Happily Ever After Cafe discussion

Are their any Must-Haves in a heroine that you feel are necessary for you to love a book?



Mine include...
a strong woman (emotionally/not physically)
honesty
fidelity
open to communication/listens to hero
Does not have too many TSTL tendencies

All of the above plus passion and a sense of humor.

Oh, yes, passion and humor are definites!

In thinking on it, I feel that the humor element is more of a "depends on the book" sort of thing. While I love having a heroine with a sense of humor, I do feel that it depends on the storyline. If I'm reading a more serious, dark themed book and the story calls for a tortured, serious type heroine then humor would not work.

I think even if the storyline is kind of serious and dark themed, the tortured and other wise serious heroine can have her own humor, even if it is a sarcastic or ironic kind of humor. The atmosphere does not have to be destroyed because of some humor by the heroine.

I love sarcasm ☺ I think my own sense of humor runs more in the sarcastic range. Sadly, not many ppl get my humor.

She must be three-dimensional. First and foremost.

I have to respect her. Not necessarily agree with her choices, but at least respect her for who she is.

I honestly don't like promiscuous heroines. I am not saying she has to be a virgin, but please not completely loose. I don't mind if she has done things in the past she's not proud of, but I prefer she hadn't.

I can't give a long list because I don't want all the heroines to be the same. If she's well-written, I can get past some things. I just need to want to read about her and see her get her happy ending.

I agree about the humor, Pamela and Aengell! It has to fit the story/mood of the book. Some authors are much, much better at this than others, when dealing with a darker book.

Very true, Lady D. I don't want them to all be "cookie cutter images" of one another, but I'm finicky about my heroines' past. I've loosened up somewhat; there was a time (decades ago) when I would only read about virgins. LOL!

Same here, Lisa Kay. When I started reading romance, all the heroines were virgin, so it was odd at first to read ones where she wasn't.

Yes, it took a long time for me to accept that. Kind of funny to look at that now. LOL! I mean, I was living with a man (my future husband - I lived with him for eight years b/f I married him) at that time, so why did I have that double standard for my heroine? **shrugs** But I sure did!

I agree too. Not cookie cutter. I find I'm more tolerant with heroines than heroes, though. Not a lot bothers me unless she is a major whiney baby or doormat. Not fond of TSTL, of course but it's rarely a deal breaker. As stated before I Must-Have the fidelity and honesty element. Sometimes, the honesty element can be overlooked if there is a reason (i.e. a spy).

I think I am harder on heroines than heroes, Pamela. I guess I expect more from woman because I am one. :)

lol, I guess I often make the heroine who I want. I just don't always notice certain things some ppl point out in their reviews. I tune it out I guess. But when a woman gets whiney or really stupid then I get pretty disgusted.

I do that, too, Pamela. I know I adjust the heroine in the head somewhat. If she is too much of what I don't like, I usually put the book down and don't finish it. I hate that.

I also find my DNF's are usually because of the heroine. I prefer heroines who aren't "followers"... she needs to have an active part in the plot. I hate it if she's always getting bailed out by her friends/the hero.

Yes, I love it when the heroine rescues herself. Of course, the hero is in place getting ready to go in after his woman but.... hehe

gopinotes wrote: "I hate it if she's always getting bailed out by her friends/the hero."

Very true! Another thing I hate is when the author "uses" the heroine to further her plot by having her do something Too Stupid To Live. Like, she's told not to go somewhere after dark, alone, and weaponless - told it repeatedly b/c the bad guy is out of prison and gunning specifically for her. But, alas, she goes anyway and doesn't tell anyone. WTH?

Yeah, or goes to meet the slimeball alone and weaponless without telling anyone, 'cause its her problem and she doesn't want anyone else to get hurt.

Yeah, that too!

Pamela(AllHoney) wrote: "I love sarcasm ☺ I think my own sense of humor runs more in the sarcastic range. Sadly, not many ppl get my humor."

It's also hard to convey sarcasm in print. If anyone does this successfully, I would appreciate some tips!

Yeah, that is a hard one. I've read some where the person will state "Oh by the way, I was being sarcastic" and it didn't really work for me. I guess the best way would be to state in the description something like - He said it sarcastically.

