Reading the Chunksters discussion

Ok, it's Week 7...how this chunk feel to you?

definitely delightful, it's the first chunkster where i didn't skim parts and actually went back and read some passages that i enjoyed! :D

i enjoy the style, characters and themes.

Did we just see the first mention of the Raven King's real name? John Uskglass! :D (I was wondering who that was on the Table of Contents.) And I guess Stephen is the nameless servant in the prophecy since the fairy said he didn't know his true name.

Speaking of names, in other books I've read that contained fairies, they make a big deal about knowing a fairy's true name, since that apparently give you power over them. A quick google shows that some mythology surrounding fairies says this as well. It's interesting because we still don't know the name of the fairy with thistle-down hair, so I've been wondering if that will be revealed later on, especially now that we know he is some sort of fairy king (or so he claims).

On a last note, how hilarious was that comment from the Duke of Wellington about moving Spain around like a carpet under the feet of his troops so they won't tire themselves out by traveling? I was laughing so hard, I startled my mom in the other room!

If I weren't trying to keep up with BK, and starting AK, I would have continued on into the next week.

Before the war, the fairy with thistle-down hair didn't seem to have much respect for Strange, I wonder if that has changed. Or did he just like the Mad-King and want to help him out there.

I need to go back and find that prophecy that Vinny gave.

I loved this section! I liked the war part, moving the river and so on, and the part with the mad King George. But I was freaked out by the man with the thistle-down hair turning up with Strange at Windsor. I am scared for them all about what he will do.

It's interesting that he thinks Stephen will be king of England... because he says it's the only country Stephen has been to... but he has been to Lost-Hope ;-)

Rosemary wrote: "I loved this section! I liked the war part, moving the river and so on, and the part with the mad King George. But I was freaked out by the man with the thistle-down hair turning up with Strange at..."

that's soooo what i thought from the onset...that fairy is so egotistical (typical fairy) that he can't see the real truth.

Juliette wrote: "If I weren't trying to keep up with BK, and starting AK, I would have continued on into the next week.

Before the war, the fairy with thistle-down hair didn't seem to have much respect for Stran..."

faeries don't like anyone or anything that reminds them of humans. i don't think the the gentleman with the thistle-down hair was helping George he was trying to enchant him so then Stephen the king of England and therefore fulfill his destiny.

Stephanie wrote: "faeries don't like anyone or anything that reminds them of humans. i don't think the the gentleman with the thistle-down hair was helping George he was trying to enchant him so then Stephen the king of England and therefore fulfill his destiny. ..."

I hadn't thought of him trying to help Stephen.

I am confused by the beginning of the sentence though, that faeries don't like anyone or anything that reminds them of humans, but Stephen himself is a human (or is he?). And ThistleHair seems to like Lady Pole and Mrs. Strange just fine, and they are definitely human, or at least Mrs. Strange is, who knows what Lady Pole is now.

Juliette wrote: "Stephanie wrote: "faeries don't like anyone or anything that reminds them of humans. i don't think the the gentleman with the thistle-down hair was helping George he was trying to enchant him so th..."

i think he only likes them because he is amused (not because they are funny, but because he is entertained by their beauty or wit or something)by them. i think that he didn't like lady pole's beauty he wouldn't have resurrected her and if he didn't think that stephen was has beautiful as he feels himself to be he wouldn't have 'rescued' him and the same with mrs. strange, while not pretty like lady pole she is quite attractive and easy to talk to. his help isn't very helpful and he won't stop helping them. i'm not sure that's like at all.

and, i'm calling him ThistleHair from now on! :D

I think the fairy is just really finicky about who he likes, and only when it serves his own interests. He doesn't seem to really care about humans or human affairs at all. I think he only took an interest in the Mad King because he wants Stephen as King of England.

Lol, I have actually been calling him Mr. Thistledown.

I think that this part was a little bit less consistent than the previous one though the book has mainly shifted its attention on Mr. Strange.

