Tips for Self Promotion, Sales, and Advertising discussion

I have a book on Smashwords (http://www.smashwords.com/books/view/...) and it's a sweet little story that's really almost a fairytale. Recently someone told me that Smashwords isn't a good vendor for me because if you look on their 100 most downloaded titles there are a lot of steamy books there. She acted like she wouldn't want to look at anything on that site because of the number of sex-oriented books. Does that really matter to anyone? Would you not download a book simply because of other titles on the same site that you disapprove of?

John,
If you have any control of the blurb, or of the reviews, try to emphasize that your book is "sweet".

You might do very well. There might be people on Smashwords who'd love to find a clearly marked sweet little story.

WEll, we do live in a country where people have a tendency to get so prudish they seem to forget that sexuality was actually part of their own creation also.

I also find it funny, because last time I checked, sex was fun, and yet you have these legions of people trying to pretend it is something evillll.

Anyway, to answer your question, no, generally it doesn't bother me at all if a site carries titles I do not care for.

It shouldn't matter, but if I saw "a sweet little story that's really almost a fairytale", I wouldn't download it regardless of what site it's on. :)
j

(what's the discount code?)

There's no discount code -- it's free. And I get your point, that everyone has different taste. I was only interested in getting feedback about whether people would care that there are books on Smashwords that are a little, let's say, erotic. Nothing wrong with that, it's just that my book is not in that category. It doesn't matter to me that Amazon sells books in hundreds of categories that don't appeal to me -- that's not going to keep me off the site.

I'd be more worried about being associated with 'books on Smashwords that are a little, let's say, suck!' But, as you point out, Amazon is no relief. :)

I would advise, though, that you put a price on it and supply a code. Free books and .99 books are not viewed with high regard. bedsides, it's depressing to learn that you can't even give it away. :):)
j

I'm going to take issue with that "not viewed with high regard" comment. I have read so many comments like that from writers in the last year, and I disagree. Actually, I wonder who these people are who are not viewing things with high regard. I've had people tell me that I shouldn't price my book for free, and yet I read about a sci-fi writer who's been letting people download his books for free for several years now, and he's had thousands of downloads. He views it as building an audience for his print books, and it's working. Sorry, I don't have his name handy now, but he's been featured in some stories in the media about publishing. There's the woman who said my books won't sell because they're surrounded by erotica on Smashwords. There's the guy who told me I shouldn't give away Amazon gift certificates to people who review my book favorably on Smashwords, because "that will make you look bad" in the publishing industry. My thinking is that this is a brand-new era in book publishing, and all bets are off. I don't think all this talk about what the publishing world will think of an author really matters anymore, because the publishing world is pretty fragmented and chaotic right now.

The era of book publishing is not all that new, really. Just because there are a few new platforms doesn't change the way people do business. That is universal. Paying for reviews is frowned upon in ANY industry. It is the quickest way to kill your reputation and sales.

However, it is up to you to take people's advice or not. If you still think it is a good idea to compensate people for writing a good review for you after all the discussion we had in the other thread, by all means, go for it. It is your book and your career, do with it as you please.

I simply passed on some advice i read the other day, just like the others you've read. None was referring to what the publishing world thinks, but what readers have expressed. Good luck. Hope it works out for you.

Wow, you don't miss a trick, Guido. You must monitor these forums constantly. I'm not going to get into another debate with you about this, but I think generalizations about what's frowned upon and what's a career-killer just don't apply when the rules are changing every day. Besides, as I said before, I hardly think a $5 Amazon gift certificate, given AFTER somebody reviews my book, is a career-killer. I am not going around waving money at people to get them to review my book. If someone happens to review the book, then, AFTER the fact, I may give them a gift certificate. I've only given one so far, so it's not like I'm doing this every day.

John,

Let's hope people don't figure it out and begin abusing it as way to get free Amazon gift cards, hahaha! :)

Good luck, John. Keep us updated. I would really like to know how it works out for you.

I think Smashwords are great, John. I have my books there. Many readers don't want to pay the cost and postage of a print book. A download suits their pockets much better. The big hurdle with Smashwords and with all publishers is to let readers know your book/s are available. Laurel

Great, too, if you live in Asia or Australia. shipping costs are criminal, and take forever. I'm in the Philippines. what you call 'Pony Express',they call 'Federal Express'.
j

John wrote: "I'm going to take issue with that "not viewed with high regard" comment. I have read so many comments like that from writers in the last year, and I disagree. Actually, I wonder who these people ar..."