I don't like heroines who are angry all the time, or decide all men are total slime buckets, and as a result are always sniping and carping at the hero. I understand that a heroine may have traumatic events in her past that obviously influence how she views men and relationships. But I think an author can create a heroine more nuanced and complex than "a man wronged me (or my sister, my mother, my best friend, my whole family) so I don't trust any of them and I hate them all."

I really can't stand it when, in some books, despite how sensitive, caring, and considerate a hero is, the heroine continues to dump on him because of her prior experiences. In some books, the heroine practically does this until the end, and stubbornly refuses to recognize that the hero is a decent guy. These days, if that sort of device goes on too long (and more than one chapter of that is too long for me), then the book is a DNF.

Gerrie wrote: "I really can't stand it when, in some books, despite how sensitive, caring, and considerate a hero is, the heroine continues to dump on him because of her prior experiences."

Too true! I understand how bad past experiences can bias the heroine, but it's a bit unbelievable if she continues to be blinded to a hero's good qualities despite overwhelming evidence.

Of course, I also don't really like it when she changes her mind too quickly just because the hero pays her a little compliment... so, I guess it's a delicate balance :P

Gerrie, I don't like those kinds of heroines either.

I'd rather see a jerky hero with a nice heroine, than the other way around.

Lady Danielle aka The Book Huntress wrote: "I'd rather see a jerky hero with a nice heroine, than the other way around."

Danielle, I feel exactly the same way.

Gopinotes, if the heroine changes her mind too quickly just because the H is nice to her, I agree that's equally bad writing. It's probably not an easy balance, but the really good writers seem to be able to carry it off. Usually….there was one Mary Balogh book (and I love Mary Balogh) where the heroine was really nasty and unpleasant. And the nicer the hero was to her, the worse she treated him. I would have never finished it, but it was the second book of a trilogy, sandwiched between two very good books. So even the best authors can't always maintain the balance.

Yes, those heroines can be annoying. I seem to like the nice compassionate heroines the best.

Pamela(AllHoney) wrote: "Yes, those heroines can be annoying. I seem to like the nice compassionate heroines the best."

Me too. The books I usually enjoy the most have that type of heroine.

Couldn't agree more, Gerrie!

I don't really have any "must-haves" in any characters, really. If the author is good enough, and can make it work, I can go with anything.

That's not to say there aren't traits I really like seeing in my heroines. I like heroines that are survivors, and who face adversity with courage. I think the only trait in a heroine that I simply CANNOT tolerate is when she's too materialistic. And I really hate when I can tell that an author has written a heroine who loves jewelry and shoes with the obvious intention to appeal to the readers who are like that, as well.

Love the survivors!!!

I get a bit frustrated with the authors that go on and on about designer clothes and shoes. I have been reading a bunch of Kristen Ashley and she goes a bit overboard in the description area. I've gotten to where I'll skim the decriptions and get back to the story.

Yes, KA does do that!

Seems like most of my favorite heroines are the ones that are a little bit quirky. The ones that don't really fit in any niche but are still good people. Either that or the ugly duckling that blooms later in the story and is finally appreciated for herself.

I don't mind having a strong heroine but I want my authors grasp the difference between having a strong personality and just being a bitch. I don't mind the occasional bitch but if she's a bitch just let her be one instead of passing her off as having a strong personality. There is a difference.

Pamela(AllHoney) wrote: "Love the survivors!!!

I get a bit frustrated with the authors that go on and on about designer clothes and shoes. I have been reading a bunch of Kristen Ashley and she goes a bit overboard in the ..."

Not my thing either.

I agree with you on both points, Melissa.

I love the quirky ones too.

Gerrie wrote: "Gerrie | 143 comments I don't like heroines who are angry all the time, or decide all men are total slime buckets, and as a result are always sniping and carping at the hero. I understand that a heroine may have traumatic events in her past that obviously influence how she views men and relationships. But I think an author can create a heroine more nuanced and complex than "a man wronged me (or my sister, my mother, my best friend, my whole family) so I don't trust any of them and I hate them all."