What I like about Mr. Strange is that he is a true gentleman. He understands well that he has surpassed Mr. Norrell in his skills, happy to improvise, and is even willing to use dark magic during the war if necessary, but he still demonstrates respect. I also liked that the narrator raised the 'cultural awareness' issue of the resurrected bodies and what to do with them.

I think in chapter 32 we dealt with the first seriously invasive magic - all the other characters (Arabella, Stephen, and Mrs. Pole were invited to the miraculous palace of Lost-Hope). This is the magic obviously produced by the man with the thistle-down hair.

P.S. I really enjoyed Mr. Strange's comments about how you should treat people with mental disorders - he demonstrated more compassion than any doctor or attendant who surrounded the mad king.

I am a Strangeite all the way and appreciate that magic is the first of his many professions that he did well, for a long period of time and honestly. I love that he says that a magician could use magic to kill a person, but a gentleman would never do so. I also like that Strange has a fondness for Norrell, even though he knows how Norrell is towards him and others. I think that it is this aspect of his personality that helps him to understand King George and his madness. Strange is truly a compassionate person who understands and strives to understand those around him...to not only better his magic and himself, but so that others can be better of, as well.

I do not like how Strange treats women, especially Arabella. When he's so progressive in his action and thoughts concerning magic (doesn't mind if women learn magic etc.), he still treats his wife like property, listens to her only when it suits him and most of the time after the fact his not listening has gotten him into trouble, and believes his wife's greatest pleasure is to be entertained. Gah, Strange, gah!

Stephanie wrote: "I am a Strangeite all the way and appreciate that magic is the first of his many professions that he did well, for a long period of time and honestly. I love that he says that a magician could use ..."

Yep, misogynist!

Zulfiya wrote: "Stephanie wrote: "I am a Strangeite all the way and appreciate that magic is the first of his many professions that he did well, for a long period of time and honestly. I love that he says that a m..."

I find this really strange (no pun intended) as he was raised mostly by women (his aunt and two cousins?) and treated fairly and loved by women, when his father, the only male in his life, treated him so poorly.

I really love seeing Mr. Thistledowns character expanded (hooray I finally caught up). I wondered if these sections were written later than some of the others because the descriptions of magic and magic-effected scenery were really expanded and more indepth. In fact, I thought some of them were just kind of creepy. I wonder if this was because she wrote them at a later date and had grown as an author.

Also, I really loved all of the Spanish anecdotes. I really love the Snobby Britishness of it, everyone is backwards and why can we just have a decent British road? I laughed the hardest when they replaced the British spy with the clay-pot man, and when the French general accidentally turned to apologize for it he fell apart. "Sorry Chap, I seem to have taken your arm off..."

Also I think we can be sure that because his father ate the book of magic he has somehow inherited all the knowledge a priori.

Also, I found Vinculus' Prophecy. I am putting it in spoiler brackets just in case we hadn't heard some of it yet. For some reason the beginning sounded unfamiliar, but I could just not be remembering properly.

(view spoiler)[
1 I reached out my hand; England's rivers turned and flowed the other way;
2 I reached out my hand; my enemies's blood stopt in their veins;
3 I reached out my hand; thought and memory flew out of my enemies' heads like a flock of starlings;
4 My enemies crumpled like empty sacks.
5 I came to them out of mists and rain;
6 I came to them in dreams at midnight;
7 I came to them in a flock of ravens that filled the northern sky at dawn;
8 When they thought themselves safe I came to them in a cry that broke the silence of a winter wood.
9 The rain made a door for me and I went through it;
10 The stones made a throne for me and I sat upon it;
11 Three kingdoms were given to me to be mine forever;
12 England was given to me to be mine forever.
13 The nameless slave wore a silver crown;
14 The nameless slave was a king in a strange country.
15 The weapons that my enemies raised against me are venerated in Hell as holy relics;
16 Plans that my enemies raised against me are preserved as holy texts;
17 Blood that I shed upon ancient battlefields is scraped from the stained earth by Hell's sacristans and placed in a vessel of silver and ivory.
18 I gave magic to England, a valuable inheritance
19 But Englishmen have despised my gift
20 Magic shall be written upon the sky by the rain but they shall not be able to read it;
21 Magic shall be written on the faces of the stony hills but their minds shall not be able to contain it;
22 In winter the barren trees shall be a black writing but they shall not understand it.
23 Two magicians shall appear in England.
24 The first shall fear me; the second shall long to behold me;
25 The first shall be governed by thieves and murderers; the second shall conspire at his
own destruction;
26 The first shall bury his heart in a dark wood beneath the snow, yet still feel its ache;
27 The second shall see his dearest possession in his enemy’s hand.
28 The first shall pass his life alone; he shall be his own gaoler;
29 The second shall tread lonely roads, the storm above his head, seeking a dark tower
upon a high hillside.
30 I sit upon a black throne in the shadows but they shall not see me.
31 The rain shall make a door for me and I shall pass through it;
32 The stones shall make a throne for me and I shall sit upon it.
33 The nameless slave shall wear a silver crown,
34 The nameless slave shall be a king in a strange country.

