Kara > Status Update

I hate when that happens. Some people don't want to discourage book sales and attack honest reviewers for putting the real, useful information a reader needs to make informed decisions before buying a book. These "people" should troll the authors instead of the reviewers. Don't want to have a drop of book sales? How about the authors stop writing about pedophilia, rape, cheating, porn for children like Sarah J maas, bad edited books, and a long etc, instead of rallying the fans and GR employees against reviewers? Don't blame my review, blame the authors!

Too right, V. Authors who are confident in their abilities have no need to send their minions out to attack reviewers. If you write something objectionable, at least have the guts to stand by it and not hide behind sock puppets and sycophants. There are a lot of themes and tropes that I despise and I wish wouldn’t be written, but I know censorship is a slippery slope so I don’t advocate for that. However... I do think authors have a responsibility to accurately label their books so that the wrong impression isn’t given. Like Nabokov wouldn’t have labeled “Lolita” as a romance, because it isn’t. But I’ve recently seen a series with an older teacher and his young student (15 years old) labeled as romance. No. That’s a pedophile grooming his victim. But it’s gotten so many five-star reviews! And there is another series where one of the heroes participates in the gang-rape of the heroine’s friend. Look, I don’t want to police other people’s reading habits, but I do think it’s irresponsible to encourage sexual assault and pedophilia and claim it’s romance. And I’m sick of authors claiming that their work is romantic fiction when it’s clearly not, then sending out their drones to attack when someone disagrees with their subject matter.

Do you know of a reading site like goodreads that is just for readers? I'm tired that GR is so booksales-oriented. I miss when this was a site for readers. Now it's a site to promote books.

Kara wrote: "Too right, V. Authors who are confident in their abilities have no need to send their minions out to attack reviewers. If you write something objectionable, at least have the guts to stand by it and not hide behind sock puppets and sycophants. There are a lot of themes and tropes that I despise and I wish wouldn’t be written, but I know censorship is a slippery slope so I don’t advocate for that. However... I do think authors have a responsibility to accurately label their books so that the wrong impression isn’t given. Like Nabokov wouldn’t have labeled “Lolita” as a romance, because it isn’t. But I’ve recently seen a series with an older teacher and his young student (15 years old) labeled as romance. No. That’s a pedophile grooming his victim. But it’s gotten so many five-star reviews! And there is another series where one of the heroes participates in the gang-rape of the heroine’s friend. Look, I don’t want to police other people’s reading habits, but I do think it’s irresponsible to encourage sexual assault and pedophilia and claim it’s romance. And I’m sick of authors claiming that their work is romantic fiction when it’s clearly not, then sending out their drones to attack when someone disagrees with their subject matter. "

*claps* I'm just repeating your comment so it appears in my newsfeed. Hopefully. You know GR employees censor my updates and reviews.

I wish I did, V, because I would totally be there. I’m sick of this site and Amazon being vehicles to drive book sales. It’s bullshit, honestly, and I’m disappointed in Goodreads for becoming part of the machine that promotes authors who don’t know the difference between “their”, “they’re”, and “there”.

Totally agree! The trolls are definitely out of control- commenting on reviews where the reader complained about the hero having detailed sex with OW. The trolls had the nerve to say she couldn’t complain about it because she dnf’d and also complained about her quoting the scene. So crazy! Every reader has the right to dnf when a character does something that ruins the book. As a reader that hates sex scenes of hero and OW I really appreciate that info so the book can be avoided. Isn’t that why Goodreads is here? To help us find books we can enjoy and like minded people to discuss books with!

It’s gotten ridiculous, Cyndi. This site is supposed to be a place for honest reviews and unbiased information, and it’s just turning into a big old pr machine. Pathetic.