I really can't stand it when, in some books, despite how sensitive, caring, and considerate a hero is, the heroine continues to dump on him because of her prior experiences. In some books, the heroine practically does this until the end, and stubbornly refuses to recognize that the hero is a decent guy. These days, if that sort of device goes on too long (and more than one chapter of that is too long for me), then the book is a DNF"

OMg. That's me right there. That is something I absolutely CANNOT tolerate in a heroine. It just lacks growth and maturity IMO and I just struggle to sympathize with them. I really don't understand why authors do this.

My must-haves list in a heroine is pretty open. But this is the one Must-NOT-have in a heroine for me.

Yes, I like to see my heroine grow and mature. Of course, I like this in the hero, too!

Ooh just what i was looking for- doing research for my book :D for me they have to be strong (can stand up for themselves) and be funny x

lol. Feel free to start a thread here to help with research ☺

Waifs and Silly Heroines: Yes, No, or Maybe?

Check out my latest in a series of "Deal Breakers" in Historical Romance.

http://wp.me/s2z8mL-109

I'd love to know what you think!

Great blog. Yes, I agree with you. No on the silly and waif heroine. However, I never say never because some author out there could write one that appeals to me.

Loved your article, Susana.

You're right, Pamela. Some authors can manage it, but I'm one who chooses not to. . . right now, at least.

If a heroine is too much of a DID (damsel in distress) I'm pretty much done with the book. It's like nails on a chalkbaord for me. I end up nearly yelling "WILL YOU PLEASE BECOME A WOMAN AND NOT A 10 YEAR OLD CHILD!"

I guess to me, the women who constantly need saving with the big strong man creep me out. I can't get what the hero would see in a woman so helpless and frankly (when the DID archetype goes TOO far) useless. It doesn't seem like a partnership or a romance I can believe in. It seems like a guy with his pampered teenage daughter. And eeew.

I don't like jerky heroines either, but unlike most, I dislike jerky heros too. I only give so much leeway for tragic pasts. I guess I give characters enough rope to hang themselves with. There comes a point for both the hero and the heroine where I feel that their tragic past does not excuse mental, verbal or emotional abuse in the present. And I have found authors who don't seem to know where that line falls.

My standards for heroes and heroines are virtually the same as I'm pretty much an equality driven reader. One thing that some authors do with heroines that they rarely do with heroes that drives me NUTS is when the hero has a child from a previous relationship and the heroine is jealous of said child. That is an auto DNF. That's not fair and it's reprehensible behavior. I've tossed 3 books into the trashcan for that. And if I ever find a book that does it with a hero, into the trashcan that book will go too.

I do like to see a heroine who can take care of herself, but I don't mind a little rescuing, especially if she reciprocates. What I'm not too fond of is a heroine who is like a fully born Rambo-ette, straight from the womb. I like to see my heroine evolve; I want to see why and how she got to be so kick-ass.

Yeah, no manly women!

I like a heroine who evolves. I don't mind helpless or whiny or bitchy, but she better start seeing the error of her ways sooner than the last few chapters. I particularly like heroines who learn that they are much stronger, smarter, or wiser than they thought they were.

Hi! I'm new to the group, so I hope it's okay to post without having gone through a formal introduction first, but I couldn't resist this thread. I appreciate strong leading women, too. I think most books soar or crash and burn based upon whether their heroines are passive or dynamic characters. And by dynamic, I don't mean in-your-face or looking for a fight, just someone who takes action instead of waiting around and being acted upon by others; those passive kind of heroines are hard for me to root for. I also usually prefer heroines who are flawed but then struggle to overcome those flaws, because I think it's that struggle that shows the kind of character growth that keeps me turning pages. Sometimes I think authors can get nervous about making their heroine flawed because they're afraid it will make her unlikeable, and sometimes those same authors decide that they'll make the heroine likable by making her sweet and long-suffering, usually at the hands of a jerk of an ex. I find myself enjoying much more the kind of heroine who makes her own mistakes, learns from them, and moves on. Of course, one reason I probably appreciate dynamic heroines is because it's fun to live vicariously through them when in real life I would probably be too chicken to take some of the actions they're taking! :)

Great you jumped in, Christine, and welcome. Great points. Yes, I like a dynamic heroine, too. However, I must be honest; I definitely feel I forgive my heroines more than other people do, mainly because I am living vicariously through them. LOL!