John, you probably mean Cory Doctorow.

Nevertheless, he could find that his success bites him in the butt. He's setting up an expectation among his readership and others that all books ought to be free. Also, he is probably legally weakening his own copyright.

If there ever came a time that he needed to assert his copyrights, he might have a problem.

John wrote: "Wow, you don't miss a trick, Guido. You must monitor these forums constantly. I'm not going to get into another debate with you about this, but I think generalizations about what's frowned upon and..."

John,
This is not a private forum. Google picks up choice quotes and shares them with all the world in Alerts.

Also, notice the "Add to my Update Feed"? Everyone who has not unchecked that box receives an email of all the day's comments by everyone in a daily Digest.

No special or constant monitoring required. :-)

Never write anything here that you wouldn't want published, because it is published.

Thanks, it is Cory Doctorow. Although there's also a sci-fi author I found on Twitter who's been letting folks download a lot of his stuff for free. With Doctorow, I seem to recall an interview where he said the free downloads hadn't hurt sales of his print books.

I have to agree with Guido, on the coupon issue. Giving a coupon to someone who gave you a favorable review is rewarding a reader for a good review, in the eyes of the professionals. I also do not see a huge change in publishing and instead see new platforms and concepts. The rules are still very much in place and have not changed.

I would wonder how Doctorow knows the details of whether or not free downloads have hurt sales, since he will never know how many of the free downloads would have been traditional book sales, had he not given them away for free. I also agree with Rowena, that he places a burden on the rest of us when customers begin to expect free downloads. Another reason for me to continue my policy of not offering ebooks at all.

The author giving away his book (Sorry, I can't remember his name, either, but I've met him) for free on his website was already a well-established author with a large readership before he started giving away the free copy. His claims that everyone should give away their books don't hold water with me. If I were already making a living with my writing like he is, then maybe I would listen. But for a new author, it doesn't make sense. I do have some free stories up on my website, but they are more like a portfolio, showcasing what I do. I've made several sales of my novel from those stories.

Most people see the free or 99 cent download and shy away. It screams self-published which, for most people, says awful writing. Yours may not be, but most people have been burned too often by books rushed into print without careful editing. Besides, if you as the author don't value your work, why should they?

If yours isn't selling, it's most likely people don't even know who you are or what you've written. Getting your name out there is the hardest part. Convincing people to try your book is the second hardest part.

Either way, good luck.

K.J., I'm assuming that you mean you have a policy of not offering free ebooks, right? I can't believe you have a policy of not offering ebooks at all, not when the Kindle is Amazon's biggest seller, and the iPad is breaking all kinds of sales records for Apple. There are millions of people downloading ebooks every day, and it baffles me why any author would not want to be a part of that. I'd really be interested in hearing your rationale for that.

And Jaleta, I agree that authors need to get their name out in order to sell books -- but that's what free downloads are all about. I've had 200 people download my book in the last few months, and that's 200 people who may not have known who I was last December. I also have free stories on my Website, and that's a way to get name recognition also. I'm still submitting other stories to magazines, and I plan to submit a novel the traditional way at some point.

The bias against free downloads and ebooks that I hear from authors sounds a lot like what music artists and publishers were saying ten years ago when Napster came out and people were downloading songs for free. I can understand the reluctance to give away your hard work, but the challenge is to adapt to this digital age and find new ways to succeed in the marketplace.

I don't have a problem giving coupons and discounts as a way to advertise. My ebook version is priced at $4.99. I regularly run promos and give it out for under $2. I've also given coupons as contest prizes so the winners get it for free. It's all about advertising and public perception. (Yeah, I spent my time doing slave labor for marketing, too.)

If you are having good luck with the free downloads, good for you. I read a post recently (I cannot remember what the title was or where I ran across it though, sorry) where the point was made that if you give your writing away free now but decide to charge more later, people will perceive you as greedy. I'd rather have them think I'm greedy up front. Just kidding. I priced my book at what I felt was a fair and reasonable price.

The point is that everyone is going to do what they feel is best for their work and their career. I was throwing out advice. Take it or leave it, I'm good with what I've chosen to do.

Good luck with your book.