And they were threatening readers too with 15 years imprisonments because of quotes from books. That’s getting ridiculous. I mean, we can read whatever we want. Sometimes you don’t get a lot of reviews with info about a book that looks interesting in the blurb. You end up reading and faces a trigger. Of course I’ll rate it and write a review. This one person said we have no right to write a review about a book we dnf. Just delusional. And desperate

Count me among those who are fed up with these fan girl trolls. It's getting worse indeed. Two factors that I strongly suspect are a big reason---1. Amazon has done several review and account purges in the last year or so in an attempt to cut down on the fake fangirl reviews after complaints of unreliability. In the blogger groups they were panicking because many had their reviews deleted and some had their accounts suspended. And so the great migration over to GR began. And then the shouldn't-be-in-this-business type of authors and their fans started trying to corrupt and tamper with GR reviews. 2. I suspect their increased activity is also a result of desperation. They're driving readers away and it becomes a vicious cycle. Instead of spending more time on improving their writing, identifying their audience, and doing marketing that isn't shady, they are putting all their efforts into harassing and bullying honest reviewers.

Rejane wrote: "And they were threatening readers too with 15 years imprisonments because of quotes from books. That’s getting ridiculous. I mean, we can read whatever we want. Sometimes you don’t get a lot of rev..."

I'm grateful when my friends expose possible triggers, and I'm beyond irritated with these people who pop up in reviews just to argue. People like different things. I certainly don't stalk people who negatively review books I like just so I can shit-talk them. When has that ever changed anyone's mind? All it does is stir a shitstorm.

Book-Bosomed wrote: "Count me among those who are fed up with these fan girl trolls. It's getting worse indeed. Two factors that I strongly suspect are a big reason---1. Amazon has done several review and account purge..."

Exactly, BB. And it only makes the authors look bad to discerning readers! Any time I hear of an author who riles up her fans about negative reviews or talks bad about someone who gave them a bad review on social media, that author goes on my list of untrustworthy authors. Because you don't have the right to bash people who don't like what you have to say. And the proliferation of troll accounts and the abuse I've seen from friends of authors is going to push ethical readers away from those authors and this site.

Kara wrote: "Exactly, BB. And it only makes the authors look bad to discerning readers! Any time I hear of an author who riles up her fans about negative reviews or talks bad about them on social media, that author goes on my list of untrustworthy authors. Because you don't have the right to bash people who don't like what you have to say. And the proliferation of troll accounts and the abuse I've seen from friends of authors is going to push ethical readers away from those authors and this site. "
Me too Kara! A book with issues, I'll just pass on that book. A book with fangirl trolls and an author who either doesn't reign them in or worse yet panders to them, then I'll avoid anything ever written by that person. No author who is serious about their work would want to be associated w/fans like that nor would they want feedback silenced. There's plenty of books out there so no need to read and support the ones that indulge in review tampering and bullying.

Book-Bosomed wrote: "Kara wrote: "Exactly, BB. And it only makes the authors look bad to discerning readers! Any time I hear of an author who riles up her fans about negative reviews or talks bad about them on social m..."

Completely agree. I understand that authors work hard on their books, but it doesn't follow that they should automatically be praised and rewarded with five-star reviews when a book is a one- or two-star read. Some people just don't have what it takes, either talent-wise or the ability to say "eff the haters" and write what you want. People who are too thin-skinned to accept criticism aren't suited to put out a product that will be reviewed and critiqued by the masses. Art is meant for public consumption, and some authors just straight-up aren't good enough, so they launch their drones to attack reviewers - which will turn off readers faster than a negative review.

Exactly. It seems too many are forgetting that books like paintings and music are part of the Arts. Critique/feedback is central to it all. People are losing sight of that. The indie PR companies in romance are partially to blame too. Many of them cross ethical lines when distributing review copies w/conditions and stipulations. There's been too much reviewer brainwashing, trying to push a narrative and agenda where reviews can only be positive. As a result, you get too many unreliable reviews that read like promotional pieces written by a publicist, not written by a independent unbiased reader analyzing the book. All of this is coming together and creating the situations we're starting to see daily. It's a shame.

That's a good point about indie PR companies - especially when they stipulate that a review has to be at least four stars for an ARC, or the reviewer won't be given more ARCs. I hate to be a snob, but a decent percentage of indie authors are just not good writers, and it's really diminishing the reputation of indie authors overall. And asking reviewers to basically lie to readers with their reviews is so unethical it makes my blood boil. I feel like this is on the same wavelength as the payola scandal with American DJs and record companies of the '60s. It really should be looked into.

