The History Book Club discussion

This is a thread devoted to the discussion of the NAPOLEONIC WARS (people, locations, events, books and other publications, battles, historic sites, maps, research information, urls, etc.) This thread covers the NAPOLEONIC WARS from the end of the French Revolution until 1815. This is a reader recommended thread.

Please feel free to add any and all discussion information related to this topic area in this thread.

Bentley

Hi all, 'Aussie Rick' here, keen to hear from any other readers who enjoy great history books covering the Napoleonic Wars. I really loved James Arnold's last book "Crisis in the Snows". Has anyone else had the pleasure of reading this account of the Eylau Campaign? CRISIS IN THE SNOWS - Russia Confronts Napoleon The Eylau Campaign 1806-1807

I have not read that, but would love some advice on which books are the classic 'first or must reads' on the period.

Last night I found an interesting book about Russia's defeat of Napoleon told in War and Peace by Leo Tolstoy. I don't know if any of you have read War and Peace, but for me, it was sort of a right of passage. But anyway, the new book is called, Russia Against Napoleon: The True Story of the Campaigns of War and Peace by Dominic Lieven. It doesn't get released till April, but by then we will have finished our scheduled readings.


Dominic Lieven

Rick,

Hello and we are glad to have you with us. I personally have not read that account by Arnold. I have placed his author link below for handy reference and will place it on my to read list and on the group's recommended reading list.

James R Arnold

Joe, though historical fiction..Tolstoy writes as if you were reading a glorious non fiction account. I loved War and Peace and consider finishing it a wonderful rite of passage in some ways.

Leo Tolstoy

Just getting my treads worked out..... I originally posted a 'hello' on the Introduction page and then got caught up in a Napoleonic discussion, so I'm posting what I said there to here, being rather more á propos!....

Hi Everybody, nice to be here among history lovers. My main speciality has been Islamic Art history but I have had a lifelong passion for history in general and at various times a very keen interest in military history, the English Civil War, the Severn Year's War and the Peninsular campaign and the war of 1812 of the Napoleonic period. The above campaigns have been a focus rather than an exhaustive list. I agree with Rick (from a post on PLEASE INTRODUCE YOURSELF) about a good glass of wine being at hand. Prince Mikhail Ilarionovich Kutuzov certainly did not let the battlefield put him off fine dining and some serious drinking! Cheers!

One thing strikes me as a parallel to Vietnam as it happens, is that Napoleon gained territory, but did not understand the Russian psychology. They were just content to wear him down (not content maybe and had there been no inter-Russian squabbles.....) and ultimately see him off, whether he occupied the battlefield or not. The other mistake of Napoleon was making his brother King of Poland instead of Prince Józef Antoni Poniatowski, a fact that Napoleon realised later.
The Polish cavalry knew how to keep going in winter!

Bentley, I hope I'm right here this time but since I can't find the other older posts on historical fiction I'll add this one here:
Patrick Rambaud
(French language - terrific fictional account of the last months of the year 1812)
Tolstoy is a master but this one is also damn close to what we believe was real at the time.
Rambaud won Le Grand Prix du roman de l'Academie Francaise, Le Prix Goncourt and the Literary Award 2000 of the Napoleonic Society of America for La BAtaille, the first in the trilogy about the Napoleonic wars.

Which one are you looking for Andre? Did you check the introduction area...I tried to move them to the appropriate locations...they were on the introduction thread but they are ALL still here on the group threads INCLUDING all of the historical fiction. We are happy to have both here..we just make the distinction for folks.

I wish my French was better. It sounds terrific.

Joe wrote: "I have not read that, but would love some advice on which books are the classic 'first or must reads' on the period.

Last night I found an interesting book about Russia's defeat of Napoleon told i..."

Hi Joe, I have a copy of that book (released in the UK) but I recently read a very good book covering Napoleon and Russia by Michael Adams. His book covers the period from the late 1790's to 1815 whereas the newer book you mentioned only really picks up after 1807 and misses Austerlitz, Eylau and Friedland. Adam's book is a wonderful book, very easy to read and is a very fair and balanced account of the period of relationship between France and Russia during the time of Napoleon's reign.
Michael Adams

Dear Bentley, don't worry about me not finding threads and whatever. I'm still so new to this that I just haven't found the time yet to search for all the messages. And even if one or two would have gotten lost I wouldn't mind. But I know you are a genius Group Leader who looks after us/the discussions like nobody else would.
Best wishes

That is OK Andre...just wanted you to know that everything is out there (smile)...nothing is lost.

I try..don't know about the genius title. (lol). I do try to keep things going and moving along.

Everything is placed on the topical thread or if it is Off Topic..it is in the Off Topic Conversation thread.

Rick wrote: "Joe wrote: "I have not read that, but would love some advice on which books are the classic 'first or must reads' on the period.

