a few errands, it did look suspicious, I thin she's trustworthy it was just worrying. I'm also thinking that Valls may be watching Bea and Daniel, especially if he wanted Carlos to get in contact with Bea *gulps*, why is he trying to get at Daniel I wonder.. (hide spoiler)]

Does anyone know when the 4th and last book of the series is due out? I can't seem to find anything about it.

Sarah, I don't think there is a publication date for the 4th book yet :( Hopefully it won't be too long!

I finished the book last night. While I enjoyed it, I have to say that The Shadow of the Wind was my favourite of the series.

(view spoiler)[So what happened to Valls? I have to wonder if David killed him and assumed his identity. When Daniel was at his mother's grave, and saw the angel figurine and the slip of paper signed by Valls in the handwriting that Daniel knew so well, I immediately thought of the manuscript of TAG that David left for him in the cemetery of forgotten books. It was handwritten by David.

Also, that would explain why David pulled away from the cemetery of forgotten books in a Mercedes.

But it doesn't explain why David as Valls would have had Carlos write the letter to Bea. Just when I think I have it all figured out, I end up with more questions. (hide spoiler)]

Ooh, that is a fascinating theory Janice!

I think I've had Zafon overload. I really can't bring myself to get reading. I read the first 5 pages and that's it. I won't be reading it this side of the toppler - I'll see how I feel towards the end of the month.

I know I've had Zafon overload. We knocked all three of the series in short order. I have a bit of burn out for Sarah Waters too. LOL!

I am just at the beginning of part 4. I have read all of the spoilers up to now.

re: 4th book. Is there supposed to be one? I didn't know that.

re: Zafon overload. I have to agree, Sarah, and I actually have Marina from the Library to read for the September Group read. LOL!