Ancient & Medieval Historical Fiction discussion

Dawn mentioned the terrific idea to me of a mythology thread. She is definitely on to something. A mythology thread is sorely misssing from the group. We have always directed mythology books out of the hf threads and into the historical fantasy thread. We decided that a lot of mythology is getting lost in the fantasy thread. So here it is now. A new thread for mythology.

Be warned readers! The books in this thread can be mythology in the historical fiction sense, where there is nothing supernatural or unexplanable eg Enemy of God by Bernard Cornwell, or it can be mythology in a historical fantasy sense. Where Merlin has magic and witches have power, or Gods walk and talk.

I thought to myself "Self, why not kick this thread off with not only some King Arthur, but some Bernard Cornwell King Arthur"
So here I go. Tally ho. (The Winter King is the first book in the series)

I also see these cool looking books by M.K. Hume around a lot too. (Not sure what order these two series' go in)
A series on King Arthur


And a series by the same author on Merlin.

There is a series by Jack Whyte which I think is also supposed to be Arthur...not in order...

Would also fall into this category with the parts about Asgaard.

Terri wrote: "There is a series by Jack Whyte which I think is also supposed to be Arthur...not in order...
..."
I read the first two in this series but went no further. Too much violent and graphic sex for my taste.

Terri wrote: "There is a series by Jack Whyte which I think is also supposed to be Arthur...not in order...
..."

I love the Jack Whyte series. I flew through all the books. At times it was graphic but nowhere near what George R.R. Martin's books. Jack has a real knack for portraying post-Roman Britain.

Terri wrote: "Dawn mentioned the terrific idea to me of a mythology thread. She is definitely on to something. A mythology thread is sorely misssing from the group. We have always directed mythology books out of..."

By the way, great idea for a thread, Terri! I've mentioned it before elsewhere but I will again here: Glyn Ilyff's Trojan War series is brilliant historical fantasy. He has a real feel for the ancient landscape and his characters' awe of the wonders of their own world is also fun to read. King of Ithaca

We're including anything that includes myth and/or legends of our history in our world.
For the record, not other worlds history or made up mythology or legends. That is for the historical fantasy thread.

William, I have moved your post to the Historical Fantasy thread.

http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/7...

What is 8kya?

Some more for this thread.



And

Terri wrote: "What is 8kya?"

Eight thousand years ago, I would suspect.

8 K (for 'thousand') Years Ago.

I hope someone will tell me if I'm wrong. Cryptography is not my forte, though I can speak Pig Latin and Gibberish.

Ah, so now your original question has me even more befuddled.
Yes a fiction set 8000 years ago can be historical fiction. It certainly wouldn't be fantasy unless it included fantastical elements (supernatural, preternatural, alternate universe, more modern history mixed in with the 8000 year old storyline like swords and lasers etc).

But this is the Myth and Legend thread. So that's why you have me even more confused.

To be Myth or Mythology or Legend it has to be Myth or Mythology or Legend known to our people...humans...and our known history.
Icelandic sagas, Robin Hood, Loch Ness Monster, Bunyips, King Arthur. Things such as those.

I think you have the new thread mixed up with the existing historical fantasy thread.

This is the thread you are after Chris. You may be better asking the readers of that thread your questions as they are more experts in what constitutes speculative worlds and fantasy.
http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/7...

ha. That's alright. I am well adapted to you popping up in all sorts of threads. :)

At least in the historical fantasy thread you can chew the fat on what makes a novel more historical fantasy than historical fiction when making up new cultures.

Fellow member of this group Adam, is making his book available for free download for a limited time.
Here is the details as compiled by Adam in another thread.

The Games of Apollo Promotion

To mark the occasion of the ancient Roman Ludi Apollinares, the Games of Apollo, Children of Apollo, Book I of the Eagles and Dragons series, will be available for FREE download on Amazon this weekend, July 7th and 8th.

If you want to pick up a good summer vacation read and be transported back to the Roman Empire, this is your chance. In return, be sure to leave a review on Amazon!

While you are on-line, visit www.writingthepastblog.blogspot.com to read the next instalment of The World of Children of Apollo (Part VI) which will visit the ancient oracle of the Cumaean Sibyl.