Well put, Jaleta. I was quoting from that same conversation, but like you I didn't save it. I think it was Guido who posted it. It made sense, basic bizzness horse sense. One can always lower the price, but can never raise it. I guess all anyone can do is pass on advice they find of value, and hope it helps. I've found in my short life that any fool can learn from their own mistakes; it's the wise that profit from others'.
j

John wrote: "K.J., I'm assuming that you mean you have a policy of not offering free ebooks, right? I can't believe you have a policy of not offering ebooks at all, not when the Kindle is Amazon's biggest selle..."

Amazon is not terribly generous to authors. I've heard that Amazon takes up to a 65% cut. I have no desire to work for Amazon!

The usual split with an ebook is 40% to the vendor and 60% to the publisher. Even Google is offering 35% under The Settlement.

Some print publishers expect an author to accept as little as 4% on ebooks, ie, the same royalty rate that was negotiated for print books.

Authors Guild advises authors who have not sold their e-rights to wait (unless offered a favorable contract) because e-book contracts for authors are probably at an all time low.

The most famous author to not offer e-books is J K Rowling. Of course, she is widely pirated, but she has done very well and I think her actions have done all authors everywhere a huge favor.

BTW JK Rowling, James Patterson, Stephen King are currently being (allegedly) pirated in another series of EBay auctions offering a four-CD set of 200,000 books for a couple of British pounds.

I'm sitting on my ebook rights!

John: Your assumption is incorrect. I do not and will not offer ebook copies of my work. When riding a train in Europe, I see people holding real books in their hands, and that is a great indicator, to me.

As for Amazon, Rowena has it down. I have no intention of working for them or for Barnes & Noble, either. The one thing that aspiring authors should know, and I learned during my five+ years of researching the marketing channels for my writing, is that no books shipped to Amazon or any other outlet are 'sold.' They are shipped with the right of return for unsold copies, in any condition, at any time, at the publisher's/author's expense. With the discounts that would have to be offered, I would have to increase the cost of my book by 56% to receive half the profit I realize now, which would have a significant impact on sales. And, I would have to be ready to have the tiny margin earned from Amazon chewed up by the return shipping expense, and the unsaleable copies that come back in the returns. During the year that my books would be on the shelves, I would have funded the shipping and the printing costs for the still unsold copies. In other words, I would have bankrolled their operation, with no interest return on the money lent. In my current situation, all books sold through my site are actually sold. I like that much better, and I will only have to sell 40% of my stock to break even, whereas I would have to sell a heckuva lot more through Amazon to make any money at all.

While that may be true in theory, that is not how it works out in practice. Otherwise all companies selling their goods on Amazon would be losing money according to you. I suppose we can agree that that is not the case -- simply because people do not return enough to eat up the margins.

As for bankrolling their operation, that is essentially what you're doing with every retail store.

I am not saying you're wrong, but I think you're looking at Amazon a little too harshly.

I do agree though that their royalty payouts for Kindle books is horrible. I've been working in digital distribution for many years and Amazon is offer the worst payouts on the planet. Typically it would be the other way around - the distributor/Amazon keeps 30% and the publishers receives 70%. Since Amazon pretty much opened up that market by themselves, they defined their own rules but I don't think they will be able to that very much longer. Already there are changes on the horizon as they will change their payout structure come July, I think. It will still be a knee-jerk structure but it's a first step in the right direction.

Aside from that, you can always sell eBooks on your own website, K.J. and that way retain 100% of the sales price. That's why I have created a very strong web presence for my series, to make sure I drive as many sales through that site as I can.

For those who wish to sell their own ebooks and pay only a couple of cents a month rent for the space plus %5 commission on sales, there is http://www.jexbo.com

I have one book there. Nah... it doesn't sell very well, but I don't promote it much. It was more of an experiment to see if there is any truth in what pirates say about how they would buy a book if it cost X, Y or Z.

Another ebook store that pays 60% to the author is http://www.ebookisle.net Contact owner Cy Korte.

@row
sent mess. didn't see anywhere to submit, though. probably right in front of me. 60% is better than most.
j

Guido: I am aware that I can sell ebooks on my own site, but I have no desire to sell ebooks in any venue. I realize that there is money to be made, but I don't wish to sell my material in that manner.

