Sci-fi and Heroic Fantasy discussion

My Dad gets Time magazine so discovered this list when he passed it along to me.

https://time.com/collection/100-best-...

They are in order of publishing, not ranking.

How many have you read?

The Arabian Nights
Le Morte d'Arthur: King Arthur and the Legends of the Round Table by Thomas Malory
Alice's Adventures in Wonderland by Lewis Carroll
Through the Looking-Glass and What Alice Found There by Lewis Carroll
Five Children and It by E. Nesbit
Oz: Ozma of Oz by L. Frank Baum
Mary Poppins by P.L. Travers
The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe by C.S. Lewis
The Palm-Wine Drinkard by Amos Tutuola
The Voyage of the Dawn Treader by C.S. Lewis
The Fellowship of the Ring J.R.R. Tolkien
My Life in the Bush of Ghosts by Amos Tutuola
The Two Towers by J.R.R. Tolkien
The Return of the King by J.R.R. Tolkien
A Hero Born by Jin Yong
The Once and Future King by T.H. White
James and the Giant Peach by Roald Dahl
The Phantom Tollbooth by Norton Juster
A Wrinkle in Time by Madeleine L’Engle
The Wandering Unicorn by Manuel Mujica Lainez
Dragonflight by Anne McCaffrey
The Last Unicorn by Peter S. Beagle
A Wizard of Earthsea by Ursula K. Le Guin
The Crystal Cave by Mary Stewart
The Tombs of Atuan by Ursula K. Le Guin
Watership Down by Richard Adams
The Dark Is Rising by Susan Cooper
The Princess Bride by William Goldman
Tuck Everlasting by Natalie Babbitt
A Swiftly Tilting Planet by Madeleine L’Engle
The Bloody Chamber by Angela Carter
The BFG by Roald Dahl
Alanna: The First Adventure by Tamora Pierce
Howl’s Moving Castle by Diana Wynne Jones
Redwall by Brian Jacques
Swordspoint by Ellen Kushner
The Lives of Christopher Chant by Diana Wynne Jones
The Eye of the World by Robert Jordan
Good Omens: The Nice and Accurate Prophecies of Agnes Nutter, Witch by Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman
Haroun and the Sea of Stories by Salman Rushdie
Outlander by Diana Gabaldon
Tigana by Guy Gavriel Kay
The Golden Compass by Philip Pullman
Neverwhere by Neil Gaiman
Ella Enchanted by Gail Carson Levine
The Subtle Knife by Philip Pullman
Brown Girl in the Ring by Nalo Hopkinson
Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban by J.K. Rowling
Spindle's End by Robin McKinley
A Storm of Swords by George R.R. Martin
American Gods by Neil Gaiman
The Wee Free Men by Terry Pratchett
Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince by J.K. Rowling
Mistborn: The Final Empire by Brandon Sanderson
The Name of the Wind by Patrick Rothfuss
City of Glass by Cassandra Clare
Where the Mountain Meets the Moon by Grace Lin
The Hundred Thousand Kingdoms by N.K. Jemisin
Who Fears Death by Nnedi Okorafor
Akata Witch by Nnedi Okorafor
The Night Circus by Erin Morgenstern
The Song of Achilles by Madeline Miller
Angelfall by Susan Ee
A Stranger in Olondria by Sofia Samatar
The Bone Clocks by David Mitchell
The Buried Giant by Kazuo Ishiguro
An Ember in the Ashes by Sabaa Tahir
The Fifth Season by N.K. Jemisin
Get in Trouble by Kelly Link
The Grace of Kings by Ken Liu
Shadowshaper by Daniel José Older
Six of Crows by Leigh Bardugo
The Wrath and the Dawn by Renée Ahdieh
All the Birds in the Sky by Charlie Jane Anders
A Torch Against the Night by Sabaa Tahir
The Wall of Storms by Ken Liu
Beasts Made of Night by Tochi Onyebuchi
The Black Tides of Heaven by Neon Yang
The Changeling by Victor LaValle
Jade City by Fonda Lee
The Stone Sky by N.K. Jemisin
Aru Shah and the End of Time by Roshani Chokshi
Blanca & Roja by Anna-Marie McLemore
Children of Blood and Bone by Tomi Adeyemi
Circe by Madeline Miller
Empire of Sand by Tasha Suri
The Poppy War by R.F. Kuang
Song of Blood & Stone by L. Penelope
Trail of Lightning by Rebecca Roanhorse
Witchmark by C.L. Polk
Black Leopard, Red Wolf by Marlon James
Children of Virtue and Vengeance by Tomi Adeyemi
The Dragon Republic by R.F. Kuang
Gods of Jade and Shadow by Silvia Moreno-Garcia
Pet by Akwaeke Emezi
Queen of the Conquered by Kacen Callender
The Rage of Dragons by Evan Winter
We Hunt the Flame by Hafsah Faizal
Elatsoe by Darcie Little Badger
Woven in Moonlight by Isabel Ibañez