Thanks for tip about the Apollo book

Only one more day to grab it. :-)

I like the sound of this mythological fantasy series. My library has it marked as adult fiction.

Not sure if this is the correct thread, but reading through the comments I see there was some discussion about Arthurian tales here. Looking through my bookshelf I came across a story I read 10-12 years ago. Not sure how easy it is to find these days, but it was well written so if you enjoy this period it might be a worthwhile read. Blessed Bastard: A Novel Of Sir Galahad

Thanks, Monica. Not easy to get, by the looks, but at least the title will stick in my head.

On little-known but worthwhile Arthurians, I'll add Life of Aglovale de Galis which is a cult hit in my family. By the sister of the poet A.E. Housman. And since I like my cover:

Bryn wrote: "Thanks, Monica. Not easy to get, by the looks, but at least the title will stick in my head.

On little-known but worthwhile Arthurians, I'll add Life of Aglovale de Galis which is a cult hit in m..."

Bryn, thanks for that title as well. I see Amazon has it. I'll look for around for it in the library.

Monica wrote: "Not sure if this is the correct thread, but reading through the comments I see there was some discussion about Arthurian tales here. Looking through my bookshelf I came across a story I read 10-12 ..."

ha! that sure is a memorable title. ;)

You found the right thread. This thread is one where historical fantasy type Myth and legend can meet reality myth and legend.

Terri wrote:"ha! that sure is a memorable title"

Yep, Terri...great title...it's why I picked up the book in the first place.

I just finished the second in this series:

They're both really good...the second is very action-packed!

About the mythic Theseus king of Athens and slayer of the Minotaur. Written in Theseus' first person perspective, written alike journals of a biography.

Terri wrote: "I like the sound of this mythological fantasy series. My library has it marked as adult fiction.
"

Oh it is adult, very much so:) But this is no my mythology in historical fiction sense. Its pure fantasy...about werewolves. But I do recommend it, its very good.

HI Kris.
since I posted that I have read the first on, Wolfsangel.
I enjoyed it. Wasn't the greatest thing I have ever read, but I liked the Viking setting and that helped me enjoy it.

Here is an interesting article for fans of ancient myth..

Scientists reportedly discover gate to hell

It sounds like something out of a horror movie. But Italian scientists say that the “Gate to Hell” is the real deal—poisonous vapors and all.

The announcement of the finding of the ruins of Pluto’s Gate (Plutonium in Latin) at an archeology conference in Turkey last month, was recently reported by Discovery News. Francesco D'Andria, professor of classic archaeology at the University of Salento in Lecce, Italy, who has been excavating the ancient Greco-Roman World Heritage Site of Hierapolis for years, led the research team.

D’Andria told Discovery News he used ancient mythology as his guide to locate the legendary portal to the underworld. “We found the Plutonium by reconstructing the route of a thermal spring. Indeed, Pamukkale' springs, which produce the famous white travertine terraces originate from this cave.”

Scribes like Cicero and the Greek geographer Strabo mentioned the gate to hell as located at the ancient site in Turkey, noted Discovery, but nobody had been able to find it until now.

Read the full article here:

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/...

I saw this one the other week. thought it was quite interesting.

Interesting stuff. Pamukkale is one of the places we didn't get to when we visited Turkey in 1988, before some of you were born, and I would love to see it at some stage. On a lighter note on the same trip we did find a long-drop dunny (toilet for those not from Australasia) in the middle of nowhere that certainly smelt like the gates of hell!

It's alright Chris. I was already born by 88. :)
In fact I believe that was the year of the 88 Olympics in Seoul.

Monica wrote: "Here is an interesting article for fans of ancient myth..

Scientists reportedly discover gate to hell

It sounds like something out of a horror movie. But Italian scientists say that the “Gate to ..."
I saw a post by an historian about this archaeological site--really interesting. There are many "gates to the underworld" in the ancient world. For Hittites, springs in caves indicated an access to the infernal gods. So interesting a notion!

Marina wrote: "One of my favourite books, , a realistic take on the siege of Troy."