Last night I found an interesting book about Russia's defeat of N..."

Hey Rick!

Harvey wrote: "Just getting my treads worked out..... I originally posted a 'hello' on the Introduction page and then got caught up in a Napoleonic discussion, so I'm posting what I said there to here, being rath..."

Hi Harvey,

I saw in one of your posts (Introduction) that you mentioned a great book you read on 1812 when you were in Kuwait. I am wondering if it was Adam Zamoyski's book which I though was an excellent read as was his follow on title on the Vienna Congress.

Adam Zamoyski

For a different take on Napoleon's invasion of Russia in 1812 this new book offers a different and fascinating account showing how typhus had a major impact on the campaign.

Stephan Talty

Just back from work and at long last some spare time to enjoy at Goodreads and The History Book Club. I have started trying to collect a good biography or autobiography on every French marshal who served under Napoleon. This is my quest which I am enjoying but my wife isn't! Here are a few that I have purchased and read to date.
John Gallagher [image error] Margaret Scott Chrisawn A.H. Atteridge

Here a few good books on a couple of Napoleon's Generals:
John G. GALLAHER

For a good general overview of all of Napoleon's marshals I would like to recommend these two great books:
David Chandler A.G. Macdonell

'Aussie Rick', for those who may be interested in the 1809 campaign against Austria, American author, John H. Gill, has published a trilogy which so far (2 volumes) has been a pretty good read and a very enjoyable and well researched account.
THUNDER ON THE DANUBE Napoleon's Defeat of the Habsburgs


John Gill

The third volume is due out shortly.
[image error]

Aussie Rick..you are amazing. What a goal...How many French marshals were there?

What great recommendations...thank you.

Bentley wrote: "Aussie Rick..you are amazing. What a goal...How many French marshals were there?

What great recommendations...thank you. "

Hi Bentley, I think there were 26 Marshal's, if I am wrong I hope someone will jump in and correct me. I will need to check my library and see how many more books I need to complete my collection. I am really enjoying your History Book Club although I don't know how you find the time to do all the work?

Rick wrote; Hi Harvey, by chance have you read "The Spanish Ulcer" by David Gates? Maybe we can discuss a few good books over at the Napoleonic War thread that Bentley has kindly added to the History Book Club.
David Gates

No Rick, I have not as yet, Wellington as Military Commander (Classic Military History) by Michael Glover covers a great deal of that particular conflict and is a great read. Your recommendation I will follow up on! Thanks

Dear all,
I once visited a large cellar here in Hamburg, which used to be part of a church back in the days, where the sick French soldiers were treated for whatever epidemic had befallen them. It's a while back but I believe it also was typhus.
I did a little research just now and there is an account on the topic by Dr. Salomon L. Steinheim "Über den Typhus im Jahre 1814 in Altona"
For those of you who can read German there is a link on Google to a pdf from the Aertztekammer Hamburg with a lot of detailed descriptions.
Anyway, as I visited the cellar/church and had the lights put out I found it easy to imagine the horrors the people must have gone through, all stuffed into this one hall with the high ceilings, with practically no light coming in. And then there was the cold...

Rick wrote: "Bentley wrote: "Aussie Rick..you are amazing. What a goal...How many French marshals were there?

What great recommendations...thank you. "

Hi Bentley, I think there were 26 Marshal's, if I ..."

Aussie Rick...It is hard sometimes...thanks for the response. I knew there had to be at least 20...how many more do you need to go?

Harvey..we try to cite and post the book cover and the photo or link to the author when we mention a book. This creates an automatic link for the membership to research either the book or the author.

Is this the book you mentioned?


Michael Glover

André wrote: "Dear all,
I once visited a large cellar here in Hamburg, which used to be part of a church back in the days, where the sick French soldiers were treated for whatever epidemic had befallen them. It..."

Yes, it must have been quite spooky as well as unhealthy for the poor sick soldiers. If you visited the forts at Verdun (different war - WWI), you would get the same feeling. How could men live in these places. Very tough times.

I did not notice that you had added the link. There may be some who can translate German since we do have an international membership.

When I click on the link or want to copy it, the pdf always opens... But here's what I found:
www.aerztekammer-hamburg.de
the pdf file is 1184063297.pdf - I guess this helps.

André wrote: "When I click on the link or want to copy it, the pdf always opens... But here's what I found:
www.aerztekammer-hamburg.de
the pdf file is 1184063297.pdf - I guess this helps."

That is OK, our German speaking members should be able to figure it out. Thank you Andre.

Bentley wrote: "Rick wrote: "Bentley wrote: "Aussie Rick..you are amazing. What a goal...How many French marshals were there?

What great recommendations...thank you. "

Hi Bentley, I think there were 26 Marshal..."