As for the 'bankrolling' part of things, I do understand that one has to do that, to get their books into the retail outlets. The question is, are the margins there, when you do smaller print runs, to warrant splitting out the profits with another entity. For large publishers, it is a numbers game, and their print runs are larger, and their costs lower. I would have to raise the cost of my book 56% to be able to offer it at the necessary discount for Amazon to stock it. Because my price increase will not fully cover the profit loss from Amazon's discount, I will be making less than half of the profit I now realize, which is not huge, but it is viable. If I include a wholesaler in the mix, then I would have to increase the retail price even more. Yes, I can print in larger runs, to offset some of the increase in pricing, but then I run the risk of having a garage full of returns, if they are not sold. The other dilemma is that by raising my retail price, will I be pricing myself out of my market? In that case, I would have to leave my retail price alone, and then only Amazon would be making any profit from my work, after they apply their discounts, and I subtract the costs of printing and shipping.

I do understand that others are doing this, and selling books. I would be very interested to see what their profit/loss statements look like, at the end of each year. After printing expenses, shipping expenses, returns and marketing, did they actually make a meaningful profit with their sales through Amazon? In other words, was it all worth it? Or, did they just sell their books for very little return. I refer, of course, to independent authors such as myself. From a strictly business standpoint: in the sales department, units sold is important, but it is the accounting department that determines whether or not a product is financially viable.

Before I published my first book, I spent some time communicating with an Amazon rep, and we discussed the benefits and drawbacks. My final inclination was to not go with Amazon, for my printed books.

Yeah, the tribulations of retail sales. It is a pain, I agree, no matter how you turn it.

K J
K.J. wrote: "Guido: I am aware that I can sell ebooks on my own site, but I have no desire to sell ebooks in any venue. I realize that there is money to be made, but I don't wish to sell my material in that man..."

I am with you on selling ebooks, I don't care for it, I may be a little old fashioned and out of step with the modern world, but I have a love for the book, book. If anyone gets into this business of writing to make a quick profit, they will find that is few and far between. With humpteen authors and the ease of production along with the greed of the press masters, anyone can write a book, but selling, now that is a whole different story. I have been in business for more years than any of you have been living. (assumed statement) but I do make a profit from writing, a profit which is every other year. From my business experience I have learned how to use the tax system to lump my expenses in one year and take my profits the next. Not only does this give me an opportunity of distributing my expenses better, but it allows me to take the government into my business as a partner to share loses with untold number of tax savings. (Including home office, bank accounts, postage, sharing utilities and on and on.) I also use Amazon which might be contrary to the desire of others, but most of my books are not sold that way. I have my own outlets for selling and my own resources for printing. I have mentioned this before, but each person has to develop their own followers and system and I don't think you can make this thing work with a single idea. I have been writing for over thirty years, my first book is now in the fourth edition (In Search Of Paradise) and if I can privately publish this book for $3 and sell in myself for $15, my profit seems adequate to me.

I had six book out last year and there will be seven this year if things go right. People want books, but they want to read books that fit their needs and it is up to us to figure out what we should be writing. In my estimation, the old days of "sex sells" murder and mayhem don't get the job done anymore. This might work for quck and short time production, but your Treasure Island, Tom Sawyer, and the tales of Marco Polo will be around for a long, long time.
Dr Robert E McGinnis
Always looking for a better world for us all. Some call it Paradise.

Dr. McGinnis: I agree with you on many of your points, including what sells and retains its flavor years later. The classics are classics for a reason, and boys who cannot afford a tv in their bedroom, nor a computer at home, can still dream with Huck Finn, and sail with a parrot and a one-legged rapscallion on the high seas. That is the magic of good literature.

I also agree that it is necessary to treat writing as a business, and look to the bottom line. In the USA, there are very suitable tax options for self-employed persons, and when I resided in the States I employed as many of them as my accountant would allow. In Germany and France, the system is different, and Germany is where I take my booksales income, since they treat it more favorably for writers. Germany also has remarkable postage rates for books, and I can ship my book anywhere in the world for only 6 Euros (Airmail), or 3 Euros for 'standard mail.'

I did find it illuminating that you mentioned that Amazon is not your primary source of income from sales. That is indeed heartening. Although it is a slog to do it on one's own, I find it a challenge and rather interesting to learn more about how to make this system work. I am also in two non-English-speaking countries, for the most part, so making book tours can be very challenging, over here. However, the Frankfurt book fair is coming in a few months, and that is one of the biggest in the world. I will be putting my first book in the fair.

j wrote: "@row
sent mess. didn't see anywhere to submit, though. probably right in front of me. 60% is better than most.
j"

You have to subscribe before you can sell. Try sending an email to jill @ jexbo . com (without the spaces)