I love McCullough Colleen's Roman books, but I'm less enamored of this Troy one. She includes an encyclopedic number of myths related to Troy but she strips out the mythic from them. It sometimes feels as if she's trying to turn myths into history, but I guess I'm content to leave them myths. She's a superb writer, though--just this particular book doesn't suit my tastes.

Hello everyone,
I'm new (today!) to this group and really looking forward to hearing other people's views. I like Judith Starkston's comment about Colleen McCullough. Her Roman books were an education for me,and highly addictive. Ms McCullough seems to be able to write a dense, factually accurate novel and make the era come alive at the same time. It's very hard to do!
Judith Schara

Judith wrote: "Hello everyone,
I'm new (today!) to this group and really looking forward to hearing other people's views. I like Judith Starkston's comment about Colleen McCullough. Her Roman books were an educa..."

I loved her Roman books, too. At least the first 5 or 6 of them. Things started getting a little to stretched out after a while.

I love grail quest books. I tried by Kate Mosse not long ago. Though the novel was fine (set in the early 1200's, where we see the onset of the Albigensian Crusade), her treatment of the grail itself was supremely disappointing. I don't mind a retelling or a new spin, but this one diluted the grail to tepid water (or, tepid Sang Real, if you fell for The Da Vinci Code...)

Justin wrote: "I love grail quest books. I tried by Kate Mosse not long ago. Though the novel was fine (set in the early 1200's, where we see the onset of the Albigensian Crusade), her..."

SPAM ALERT: This might constitute spam. If so, sorry about that.

In that case I'd be interested in what you think of
Lions of the Grail by (ahem) some Irish bloke.

Ha! I had already added your book to my Amazon wishlist just this morning after perusing your profile. I hope to get to it soon.

Tim wrote: " Lions of the Grail by (ahem) some Irish bloke. ..."

Lol. Hmm....would that be some Irish bloke with tattoo envy? Is that the guy?

Eileen wrote: "Judith wrote: "Hello everyone,
I'm new (today!) to this group and really looking forward to hearing other people's views. I like Judith Starkston's comment about Colleen McCullough. Her Roman book..."

Hi everyone, I'm Liza, and new to this group too. As a fellow Aussie, and fan of hers, I tried, really tried to read Colleen McCullough's Rome series, but just got bogged down.

Justin wrote: "I love grail quest books. I tried by Kate Mosse not long ago. Though the novel was fine (set in the early 1200's, where we see the onset of the Albigensian Crusade), her..."

I totally agree, Justin... couldn't get into this one either, as Da Vinci Code.

Hi Liza,
I also am an Aussie. Nice to meet you. :-)

I haven't tried the Rome books by CM. The First Man in Rome
They have always looked too emotional relationship driven to me. The Roman 'Days of Our Lives'.

Liza wrote: "

Yeah, I really wanted to get into it, but didn't bother with the sequel.

Terri wrote: "Hi Liza,
I also am an Aussie. Nice to meet you. :-)

I haven't tried the Rome books by CM. The First Man in Rome
They have always looked too emotional relationship driven to me. The Roman 'Days o..."

He Terri, fellow Aussie... unfortunately I don't live there any more, but really miss those lovely beaches!

I just looked at your profile. A Wollongong girl I see.
I am a Queenslander. South east, not too far from Noosa, so I too am familiar with the beautiful beaches. :-)

Terri wrote: "I just looked at your profile. A Wollongong girl I see.
I am a Queenslander. South east, not too far from Noosa, so I too am familiar with the beautiful beaches. :-)"

ooh yes, lovely place, Terri!

I have only been to Sydney, and then only on business - but very beautiful! I'd love to see more of Australia. On the Arthurian topic, I just re-read Bernard Cornwell's The Winter King. It reminded me why I adore Cornwell's stories and why I think his portrayal of the Arthurian legend might be the very best there is. I love all of his work, but I think this might be my favorite. (That said, I'm in the middle of 1356 and think it's superb!)

I would have to agree with you on that trilogy. While I didn't like one of them much and while I have not read everything there is on Arthur, I think people would struggle to find such a realistic Arthur tale. Arthur as a realistic figure in a realistic and historically accurate environment surrounded by realsitic cultures and people.