I agree. There's a clear violation of federal guidelines when the author pays a PR company to hand out the ARCs and then they put all kinds of rating/review conditions on them. They are essentially paying for positive reviews. At one time I saw a version of Amazon's guidelines (which I'm not sure are the most current or not because they've updated them a lot lately and sometimes they are vague), that excluded ARCs received through any kind of promotional tour/release blitz. So if that's the case, they know it's a problem. But then the PR companies and bloggers who cater to them try to find ways around it. I remember one discussion in a blogger group some time back where there was a clip from one of the morning shows interviewing someone from Amazon who mentioned something about the reviews in the first day or so being monitored more closely for legitimacy (ya know since those were more likely to be ARCs). And then all these bloggers were plotting how to just work around that. Like they didn't get what the real problem is. Their first thought was just how to beat the system and corrupt it more.

That's why I rarely trust any reviews that aren't from my safety friends! It's all so damn shady.

Kara wrote: "That's why I rarely trust any reviews that aren't from my safety friends! It's all so damn shady."
Yep, same here. Unfortunately there's just too many reviews that aren't trustworthy. The 5 stars that wax poetic about the author's writing, using her first name over and over, are a big red flag. I look for reviews that actually talk about the book and tell me things that are useful.

It’s gotten to the point that I just skip over a book of one of my friends hasn’t already read it, because regret it when I don’t. No just tropes and triggers, but also just really, really bad writing.

I think it’s important to make honest reviews. Especially if people are paying for books. I like to read the good and the bad reviews and they don’t always deter me from going ahead and reading and making my own mind up. But there had to be some intelligent discussion around reviews. People can’t just decide to troll others because they don’t share the same view. Such an odd approach to something that is technically a very personal experience.

Tia wrote: "People can’t just decide to troll others because they don’t share the same view. Such an odd approach to something that is technically a very personal experience."

That's exactly it, Tia. Reading is a very personal experience. I get very invested in what I read. So something that I find problematic like cheating, regardless of what someone else's definition of "cheating" actually is, is very difficult to read, and I prefer to avoid those. Other peoples' honest reviews help me to avoid those books. And if other people don't feel that way, that's totally, 100% fine. I would never deliberately read a book that I know will have triggers and then go trash that book. Neither would I go to someone else's review and trash them for liking it. It's just so confusing to me. Most readers just want an honest opinion, not someone telling them how to feel or lying about how good a book is just to boost sales.

Book-Bosomed wrote: "The indie PR companies in romance are partially to blame too. Many of them cross ethical lines when distributing review copies w/conditions and stipulations. There's been too much reviewer brainwashing, trying to push a narrative and agenda where reviews can only be positive. As a result, you get too many unreliable reviews that read like promotional pieces written by a publicist, not written by a independent unbiased reader analyzing the book. All of this is coming together and creating the situations we're starting to see daily. It's a shame. "

It's not only indies PR teams, it's also the biggest longtime-established publishing companies. In fact, that kind of unethical behaviour is more frequent with new releases in the YA and Romance new releases of the traditional publishers mainly because they HAVE A BIGGER BUDGET to pay Booktubers, Book bloggers and websites like Common sense media. Why do you think I've been attacked so many times for calling out Goodreads employees and Maas fans? No indie author could get away with forcing fifty shades of gray sex scenes like this one;





into the 11-13 YO recommendations in Audible.



That kind of trick can only come from the "respectable" established publishers. The ones many Goodreads reviewers want to work for.

Also many book bloggers, plenty of goodreads top reviewers/best reviewers (per goodreads ranks) and a lot of booktubers want to be writers. They might not be after free copies of books but they want to "support" book sales and are afraid of any kind of feedback that don't favor book sales.
I don't care if an author is indie or traditional published. I don't care if an author/imprint gets sales or not. All I care about is content and unfortunately authors and publishers are forgetting that the best way to get sales is creating quality content. Do authors want to get sales? How about they stop writing about cheating, rape, pedophilia and then trying to make it pass as "acceptable" behaviour? Or how about stop writing erotic content in a book for children?

♣Shame on all Sarah J. Maas Sales team and associate reviewers. They're contributing to deceiving readers, and porn being sold to children and placed in bookstores next to real YA books like Harry Potter
♣Shame on any wanna-be-writer who writes dishonest review to get the goodwill of publishers. I hope your book doesn't sell a single copy.
♣Shame on anyone who attacks the review of an honest reviewer who doesn't have sales in mind. Just because they're dishonest they expect everyone of us will be dishonest.