(hide spoiler)]

Becky wrote: "Also I think we can be sure that because his father ate the book of magic he has somehow inherited all the knowledge a priori.

Also, I found Vinculus' Prophecy. I am putting it in spoiler brackets..."

Are you talking about Vinculus here? His father Clegg ate the book of magic. I think it was Strange's father that frize to death trying to 'one up' a servant.

Yes sorry. Thats what I get for trying to type fast at work, I apparently forget proper nouns. I meant that since Clegg ate the book, all knowledge within it must have been passed to his child so that Vinculus retains the knowledge.

Becky wrote: "Yes sorry. Thats what I get for trying to type fast at work, I apparently forget proper nouns. I meant that since Clegg ate the book, all knowledge within it must have been passed to his child so ..."

I wanted to comment more, but was typing on my Nook, hence I meant 'freezes' not 'frize' and I agree Vinculus has knowledge from the book and he uses it or it's using him (???) to share the prophecy.

Great section and interesting discussions! I loved the way Strange 'helpeof' the military.

Just finished this section. I thought it was a drag to read to be honest. I liked the magic Strange employed (the clay pot man) and it's fun imagining all this happening to Wellington and co. I liked the no nonsense Wellington and I smiled when Strange was refused a baronetcy because the government couldn't being themselves to address Norrell as Sir or Lord. It was a relief to be back with Strange in London. I'd missed the creepy Thistledown character. However I felt for Strange at the end of this section, having to go back to Norrell.

Glynis wrote: "Just finished this section. I thought it was a drag to read to be honest. I liked the magic Strange employed (the clay pot man) and it's fun imagining all this happening to Wellington and co. I lik..."

It wasn't the most entertaining section for me either. I guess that is because of the descriptions necessary for the new landscape, the military stuff and so on. I also felt the chapters got a bit too long in this section.

I enjoyed the parts where Strange moved the river in the war and when he got drunk and swapped 2 churches around. I think the fairy uses humans for his own means and maybe looks at them as amusing pets.

I found this section to be long but very clever. I also thought that it was very interesting that Thistle Hair was around Strange and that the King could see Thistle Hair but that Strange could not.

Strange kept some important information from Norrell, too, in this section, which further supports Strange's belief that he was no longer a student and ready to go off on his own.

Okay, I'm working on catching up! I'll get there.

I'm liking Strange more and more as the book goes on. I found much of this section very amusing, especially the way Lord Wellington has come around to Jonathan Strange and is finding ways to use his talents, moving various geographical landmarks and such. Very clever!

I agree, Sera, I found it very interesting that the king could see the fairy but Strange couldn't. Though Strange obviously knew something magical was happening, he couldn't figure out what or how. And it's even more amusing that the fairy believes Strange went there just to thwart his plans for getting rid of the king!

Becky wrote: "Also I think we can be sure that because his father ate the book of magic he has somehow inherited all the knowledge a priori.

Also, I found Vinculus' Prophecy. I am putting it in spoiler brackets..."

The prophecy reminds me very much of prophecies in other works, like The Lord of the Rings... "Renewed shall be blade that was broken/The crownless again shall be king..." and all that. I think it's the poetry of it.