I find it quite biased towards more recent books, seems unlikely that ALL of those will turn out to be timeless classics. Not that I have anything against them, but I usually avoid hardcovers so I don't jump on them when they first come out, and sometimes I wait for a series to be finished before starting it (authors can blame Martin for my now caution...)

Also felt putting more than one book from the series kind of took away from seeing more authors/series on this list, but I guess they really meant specific books and not series as a whole.

I've read 32, with Circe on my to-read list for this year (maybe Song of Achilles too if I decide to buy it, there is an 18 person wait list at the library!) Wonder if that Angelfall would count for this year's theme too...

I own about 17 others that I will get to some day...

*edit*

2023 - I'm up to 36 read now, two of which were Circe and Song of Achilles which I absolutely loved. Of course having a whole year of SF meant I didn't cover much in 2022, and looks this year might be at most two more. No Shannara on this list.

I've only read 20 from this list.

I read 15. Like Andrea, I found the list is full of recent book, some even published last year. Also, a lot of them are Young Adult.

Surprised to find I've read 26 from the list but almost all are older books.

One trend I see is that most of the older books are for children, since fantasy was considered to be for children (aside from the first two that were not labelled "fantasy" at the time). Fortunately now fantasy is acceptable for adults as well! In fact from that list it seems we can thank Tolkien for that.

I find that trend holds true in fantasy movies, older ones were really directed at kids, but more recent Pixar and Dreamworks stuff, they put in references that I'm sure only the adults would get.

A lot of YA is popular with adults too, even my Mom couldn't wait to get her turn to read Harry Potter after I was done with the most recent book :) So I don't mind having them included.

I've read 21. There are a lot on that list that I have never heard of and I agree with Andrea that a lot of the more recent releases may not last as classics. There are some notable omissions from that list - as there are in all lists of this type :)

Interesting! I've read 32, and several of the others are on my TBR or wishlist.

I've read 25, almost none of them from the more recent years. There are a lot of YA books for the more recent years.

In fact there is a link that explains how they picked the list (red text that the top), as well as a little introduction from N.K. Jemisin here that touches on why there were so many children's books on the list

https://time.com/collection/100-best-...

I have read 14, and have several on my TBR list. Several I won't read, and several I started but didn't finish. Thanks for the list, tho! I may bump some up on my to-read pile!

15 for me and mostly the older books. To my shame there are many titles there I am clueless about.

As I'm adding links I'm like...huh, Ozma of Oz made it to the list but not Wizard of Oz?

You know, I previously posted how all the older books were for kids and figured that was because people didn't write much adult fantasy till Lord of the Rings came around (I thought the King of Elfland's Daughter would be for adults but its a kid's tale too, or at least written in a very childlike language). But also...are there any really good kids classics that have come out recently? And I don't mean middle grade or YA for which there are some really great recent stuff.