Hi Bentley, I have books covering ten marshals of France, so I have a few more to find yet.

Recollections of Marshal Macdonald by Jacques-Etienne-Joseph-Alexandre Macdonald

by Eugenie De Coucy Oudinot by Sir Dunbar Plunket Barton

Are the above translated or are they in French?

Bentley wrote: "Are the above translated or are they in French?"

My copies are all in English, my wife hates the idea of me trying to learn another language, more books that I can buy!

You have to see her point (smile)...do you keep them in the library and she just closes the door (grin).

André wrote: "Dear all,
I once visited a large cellar here in Hamburg, which used to be part of a church back in the days, where the sick French soldiers were treated for whatever epidemic had befallen them. It..."

Hi Andre,

Just recently a new book was published after a mass grave was found during renovations in Vilnius in Lithuania in 2001. They excavated 2,000 skeletons and identified them as soldiers of Napoleon's Grande Armee who died of Typhus during the 1812 invasion of Russia. The subsequent book by Stephan Talty is a very interesting and different account of Napoleon's invasion of Russia.

by Stephan Talty

Another new book out covering the 1812 Russian campaign is this title from the UK (I have only just received it so its un-read)

by Laurence Spring

This book offers the reader the Russian perspective of Napoleon's invasion and the subequent campaign and battles. One of the classic accounts covering the same subject is:


by Theodore Ayrault Dodge

Thank you Aussi Rick, for all your great book suggestions!

I have noticed whilst reading my current book on the German invasion of Russia in 1941 that a number of German commanders carried copies or referred to General de Caulaincourt's book "The Russian Campaign".
I have a copy of these memoirs in my library but have not gotten around to reading them so maybe I better add the book to me 'to-read' list.
I have read General Count Philip De Segur’s “History of the Expedition to Russia” and found that to be a very good first-hand account.
For those who may be interested in decent first-hand accounts of Napoleon's 1812 campaign in Russia:

by General De Caulaincourt

and

by Philippe-Paul de Ségur

I came across by accident today a copy of this book which looks like it covers a number of different fields and history; "Napoleon's Proconsul in Egypt".

by Ronald T. Ridley
Publishers blurb:
"Bernardino Drovetti was the French consul in Egypt for most of the early 19th century. After an important career in the Napoleonic army, he came to Egypt in 1803 where he was to play a leading role in many fields: diplomacy, politics, archaeology and exploration, amassing no fewer than three collections of antiquities."

What is the groups opinion of "The War of Wars" by Robert Harvey? This covers the struggle between England and France from 1789 to 1815.

Patricrk wrote: "What is the groups opinion of "The War of Wars" by Robert Harvey? This covers the struggle between England and France from 1789 to 1815."

Patrick, please when mentioning any book, please post the book cover and the author's photo and/or link. Goodreads software populates the site that way and the links make it easier for the group members.


Robert Harvey

Patricrk wrote: "What is the groups opinion of "The War of Wars" by Robert Harvey? This covers the struggle between England and France from 1789 to 1815."

Hi Patrick, I have read a few of Robert Harvey's books, his book on Cochrane was pretty good although Donald Thomas's book was even better. However his book "War of Wars" was a bit of a let down for me. It covers all the points you need to know in regards to the Napoleonic Wars but the narrative bogged down a few times for me. Overall its a decent study but if you like a lively narrative you may find that lacking. I would be interested to hear other readers views. I will also see if I can find some alternative titles to suggest first chance I get.

by Robert Harvey

by Donald Serrell Thomas

by Robert Harvey

Patricrk wrote: "What is the groups opinion of "The War of Wars" by Robert Harvey? This covers the struggle between England and France from 1789 to 1815."

Hi Patrick, how did you enjoy "The War of Wars" by Robert Harvey in the end? I'd be interested to hear your final view on the book if you have finished reading it?

by Robert Harvey

Here is a classic old title back in print that may appeal to those who like tales of bravery on the battlefield; "Napoleon’s standard-bearers on the battlefield in victory and defeat from Austerlitz to Waterloo: a record of hard fighting, heroism and adventure".

by Edward Fraser

Here is another classic back in print; "Bonaparte in Egypt" by J. Christopher Herold.


by J. Christopher Herold
Publishers blurb:
"Since it was first published in 1962, Herold’s book has stood the test of time as the classic study of Napoleon’s bid to reach India and find immortality via the conquest of Egypt. Herold covers all aspects of an extraordinary campaign - military, political and cultural. Initially, young General Bonaparte carried all before him - defeating Egypt’s ruling Mameluk caste at the Battle of the Pyramids and occupying the Egyptian capital Cairo. However, he had reckoned without a man whose military genius equalled his own : Nelson. The British Admiral’s destruction of Napoleon’s fleet, anchored in Aboukir Bay, at the Battle of the Nile, left Bonaparte’s army stranded in a hostile continent, and his bold attempt to restore his fortunes by conquering the Holy Land was frustrated by another Englishman - Sir Sidney Smith - at Acre. Despite such reverses, when Napoleon returned to France in 1799 his prestige was such that he was able to take supreme power. The days of his greatest glory still lay ahead of him. Superb, sweeping and scholarly history, this is a book to treasure."