Sorry for the long rant. I copied and paste your comment hoping it'll appear in my newsfeed because my reviews and posts that don't favor book sales such as my review of the proposition by kirstie alley, Tower of dawn, A court of Thorns and Roses, A Court of Wing and Ruin by Sarah J. Mass have been suppressed and hidden from the main page of reviews. More recently a positive review I wrote for Laura Thalassa's Rhapsodic (someone who is direct competition for Maas book sales) was censored while I was writing it. I can't miss an oportunity to discuss this with my friends as I'm unable to do it with the majority of Goodreads members due to the intervention of Goodreads employees.

I wonder if it’s partly a result of kids being told they’re awesome their whole lives and therefore can’t handle it when someone doesn’t think they are.

Also, I get suspicious if there are zero negative reviews. I feel safer about getting a book when there’s a healthy mix of positive and negative.

V. PARENTAL GUIDANCE: A Court of Wings and Ruin is NEW ADULT/EROTICA but Goodreads editors won't tell you wrote: "Book-Bosomed wrote: "The indie PR companies in romance are partially to blame too. Many of them cross ethical lines when distributing review copies w/conditions and stipulations. There's been too m..."

Yeah, I read some dicey shit when I was that age, but it was stuff I snuck out of my mom's closet and read under the covers at night with a flashlight. It seems like back when I was that age, the raciest stuff you could get was Judy Blume, and that wasn't even graphic, just talked about stuff no one else had written about before. I remember when my daughter was around ten and bought the first TTYL book, which is supposed to be YA but had a lot of swearing and sexual references. I was shocked that a book that talked about squirting was recommended for that young of an age group. I'm not into censorship at all, but I do think publishers should appropriately market their books. Pushing sexual content on to children who aren't ready for it yet just so you can make money is so cynical and wrong.

Audrey wrote: "I wonder if it’s partly a result of kids being told they’re awesome their whole lives and therefore can’t handle it when someone doesn’t think they are.

Also, I get suspicious if there are zero ne..."

I agree about the zero-negative-reviews, Audrey. That just screams planted/paid-for reviews to me.

V. PARENTAL GUIDANCE: A Court of Wings and Ruin is NEW ADULT/EROTICA but Goodreads editors won't tell you wrote: "It's not only indies PR teams, it's also the biggest longtime-established publishing companies. In fact, that kind of unethical behaviour is more frequent with new releases in the YA and Romance new releases of the traditional publishers mainly because they HAVE A BIGGER BUDGET to pay Booktubers, Book bloggers and websites like Common sense media. Why do you think I've been attacked so many times for calling out Goodreads employees and Maas fans? No indie author could get away with forcing fifty shades of gray sex scenes like this one;."
Maybe the romance genre in general lacks some scruples. It certainly sounds like it. I still wouldn't call those publishers who antics you mentioned respectable either though, established sure, but clearly they lack ethics as well. When I worked in publishing, which to be fair was a completely different genre, we were always taught to stay out of reviews. We distributed the review copies and that was the end of story, no conditions placed on them. On the rare instance where an author was upset about a review and wanted to comment publicly on it, the VP gave a strong 'don't do it.' They were always told to learn from the reviews if there was valid feedback to gleam from it. But I get that that's not happening everywhere based off all the corruption that goes around. It seems like there's a new scandal or drama every week. (Like last week Twitter was blowing up with the ghost writing/plagiarism expose.) And it's ironic really because I suspect that that stuff (review tampering, bullying, trademark trolling, plagiarism, ghost writing, trend manufacturing, etc.) is hurting their book sales far more than any low star or scathing review. It's like a vicious cycle; the more corruption and scandal, the more readers get turned off and the more desperate they become for sales. Not to mention that the romance market is flooded with so much of the same old/same old.

And I agree, Audrey and Kara, a lack of low stars is suspicious. If a book has 50-100+ reviews and they are all 4 and 5 stars, a red flag goes up to me. Readers who aren't affiliated with the author/publisher/PR co don't want to read that many fan reviews. We want to know what uncompromised readers thought of it.