Talking of kids books, how did Percy Jackson get left off when Aru Shah made it on? Without Percy there wouldn't be an Aru, Riordan's books started the trend of digging into various mythologies and coming up with fun middle grade tales around the old gods, and while yes he's a white male author, his characters span a human range of races, religions, disabilities and everything in between...including Canadians, you'd be surprised but they can sometimes be hard to find :D

Back to kids classics during Christmas I notice we get the Grinch and Rudolph and Peanuts (but not Garfield which makes me sad), but for the recent kids stuff it's mostly spin offs of Shrek or Frozen and stuff, and nothing that really sticks in the way those old ones have. I think modern kids stories try to be too clever, almost half directed towards adults, and you lose those things that made those kid movies/books special.

I've read 32 and DNF'd another. Several I hated and should have DNF'd. Not good books at all! Some excellent fantasy was left off.

As far as having read the actual books myself I think I've read 15 and there are 9-10 others that are on my to-read list. Most others I don't plan to read tbh.

Some of the children's stories are interesting since, for example, my grandmother used to tell me stories like Ali Baba and the Forty Thieves as a young kid but not from a book, and I never actually physically read it or any other Arabian Nights stories. As an aside, jt's odd that the Brothers Grimm fairy tales aren't on there, though, given how much they shaped modern children's movies and literature. Then there's others like Mary Poppins where it's hard to remember whether I just saw the movie as a child or if I also read it.

It was only recently that I had discovered Mary Poppins was even a book :) Which made me start noticing even more movies which were actually based on books I didn't know existed.

I have a Folio Society edition of Arabian Nights, but I have not yet attempted to work my way through the six volumes. But perhaps a verbal retelling from parent/grandparent to child is the more authentic way of doing it anyway :)

It is interesting how we all know all these stories, even if we only learn them through Disney, particularly the Grimm ones. Sure they are a bit sanitized, but unless your goal is to give your kids nightmares, one doesn't need to actually cut off people's toes and have blood seeping out of glass slippers to make a similar point (though sometimes point is lost like in Little Mermaid). But as an adult I actually did go a read the originals :o)

I was disappointed in Mary Poppins. She is not at all such a pleasant person as Julie Andrews. Quite unlikable, in fact, so Disney took a LOT of liberty with that one!

Maybe I'll stick with the Mrs. Pigglewiggle stories my elementary school teacher used to read us, I seem to recall she was pretty nice even as she taught the kids not to be naughty.

Andrea wrote: "Maybe I'll stick with the Mrs. Pigglewiggle stories my elementary school teacher used to read us, I seem to recall she was pretty nice even as she taught the kids not to be naughty."

My kids loved the Mrs. Pigglewiggle stories when they were little. 🙂

I think I have read 36 but I DNF'ed quite a few. Now I DNF much more readily than many. I might be loving a book, put it down, get tired or busy or fatigued and then feel like I would need to start again....

I think with Fantasy there are lots of issues that can impact who or what will be on a list. So there are works that now their attitudes around women or ethnicity or other issues can make them feel jarringly dated....

Then there are stylistic issues - pulpy writing was really common as much fantasy was published in the pulps and we have great works from that....but they might not work with modern audiences not familiar with the cent per word type markets.

It seems a bit of an odd list to me - as others have said "Osma of Oz" and not "Wizard of Oz", 2 books from some series that I wouldnt put 1 from... And so many great books not there:-

Caitlin Kiernan - I would have a short fiction collection and the Drowning Girl
Jeffrey Ford - I would have at least something
If you are going to include Arabian Nights and Morte de Arthur then I would probably include The Worm Ourborous...

I would also include...
China Mieville,
Jeff Vandemeer
The Night Fairy
Watchmen
Gormenghast


There are books that maybe havent aged well but still capture the magic of what fantasy can do like The Chronicles of Amber. ...

But like all lists it maybe highlights a few books that I had maybe meant to try and not got round to it and maybe should give a try, or a few I have not heard of at all and might check out. Feels though like this was a list created quite a bit by people outside the genre.

Late to the thread. I've read 14 with many on my list. There are quite a few older ones that I've read which should be on this list.

I'm creeping up with 2 more this year, to 38. I've checked off The Night Circus and The Wall of Storms, both were indeed good.