Some believe that Captain W. Siborne's book; "History of the Waterloo Campaign" is still the text to refer to. I have a nice hardback copy but I'm waiting for retirement before I start reading its 584 pages of small text!

by William Siborne

"William Siborne, the author of this fascinating history of Waterloo, was himself a fascinating figure. The son of an officer who had fought at Waterloo, he grew up obsessed by the battle, and set himself the task of constructing an enormous model of the action. To this end, he interviewed scores of survivors and tirelessly toured the battlefield, measuring instruments in hand, and received generous cash support from both Waterloo veterans and a grateful government. But when Siborne - as a matter of strict historical accuracy, for which he was a stickler - insisted on including Blucher’s Prussian army at the turning point of the action, and thus appeared to downgrade Wellington as the architect of victory, he lost the support of the Iron Duke - and of the entire Establishment with its cash. Siborne, a stubborn man, refused to back down and exhibited his famous model - complete with those pesky Prussians! This book is the literary equivalent of his model - an exhaustive and avowedly objective account of the battle and the campaign that led up to it, complete with an appendix giving the Order of Battle."

Following on my quest to obtain a biography or memoir on each French Marshal of the Napoleonic Wars today I received my copy of "Memoirs of the War in Spain, From 1808 to 1814" by Louis-Gabriel Suchet. This is the first volume of a two volume set.

by Louis-Gabriel Suchet
"One of Napoleon Bonaparte's most brilliant subordinates, Suchet had a long military career that began in 1791 and ended in 1815. Of all the marshals sent to hold Spain, only Suchet had success and ruled Catalonia wisely and well with a just administration that brought peace to a ravaged land."

Here is a new book, hot off the press (May 2010):


by Jeremy Black
Publishers blurb:
This is a masterly and concise reinterpretation of one of the seminal events in modern history, by one of the world's foremost military historians. The battle on Sunday 18th June 1815, near Waterloo, Belgium was to be Napoleon's greatest triumph - but it ended in one of the greatest military upsets of all time. Waterloo became a legend overnight and remains one of the most argued-over battles in history. Lord Wellington immortally dubbed it 'the nearest-run thing you ever saw in your life', but the British victory became iconic, a triumph of endurance that ensured a 19th century world in which Britain played the key role; it was also a defining moment for the French, bringing Napoleon I's reign to an end and closing the second Hundred Years' War. Alongside the great drama and powerful characters, Jeremy Black gives readers a fascinating look at where this battle belongs in the larger story of the tectonic power shifts in Europe, and the story of military modernisation. The result is a revelatory view of Waterloo's place in the broader historical arc. Black sets this battle in the context of warfare in the period, and not only that of Napoleonic Europe. He also uses Waterloo to explore the changing nature of war, the rise and fall of Napoleon's empire, and the influence of the French Revolutionary and Napoleonic Wars on the 19th century. Drawing on all the latest scholarship, Jeremy Black brings this thrilling story - and the world in which it is set - vividly to life.

Well I have just started "Russia Against Napoleon" by Dominic Lieven and it will be interesting to see how it stands up against Michael Adam's book "Napoleon and Russia" which I thought was one of the best recent publications covering Napoleon and his conflict with Russia.

by Dominic Lieven

by Michael Adams

I found this account from my current book; “Russia Against Napoleon”, which was taken from the early stage of Napoleon’s invasion of Russia quite amusing:

“The worst actual enemy assault on the column came when the Poles captured two straggling regimental priests, tied their beards together, fed them an emetic, and returned them to Dokhturov’s furious soldiers, for whom Orthodoxy and suspicion of Poles were much of what it meant to be a Russian”

by Dominic Lieven

Another new title just hitting the shelves is Alexander Mikaberidze's account in the Campaign Chronicles series by Pen & Sword titled; "The Battle of the Berezina: Napoleon's Great Escape".

[image error] by Alexander Mikaberidze

Rick, the NY Times does a nice review on the Lieven Russians vs. Napoleon book.
I have no idea how to import the link though...
Best, ANdré

Andre, is this the review you are talking about?

Hubris of a Man Who Thought He Was Napoleon

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/08/boo...

Yep, thanks, Bentley!

Hi guys, thanks for the information and link. I like to print up some reviews and keep them inside the book jacket, many thanks.

You are most welcome (smile)