Andrea wrote: "My Dad gets Time magazine so discovered this list when he passed it along to me."

Oooh very interesting, will find the time to review soon I hope!

I like this list better than the NPR one, but agree with the problems others point out.

I've read 34. And I am pretty sure the last dozen or so are so recent that it is a publisher's attempt to clear inventory...

Alright, I've read 18 of the books on this list - mostly older books.

It does seem odd to include so many recent books when there hasn't been a chance to show whether or not they will be "timeless."

However, my biggest annoyance with this list is the inclusion of Anne McCaffrey's Dragonflight.

I love the Dragonriders of Pern books, and the author is on my top 5 favorites list, probably the most influential in my writing. However, her dragonrider books are science fiction, or science fantasy in some circles. The series gets misclassified as fantasy because it has "dragon" in the title, and when she started publishing, scifi was a big boy's club in terms of authors.

13.5 + the Princess Bride i watched the movie so many times im counting it . Arabian Nights, Alice and Looking Glass, Ella Enchanted, The Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe, HP , Phantom Tollbooth, Red Wall I think maybe mom just suggested that one, some of these were books on tape as a teen. no Lord of the Rings but i did get the Hobbit , BFG was 5th grade assignment, DNF for the Night Circus.
Is the fifth season worth the read? Tt's been in my TBR a while.

Sylvia wrote: "However, my biggest annoyance with this list is the inclusion of Anne McCaffrey's Dragonflight."

Yep! I've always argued that too, its an alien creature that was dragon-like so humans called them dragons, but they aren't magical. Although the SF isn't exactly hard-SF either, I mean how does something that big and heavy fly and stuff, but there's a little handwaving in most SF.

I usually lean towards, if the author made an attempt to explain their creation using science, even if it doesn't entirely work, then they meant it to be SF. After all, there's a lot of older SF where say they find jungles on Venus, we know *now* that's impossible, but using the science of the time, it was still feasible. Doesn't now make it fantasy, even if we know now that magic would be required ;)

Rachel wrote: "Is the fifth season worth the read? Tt's been in my TBR a while."

I loved the trilogy, but maybe even more for the way it was written than the story itself, its written in second person which is bizarre and yet interesting. Not that the story/plot it bad, it was just such a unique way of writing a book.

I saw the Phantom Tollbooth movie (which is pretty trippy from the 60's or 70's or whatever it was). But every time I stop by the library to borrow it, someone already had it. Someone I just never got around to putting it on reserve :)

So I'm reading (and LOVING) Among Us. There is such an overwhelming bias towards modern fantasy on this list (all nods to the fuzzy lines between SF and F that get inevitably fuzzy no matter how much we want to make them clear). Among Us has me wanting to explore Zelazny (missing from the above I hope because they call him SF?). Suggestions on where to start?

@Dean - perfect one since its October tomorrow - A Night in the Lonesome October - you read one chapter a day for the rest of the month and try to solve the mysteries. Kind of like Clue, you need to figure out the person, and their familiar, and who is on which side of summoning the end of the world. Bonus challenge, figure out who everyone on the cover is :)

We have a group read discussion thread if you wanted to follow along there too. Jim was an "expert" on this book (sadly he passed a while back so we can't dig into his knowledge base anymore)

You'll also want to read his Amber books, there's 10 in total but they are split in two chunks of 5. Nine Princes in Amber is the first one. I've only gotten through the first 5 so far.

I also enjoyed Jack of Shadows (a lesser known one) and Lord of Light (an award winning take on Hindu mythology). I think we did group reads on both of these as well.

Dean wrote: "So I'm reading (and LOVING) Among Us. There is such an overwhelming bias towards modern fantasy on this list (all nods to the fuzzy lines between SF and F that get inevitably fuzzy no matter how mu..."

May I put in a word for This Immortal as well? I've never read a Zelazny I disliked, so you have so much to enjoy.

32 is my best guess, though honestly (I'm 68) I'm not sure about all the books I read when I was really young.